CCSVI and CCVBP

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.

Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby juefaz » Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:48 am

thank you dr flanagan for your swift responce i thought a neurosurgeon would be a better choice than a neurologist i will see if i can be referred. i don't know if i have had these fusions sinse birth or wether some were from birth and the others have happened over time what do you think? i've never had any kind of accidents on my neck throughout my life my chiropractor asked me this, is it also possible the syrinx has been there all my life because of the fusions? it's funny that although i've never had any trauma to the neck i have always had difficulty turning my neck and people quite often asked if i had a stiff neck. i forgot to mention my day to day symptoms are not sleeping well, fatigue, balance problems, cog fog (although that has been much better sinse taking LDN) concentration problems, i would put all these down to poor oxygen flow too would you? my neuro said i shouldn't see a chiropractor but i have had very good results over the last 12 month from it my neck is much loser and my posture is getting better and my chiropractor says i go back into position easier each time, i am hoping the better my spine is the better my "flows" will be! are there any particular adjustments you would reccommend as a chiropractor? i've been reading recently about a dr rosa who is doing a certain adjustment that helps with csf flow but i don't think anyone here in the uk is trained properly to do it as yet. thanks again for your responce dr flanagan much appreciated
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:17 am

Dania,
You definitely have autonomic signs. The tachycardia may be due to increased pressure in the jugular foramen. The jugular foramen contains cranial nerves 9-11. The vagus (10) is important to regulation of heart rate. It's my contention that displacement of the brain in the cranial vault can effect the contents of the jugular and other foramen similar to the foramen magnum.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby dania » Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:27 am

TY. Trying to figure out this maze of strange symptoms that others diagnosed with MS do not have. It seems I am the only one that does. And how to fix them if possible.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby NZer1 » Thu Nov 29, 2012 12:11 pm

Good morning all,
I have woken with a brain full of thoughts and as always they are trying to escape and get lost in the world before they attach to my memory.

I realise now that the brain is a series of fluid chambers or compartments and these are drained by multiple outlets or on flowing chambers and vessels.
If there is a restriction of flow in the system then that compartment and the area it is either supporting structurally or in the sense of providing nutrients, cooling and removing waste will be deficient, and so will the down stream regions.

When Congestion caused by inflammation, common in 'MS' for example, is present that would be why DMD's have some effect for some people, it would also explain the effect of intra venous Steroids reducing the restriction of flow and speeding up symptom improvements.

The changes from PTA that improve flows in for example the Jug's will improve flows in some parts of the brains vascular flow and some of the CSF flow in 'some' body positions, the same will happen when AO adjustments of the Atlas occur and some flows will change for example it can be artery, vascular or CSF or a combination of all three synergistically.

NPH is a compartment flow issue, tracking the exact cause of the enlargements would be a challenge, it could be artery, vascular or CSF flow or a combination and it could also be a region or compartment of the brain, singularly that has issues such as drainage.

When one compartment of the brain for CSF has a decrease of flow there will be a corresponding increase to accommodate it and that may appear as expansion of a chamber and that could lead to a outlet flow blockage issue, this would be a distraction to the primary cause of the expansion of a chamber, eg ventricles.

If the brain flows were mapped and drawn up it would be a myriad of pathways rather than the model some medical people have where there is a pool with some outlets and a balancing effect of pressure and volume flow throughout. If fMRI can measure electrical flows and activity is there a method for fluids?

Various flow problems have names such as NPH and there are no doubt many, many more flow problems with degenerative diseases and neuro-degenerative diseases as well.

Inflammation and infection of compartments or their surroundings must have an effect on a regions flow ability and cause bypassing and negatively effect the tissues, electrical activity and the purpose of flow to the region.

Infection and inflammation must be effecting the capillary beds as well and therefore depleting oxygen, food and waste removal and transport. That would have a cascading effect on all systems over time.

The new knowledge of Sports head injury over a life time is helping push the importance of understanding the degenerative effects such as scar tissue and it's growth and waste deposits accumulative effects.

Well that's about it for the flow of thought, it drained me.Time for a rest and it's only 8.10 in the morning, glad I woke early, ate and went for my morning walk with Sage before typing this out.

Nigel
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Thu Nov 29, 2012 12:27 pm

juefaz wrote:...i don't know if i have had these fusions sinse birth or wether some were from birth and the others have happened over time what do you think? i've never had any kind of accidents on my neck throughout my life my chiropractor asked me this, is it also possible the syrinx has been there all my life because of the fusions...i've never had any trauma to the neck i have always had difficulty turning my neck...symptoms are not sleeping well, fatigue, balance problems, cog fog, concentration problems, i would put all these down to poor oxygen flow too would you? my neuro said i shouldn't see a chiropractor but i have had very good results over the last 12 month from it my neck is much loser and my posture is getting better and my chiropractor says i go back into position easier each time, i am hoping the better my spine is the better my "flows" will be! are there any particular adjustments you would reccommend as a chiropractor? i've been reading recently about a dr rosa who is doing a certain adjustment that helps with csf flow but i don't think anyone here in the uk is trained properly to do it as yet...


JueFez,
You may have congenital fusions similar to Klepel-Feil syndrome, which more than likely caused the syrinx. The fatigue and cog fog are probably due to ischemia.

Dr. Rosa uses a low force Atlas Orthogonal specific upper cervical vector (line of correction) approach with the addition of upright MRI that focuses on the craniocervical junction. This provides a more accurate assesment of certain parameters of misalignment. There are other ways, however, to manage conditions such as yours. I used a low force hybrid craniopathic upper cervical approach. I also used manual circulatory techniques to move blood and CSF in the brain. I would probably do cervical traction on you as well.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby dania » Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:29 pm

uprightdoc wrote:Dania,
You definitely have autonomic signs. The tachycardia may be due to increased pressure in the jugular foramen. The jugular foramen contains cranial nerves 9-11. The vagus (10) is important to regulation of heart rate. It's my contention that displacement of the brain in the cranial vault can effect the contents of the jugular and other foramen similar to the foramen magnum.

Dr Flanagan with these symptoms what would be your opinion of my problem and what type of doctor should I see? I am afraid of when he sees me he will say I have MS and not look further. What would be the best way of explaining what is going on with me so he/she does not brush me aside?
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:54 pm

That's tough to say Dania. I really don't have an answer. It's hard to open up a closed mind trapped inside a thick skull.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby blossom » Thu Nov 29, 2012 8:14 pm

dr. flanagan, your comment to dania--IT'S HARD TO OPEN UP A CLOSED MIND TRAPPED INSIDSE A THICK SKULL--so true. so sad.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby dania » Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:30 am

Yes sad but so true. Dr Flanagan is there anything you can recommend that I try for this particle problem of mine? Would Craniopathic correction possibly help?
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:48 am

Yes. I sent you a PM previously regarding your question.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby juefaz » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:14 am

dr flanagan
thank you for your advice i will tell my chiropractor about the adjustments you mentioned and hopefully she will be able to do them for me. would you say chiropractic care is the way to go with this syrinx as obviously i dont want to consider surgery unless absolutely neccesary? i'm also hoping it helps with the ms in general as i have never taken the DMD's and never wish to, i will stick with my LDN and chiropractic care i think, the thing that bothers me the most apart from my legs is the fatigue i have tried various things for it but nothing as ever helped, it's very annoying as i still work but find it a struggle most days. thanks again dr flanagan for your advice, much appreciated
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:37 am

Stick with what you are doing. Just have someone monitor the syrinx to make sure it doesn't enlarge and that the numbness and leg weakness don't progress. The neurologist should be checking your leg muscles and reflexes regularly, as well as sensations in the legs.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby juefaz » Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:53 pm

thankyou dr flanagan,
my neuro said i should have a mri once a year which i am actually going for next week as it's a year ago sinse it was found, when i next see him in january i will get him to check my leg muscles and reflexes, my chiro usually checks those too, i am keeping an eye on them myself and they haven't changed in the last 4 yrs sinse they started getting weak, thanks again for your good advice it's nice to have someone who listens and helps

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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:41 pm

Your welcome. It's not a problem if it doesn't get larger. Aging, will cause the spine and spinal canal to degenerate and decrease in size somewhat, so it may cause a slight increase in symptoms but unless there is a rapid change you are much better off leaving it alone and managing the condition. The fused vertebra and curvatures in the spine suggest developmental issues so you have probably had the syrinx for a long time. You should get checked for a Chiari malformation, preferably with an upright MRI. There is a higher incidence of Chiari associated with scoliosis. A Chiari malformation could be the cause of the numbness and weakness. Upright posture and walking probably increases pressure on the syrinx slightly and aggravate the numbness and weakness.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby NZer1 » Sat Dec 01, 2012 4:16 pm

Hi Dr F,
I have seen that Diana is trying to engage Mike Arata on FB and get some communications going about your understandings in MS. I have to add that Mike has asked for links to the research used for your understandings so he can look into this.
Have you had the opportunity to talk with him?

The article that he is posting at present is interesting, what are your thoughts please.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar ... 7212000845
Abstract
Multiple sclerosis (MS) is a disease with multiple etiologies. The most recent theory of the vascular etiology of MS, Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency (CCSVI), suggests that cerebral venous obstruction could lead to cerebral venous reflux, promoting local inflammatory processes.

This review article offers strong evidence that the route of the observed narrowing of cerebral veins arises from autonomic nervous system dysfunction, particularly cardiovascular autonomic dysfunction.

The dysfunction of this system has two major effects: 1) the reduction of mean arterial blood pressure, which has the potential to reduce the cerebral perfusion pressure and the transmural pressure, and 2) the failure of cerebral autoregulation to maintain constant cerebral blood flow in the face of fluctuations in cerebral perfusion pressure. Alterations in cerebral autoregulation could in turn raise the critical closure pressure, indicated to be the cerebral perfusion pressure at which the transmural pressure will be sub-sufficient to overcome the active tension imparted by the smooth muscle layer of the vessel. These two effects of autonomic nervous system dysfunction (reduction in arterial blood pressure and alterations in cerebral autoregulation), when combined with inflammation-induced high levels of nitric oxide in the brain, will lower transmural pressure sufficiently to the point where the threshold for critical closure pressure is reached, leading to venous closure.

In addition, cerebral vessels fail to overcome the closure as a result of low central venous pressure, which is also regulated by autonomic nervous system function. Furthermore, through their neuroregulatory effects, infectious agents such as the Epstein-Barr virus and vitamin D3 are able to alter the functions of the autonomic nervous system, influencing the rate of CCSVI occurrence.

The absence of CCSVI specificity for MS, observed in recent clinical studies, may stem from a high prevalence of autonomic nervous system dysfunction in control groups which were recruited to these studies. Future studies should investigate CCSVI in relation to cardiovascular autonomic function.

Thanks,
Nigel
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