Visualizing iron deposition in MS cadaver brains

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.

Postby Johnson » Tue Dec 07, 2010 5:18 pm

Bethr wrote:Thanks for the bump :) ...

Re: zinc - I found it made me feel not so good when I tried supplementing, so cut it out fairly quickly.

Hi Bethr,

Glad to read of your lowered ferritin, et al, but I'm curious about negative effects from zinc, and how it made you feel poorly (eg.: fatigue? biliousness? dizziness?, etc.)

Thanks for any insights.
My name is not really Johnson. MSed up since 1993
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Postby Bethr » Wed Dec 08, 2010 11:52 am

Hard to quantify Johnson, but just a general malaise, "not right" feeling. I noticed it quite quickly after I started taking zinc. My main symptoms are fatigue and stiff sore joints. I was a bit suspect of it anyway, as if you have hemochromatosis/load iron you shouldn't supplement with zinc, it also increases melanin, and I already had melanosis on my arms. It also can increase hormone levels, and mine are on the high side. It boosts your immune system, but mine already seems to be quite overactive.

It made me think about what supplements I was taking (I'm new to supplements and only started taking some after learning things here), so I cut them all out and I'm just adding them back one at a time to make sure of no adverse effect.

I'm still hoping to get tested for zinc levels, but for now I'm off it.
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Postby Bethr » Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:49 pm

So glad you asked me that question Johnson, as I've looked into it a bit more and found this research.

2009 Jun;9(2):132-44.

T-lymphocytes: a target for stimulatory and inhibitory effects of zinc ions.
Hönscheid A, Rink L, Haase H.

Institute of Immunology, Medical Faculty, RWTH Aachen University, 52074 Aachen, Germany.

The trace element zinc is a crucial cofactor for many proteins involved in cellular processes like differentiation, proliferation and apoptosis. Zinc homeostasis is tightly regulated and disturbance of this homeostasis due to genetic defects, zinc deficiency, or supplementation influences the development and the progression of various infectious and autoimmune diseases. The immune system is strongly impaired during zinc deficiency, predominantly the cell-mediated response by T-lymphocytes. During zinc deprivation T-lymphocyte development, polarization into effector cells, and function are impaired. This leads to reduced T-cell numbers, a decreased ratio of type 1 to type 2 T-helper cells with reduced production of T-helper type 1 cytokines like interferon-gamma, and compromised T-cell mediated immune defense. Accordingly, disturbed zinc homeostasis increases the risk for infections, and zinc supplementation restores normal immune function. Furthermore, several disorders, like mycobacterial infections, asthma, diabetes, and rheumatoid arthritis are accompanied by decreased zinc levels and in some cases disease progression can be affected by zinc supplementation. On the molecular level, apoptosis of T-cell precursors is influenced by zinc via the Bcl-2/Bax ratio, and zinc ions inhibit caspases-3, -6, -7, and -8. In mature T-cells, zinc interacts with kinases involved in T-cell activation, like protein kinase C and the lymphocyte protein tyrosine kinase (Lck), while higher zinc concentrations are inhibitory, reducing the activities of the interleukin-1 receptor-associated kinase (IRAK) and calcineurin. Taken together, zinc homeostasis influences T-lymphocytes via several molecular targets, leading to a modulation of T-cell-dependent immune responses.

So that is probably my answer to why zinc affects me badly.
I have Lymphocytosis due to a splenectomy at 13yrs.
They removed my spleen which had ruptured in an accident.
Looking back over my blood tests this year, since taking the zinc, my T-lymphocyte count rose dramatically, and I developed luekisitosis also (high RBC) amongst other things, culminating in the lymphocytes collecting in my skin in October and it erupted as a blister rash.

I need something to calm down my immune system, and I think zinc may rev it up :lol:

I'd say this is quite unique to me, so don't let it put you off zinc.
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Postby Bethr » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:28 pm

Continuing on from my posts on how zinc made me feel unwell. In December/Jan I had a period of a week or so where I started to have blue sweat. It stained my clothes. The brightest blue you could imagine.
I've looked into this and found this case report of a man with blue sweat.
When analysed his sweat contained excessive zinc and copper.

I was feeling great when this happened, my iron levels were right down, and it seems like something was being purged from my body IMHO :wink: I wasn't on any supplements or drugs.
It's no wonder the Drs. look at me sideways.

Results: The patient noticed the discharge blue sweat for a period of 2 months before
he came to seek treatment. The patient’s medical and medication history is
noncontributory except that the patient was taking hypertensive drugs. The
conditions were ultimately treated with prescription antiperspirant Xerac-AC and
Drysol; they completely eliminated both the smell of bromhidrosis and the discharge
of chromhidrosis. This is the first time an antiperspirant deodorant was reported to
have significantly diminished both the smell and discharge of bromhidrosis and
chromhidrosis, respectively. The patient’s undergarments revealed excessive copper
and zinc levels, which may be the cause for the blue color of the sweat. However,
the etiology is still unknown, and further research in patients with similar conditions
should be investigated.
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