Chlamydia pneumoniae links

A forum for the discussion of antibiotics as a potential therapy for MS

Chlamydia pneumoniae links

Postby Anecdote » Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:09 pm

An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Postby Anecdote » Thu Feb 23, 2006 10:02 am

And a very useful new link on the CPn Help site is this, the new handbook:

http://www.CPn Help.org/?q=cpnbook

All the information in one place.

Sarah
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Postby Anecdote » Tue Mar 07, 2006 6:11 am

Um, accidentally submitted twice again, just to amuse Cureo!
Last edited by Anecdote on Tue Mar 07, 2006 6:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Postby Anecdote » Tue Mar 07, 2006 6:12 am

Now here is an excellent piece put togrther by Marie (mrhodes40). She is in the process of collating all the currently available information regarding the idea that MS may be caused by the pathogen chlamydia pneumoniae.

http://www.CPn Help.org/?q=multiple_sclerosis_and_th

Multiple sclerosis is a disease of the central nervous system thought by most to be autoimmune because it is clear that the nervous tissue is being damaged and that also the immune system is present at the actual lesion location. Efforts to find a germ that the immune system is attacking have fallen flat with conflicting and inconclusive results. We propose here that MSi may be caused by chlamydia pneumoniae (CPn). In this book page I will outline the various findings in research on MS and also findings on CPn highlighting similarities................
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Postby MacKintosh » Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:33 pm

All excellent resources! Thanks, Sarah, for posting them all here!
The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems. Mohandas Gandhi
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Re: Chlamydia pneumoniae links

Postby notasperfectasyou » Mon May 21, 2007 11:46 am



This is interesting. Who is David Wheldon and if he is a doc, what kind of doc is he? napay
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Postby MacKintosh » Mon May 21, 2007 1:33 pm

David Wheldon is a microbiologist in England. He treated his wife, Sarah, who posts here as Anecdote, for aggressive MS a few years ago. He basically refined the Vanderbilt University protocol set forth by Sriram and Stratton and saved her life. Her EDSS has reversed itself from around eight to less than two.

By the way, he also saved me and dozens of others. We generally hang out at CPn Help dot org
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Postby Anecdote » Tue May 22, 2007 5:07 am

Yes, David Wheldon is a hospital doctor, specializing in microbiology although he has also studied neuro-pathology, which included examining lesions of people with MS during autopsies. He moved into microbiology because there seemed so much more you could do in that speciality to get people better, never dreaming that he would be led back into the original preference because he married someone with MS whose disease suddenly turned drastically worse. A few days research and he unearthed the research going on at Vanderbilt University by Charles Stratton, another microbiologist, and Ram Sriram, a neurologist. He now writs papers with Charles Stratton.

Mac, thanks for noticing this, but I never had an EDSS of eight, though, seven was bad enough 8O
Sarah
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Postby MacKintosh » Tue May 22, 2007 6:32 am

Mea culpa! I was going by memory and that was what stuck in my mind. Perhaps it was Rica's edss. I would simply edit it, but then no one would know what you and I are now talking about, so I'll leave the original. :wink:

Your avatar is lovely. I should find one for myself...
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Postby notasperfectasyou » Tue May 22, 2007 6:49 am

Thank you.

I honestly have not had time to go back and read all the old posts on these topics - but I have read enough to be ...... wondering. I also don't like reading lots of old threads because the new stuff is so much more current - duh.

I get the impression that David has had some success with this and great success with Sarah. The difficulty I have with all this is not the lack of a large scale trial (see my thoughs on Vitamin C and Curcumin), but rather I want to:

1) understand the method of operation for the therapy
2) Understand the ways the therapy is consistent and inconsistant with existing knowledge of MS

I'd like to know more about how this concept segregates between cause and effect. I get the impression that this is mostly about cause, but it sounds like it's being exrapolated into a therapy for the effect. I'm a sceptic by nature, I'm in no way challenging the work of anyone. I like long detailed explanations and I prefer confirmation to common sense.

napay
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Postby MacKintosh » Tue May 22, 2007 7:30 am

Totally disagree there. This is ALL about treating the cause, as opposed to the CRAB drugs treating the effect. As far as comparing it to what is KNOWN about MS, I would say what is BELIEVED about MS. Little is truly known about it, yet the chlamydia pneumoniae theory holds up extremely well when examined.

As far as the old threads being unimportant, I must also disagree. The science of the discovery of and the manner of killing off chlamydia pneumoniae bacteria infection have not changed. The science is pretty straightforward. A bacteria gets in, it behaves in a 'stealth' manner and is pretty much undetectable by routine testing, it alters cell behaviors and keeps the immune system from doing its proper job.

In different people, it manifests differently. Sometimes it gets into the brain and becomes MS, sometimes the joints and becomes rheumatoid arthritis, sometimes chronic fatigue syndrome, high blood pressure, etc.

If you truly want the whole picture, head over to CPn Help dot org. The site is devoted not to MS, but to chlamydia pneumoniae and all the diseases it causes. A bunch of MSers are there and will answer your questions once you have read our detailed handbook which sets forth all the details of the science, the logic, the treatment, etc., that you could wish for.
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Postby Anecdote » Tue May 22, 2007 8:40 am

Or alternatively, email David or phone Charles Stratton at Vanderbilt.

Also read the abstract I gave you in another thread in this forum and buy access to the paper when it comes out: that will be the first time that the method has been thoroughly explaained in the mainstream medical press and should answer these questions of yours:

1) understand the method of operation for the therapy
2) Understand the ways the therapy is consistent and inconsistant with existing knowledge of MS


If I had waited for all the long term medical trials I wouldn't be here writing this now. Many other people, like Mackintosh above, prefer to take something which is effectively harmless and then get on with their lives.

Sarah
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Postby robbie » Tue May 22, 2007 8:40 am

If this is true then all the other research and drugs are just a mistake. All the people that are trying these drugs must really wonder if they are doing the right thing. For someone just starting out they have the neurologist telling them one thing and then in the back of their mind they are thinking could one of these alternative therapies be the answer. You just want to believe in something but what. For me it doesn’t really matter I am done with drugs but I really like to read and see where this is all going, This web-site will be even better in the future. I hope some of the same people that we have all gotten to know are still here so we can really see the results of all this stuff. I am not saying one way or another whats right and whats wrong but this is huge if it turns out that abx is the the right path. We are in two different spectrums of treatment here, antiabiotics vs major immune system altering medication
In different people, it manifests differently. Sometimes it gets into the brain and becomes MS, sometimes the joints and becomes rheumatoid arthritis, sometimes chronic fatigue syndrome, high blood pressure, etc.

Had ms for over 19 years now.
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Postby Anecdote » Tue May 22, 2007 8:49 am

Robbie, this is going to be as big a change in the status quo as when Marshall and Warren proved that stomach ulcers were caused by helico bacter pylori:

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=000BA394-9CFF-1341-9CB683414B7F4945

Sarah
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Postby tory2457 » Tue May 22, 2007 8:55 am

Hi notasperfectasyou,

Being a skeptic is what best describes me too.

I think MacIntosh offered good advice. Personally, I scoured the Cpn site and read all I could. (along with the folks posting their experiences using the protocol.)

I then started taking NAC, and lo and behold, I became stuffy and nasally..then came an emergency root canal and I was given Clindamyacin which made me foot tingle more than normal.

I really said hmmm, and decided it was time to get tested. :D

The science and the research regarding the "cause" of our illness is there. We as patients unfortunately MUST become our own advocates, get educated, realize our good intended doctors might be on the wrong path, and give antibiotics a try.

quick story: many of hundreds

I met a gal in my doctors office who has MS and on Avonex; she's been diagnosed for 7yrs. Roughly a year ago she needed an antibiotic for something (can't remember) and became violently ill from the Minocycline she was prescribed..by her neuro.

She couldn't understand "why" she would become so ill. She began searching the internet for answers.
She found herself reading about the bacteria connection with MS, and eventually sought out a Lyme doctor. She was clinically diagnosed with Lyme Disease.

She then took this information back to her Neurologist: he said very little to her as he gave her a 6 month prescription for Minocycline...and did not refill her Avonex script!

She struggles to walk without the help of a cane, and although her road won't be an easy one; she told me she already is feeling better. She's in treatment 3 months.

btw, she is infuriated with her Neuro! She's from RI and he has an office in both RI and CT. Tick country...!

She insists that he "knows" all she found on the internet.

I wish you well, and I know you will find the Cpn site easy to digest.
tory
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