Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

A forum for the discussion of antibiotics as a potential therapy for MS

Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby adamt » Sat Jul 06, 2013 5:16 am

Timing of the abx is a question i have, should you take all 3 abx with food or on an empty stomach?
how important is this?
When are the vast range of supplements meant to be taken? At the same time as the abx?
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby SarahLonglands » Sat Jul 06, 2013 8:39 am

Quite honestly, whatever the instructions say, I took everything with food or just before: that avoids sicking it all up and being a waste. Supplements you can take whenever you like, except calcium: it reacts with doxycycline and other tetracyclines, so take it two hours apart from abx. Likewise, probiotics should be taken two hours apart and also charcoal if you are taking it.

Sarah
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby jimmylegs » Sat Jul 06, 2013 9:08 am

I could probably provide some input re timing and combining specific *nutrient* supplements ...

I don't usually take meds so not experienced along those lines. ie I wouldn't have known about calcium/abx interaction

but if the rest of the supplements are good any time, then there are definitely ways you can work your intake to optimize absorption and utilization.

again that's for nutrients .. I don't know about timing and combinations for any herbals etc.

examples, take zinc in the morning when your levels are naturally highest. take with food to guard against nausea.
don't take b12 in the morning or it messes with circadian rhythm and can keep you up at night. etc etc. lunch or dinner is a better idea
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby MacKintosh » Sat Jul 06, 2013 11:49 am

Doxy sometimes made me queasy, unless I ate something just before taking it, so I just took all my abx with food. (Rifampin has different rules; I think it's no food 2 hours before and after rifampin, but I've never taken it.) I took my vitamins and some supps (D3, B12, CoQ10, NAC, Fish Oil, AlphaLipoic Acid) along with the antibiotics.

I kept minerals and probiotics separate from antibiotics and took them at a different time of day. Calcium, magnesium, selenium, zinc, the rare iron pill... all kept far from antibiotics.
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby adamt » Sun Jul 07, 2013 3:06 am

okay thank,

here is my new routine, an opinions?:

After breakfast:
Calcium 250mg, Magnesium 200mg, Selenium 200mcg, Zinc 50mg, Acidophilus 3billion, Vit B50, Vit E 400iu, Acetyl L Carnitine 500mg, Beta Carotene 15mg, N-Acetyle-Cystene 2x 600mg, Fish oil 100mg, Copper 2mg

After lunch:
Tinidazole 500mg (on pulse days)
Evening primrose oil 1g,

After dinner:
Doxycyline 200mg
Azithromycin 250mg (on Mon/Wed/Fri)
Tinidazole 500mg (on pulse days)


Is this all okay, what would you change or add when on the Wheldon protocol?
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby adamt » Sun Jul 07, 2013 3:18 am

okay thank,

here is my new routine, any opinions?:

After breakfast (usually around 08:15 - 09:00)
Calcium 250mg, Magnesium 200mg, Selenium 200mcg, Zinc 50mg, Acidophilus 3billion, Vit B50, Vit E 400iu, Acetyl L Carnitine 500mg, Beta Carotene 15mg, NAC 2x 600mg, Fish oil 100mg, Copper 2mg, COQ10 100mg

After lunch (13;00 - 13;45):
Tinidazole 500mg (on pulse days)
Evening primrose oil 1g, Fish oil 1g, Alpha liopic acid 600mg, NAC 600mg, Biotin 300ug, Vit C 1000mg, Folic acid 400mcg, Turmeric 400mg, Vit 5000 IU

After dinner (18;00 - 19;30):
Doxycyline 200mg
Azithromycin 250mg (on Mon/Wed/Fri)
Tinidazole 500mg (on pulse days)


I also take 260mg Activated charcoal 2 hours before dinner, and 500mg Spirulina/Chlorella 2 hours after dinner supplements

Is this all okay, what would you change or add when on the Wheldon protocol?

Soon (once these run out) i will be taking a full spectrum tablet that includes calcium, magnesium, zinc, copper, selenium, so i wont
need to take so many pills.
this brand: http://www.nowfoods.com/Supplements/Pro ... ablets.htm
Last edited by adamt on Sun Jul 07, 2013 5:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby jimmylegs » Sun Jul 07, 2013 4:41 am

what form of magnesium? you should take some with the d3 and some away. if you can get one mag per day without calcium that would be smart too.
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby SarahLonglands » Sun Jul 07, 2013 9:55 am

JL, why some with D3 and some without? I take it with, but life is tooo short to take everything seperately. Apart rom things that are essential, that is.................Sarah
An Itinerary in Light and Shadow Completed Dr Charles Stratton / Dr David Wheldon abx regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years. Still improving with no relapses since starting. Can't run but can paint all day.
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby jimmylegs » Sun Jul 07, 2013 11:41 am

heya :)

it's a tip I picked up from a pharmacist. I was just *dying* with dysphagia and he said 'too much d3, you need to take magnesium' I said 'I take mag every day' and then he told me how to do the timing. changed my life. literally saved it. I had been really low in mag without knowing it for years. pre dx too. then once dx'd w ms, I started learning about nutrition piecemeal and was high dosing the d3 without balancing it. learned about magnesium years later, suffering nasty, needless consequences in the meantime. I really felt like I was going to die, and then it was fixed. the more dire symptoms were gone in a flash. the more deep-seated consequences of depletion took years to resolve.

so basically what happens is when you do the magnesium in two stages, the bit you take with d3 gets monopolized by d3 interactions. the bit you take away from competition or cooption goes in for its own sake. ie the other few-hundred-plus jobs it's needed for in the body.

on a related note, i recently was reading this one abstract again, and noting magnesium's role in fighting infection. would be interesting to see exactly what the references are for this kind of statement about mag deficiency impacts: "recurrent bacterial infection due to low levels of nitric oxide in the cavities (sinuses, vagina, middle ear, lungs, throat, etc.), fungal infections due to a depressed immune system"

i will have to dig into that at some point :)

what form of mag do you use, sarah?
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Re: Abx with meals or on empty stomach?

Postby jimmylegs » Wed Jul 10, 2013 9:49 am

bump @ sarah, re mag
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