CCSVI and CCVBP

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.
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uprightdoc
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Post by uprightdoc »

Hello Vesta,

I don't know if you are aware of this report or not but I thought you might find it informative.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25395338
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Hello upright doc:
Thanks for the link. Yes, there has been much discussion in France about the link between MS and the Hepatitis B vaccine. This being the land of Pasteur and vaccines, the medical corps has been adamant in saying there is no connection, but I wouldn't think of getting that vaccine (or any for that matter.)
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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CONCLUSIONS: The osteopathic venous sinus drainage technique in a patient diagnosed with multiple sclerosis and CCSVI has proven effective in reducing fatigue and headache. The study has some limitations as the evaluation and ratings of the records have been subjective. Moreover, the treatment has been tested only in one single patient; therefore, the study should be extended to a larger population in order to obtain more reliable results.
http://www.osteopathic-research.com/?op ... &Itemid=12

Even Osteo's are finding blood matters!
;)
Nigel

I wonder if Chiro's will rethink their beliefs about the benefits of their technique? Hope so .................
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Thanks Nigel,

Although it far from being a good study it is an interesting find. Obviously someone is following the buzz about CCSVI. Unfortunately, the study doesn’t mention the CCVBP theory. As far as this case study goes, headaches are not one of the cardinal signs of concern in cases of MS. Moreover, rating fatigue and headaches as a measure of success is highly subjective and the symptoms in this case were fairly mild to begin with and the improvements minimal at best. That said, blood and CSF mobilization are part of the classic craniosacral methods but most chiropractors and osteopaths aren't that knowledgeable about them and they don't use them.

Blood and CSF flow definitely matter. Obstruction to blood and CSF flow is one of the primary causes of neurodegenerative conditions.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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French Osteopaths work specifically on freeing CSF flow and blood circulation. I don't know how American Osteos see things. Consider my recent experience.
"Dec 17, 2014 Thisisms.com under Progressive MS and the Spine (General Discussion)
Stillhaha:
I just tried Inclined Bed Therapy and think it is a VERY BAD IDEA for people with Progressive MS (Primary or Secondary) or at least it was for me. What it did was further stress my back by compressing the lumbars and sacrum. After a week I could barely walk. The Osteopath told me that my mid section was totally compressed. After treatment and today I am recovered. I'm using myself as guinea pig, but this experience illustrates the paramount role of the back in MS, the vertebrae were either compressing the spinal cord directly, or the cerebro-spinal fluid pressed on the cord so that once the flow resumed I could walk again. Please don't do the same to yourself, and if you already have get a therapist to re-align your back.

One interesting side note. My husband had a fit when I ordered the mattress which admittedly being foam was not of good quality. Being unavailable in France I ordered from the US and with shipping and taxes it was expensive. While it made my MS worse by stressing my back, it helped my husband magically. Since I've known him he wakes up brutally after an hour's sleep because of stomach reflux. Gravity prevented the reflux and he slept like a baby. The only incline mattresses available here are for babies since it is recognized that digesive reflux can choke a baby. So, duh, why not see the same connection for stomach reflux in adults. It's big industry, stick a tube in the stomach to see what's going on, constant medication. Anyway, irony of the story, the mattress helped him but was a disaster for me.
Regards
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Let me begin by saying that craniosacral methods used by osteopaths and chiropractors can be very helpful when applied correctly despite the bad science they are based upon. The problem is that most osteopaths, chiropractors and therapists who use craniosacral type methods are clueless about the anatomy, physiology and pathology involved in neurodegenerative conditions and how to apply the techniques effectively.

All osteopaths and chiropractors who do cranial or craniosacral therapy claim to work on blood and CSF flow but they do so primarily by working on the joints of the skull not by working on blood vessels or CSF pathways. The whole premise of cranial osteopathy and craniosacral is built on the belief that the joints of the skull move, which they claim is necessary for health. I have covered the topic numerous times and will do even more so in my next book. The problem is that forensic and comparative evidence shows just the opposite. Forensic evidence shows that sutures steadily close in aging healthy skulls and stay open in pathology associated with faulty craniospinal hydrodynamics (hydraulics). Forensic criminologists, pathologists and anthropologists use suture closing as a method of age determination. I studies thousands of skulls myself from the Van Luschan collection at the Museum of Natural History in New York. I also did comparative anatomical studies. The comparative anatomical studies showed that sutures close in just about every other species of mammal I studied including bats, whales and giraffes exposed to inversion and Valsalva maneuvers that are known to increase intracranial pressure (ICP). Not only were the sutures completely obliterated in many cases but they were also covered with bones called nuchal and sagittal crests. Obviously movement of sutures isn't necessary in any other species so why do osteopaths and chiropractors believe it is necessary in humans? Increased ICP from hydrocephalus is a known cause of open sutures as is craniodysostosis (malformation of bone) and brittle bone diseases etc. The sutures were also open in the artificially deformed skulls I studied which suggested to me that they had problems with intracranial pressure.

As I stated previously, very few osteopaths or chiropractors understand or use classic blood and CSF mobilization methods which aren't that good anyway. I have developed completely different methods of blood and CSF mobilization that make far more sense based on anatomy and physiology that can be applied to the particular pathologies. The problem is that most doctors don't want to work that hard to learn what is necessary to be effective in complex cases involving neurodegenerative conditions.

http://back2healthchiropractic.ca/craniosacral-therapy/
http://faculty.une.edu/com/jnorton/PDFf ... iology.pdf
http://www.iahe.com/images/pdf/August1997-LR-Rogers.pdf
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Greetings:
My Osteopath (in France they are not MDs) works very little on the skull. This last time he began on the sacrum and moved up, said the sacrum was totally blocked, my stomach area hard like a rock, released pelvic area and continued up towards the head. (He is the official Osteopath for an international sports team, works body structure and musculature.) I wouldn't say that French Osteopaths are that fixed on the head (maybe 20 years ago) so I guess treatment is evolving. And he specifically said Osteos work to free CSF circulation, was very interested in CCSVI idea for MS (and disgusted by medical "dogma")
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Hello Vesta,
Most cases of classic MS involve pathology, signs and symptoms of the brain such as optic neuritis, nystagmus, diplopia, trigeminal neuralgia, muscle spasms, weakness in the extremities, fatigue etc. The best way to treat those symptoms is by working on the skull. Most MS patients, however, also have co-morbidities (other problems) that can be causative or contributory to their condition. Weaknesses and spasms cause structural strains that should be addressed to prevent further damage and disabilities. Working on the musculoskeletal system can be very beneficial. It would be even better if doctors knew more about the anatomy, physiology and pathology of neurodegenerative conditions and applied their methods more appropriately rather than haphazardly.

As an aside, neurosurgeons are now testing manual methods of blood and CSF mobilization to treat subdural hematomas (bleeding into the subarachnoid/CSF spaces) typically caused by tears from traumatic brain injury. Blood is not supposed to be the subarachnoid space. It is denser than CSF and it does not mix well with CSF, which is a very low pressure and slow moving system. Blood causes clots and blockages of CSF flow that can cause hydrocephalus and increased intracranial pressure. Subdural hematomas can be life threatening. When it becomes necessary, neurosurgeons sometimes drain the subarachnoid space to eliminate the blood clots. More recently, they inadvertenly discovered that manual mobilization helps to mix blood and CSF, which improves flow through subarachnoid space and drainage through the arachnoid graulations (valves) where they are absorbed back into general circulation.

Manual and mechanical (such as the Cox 7 Flexion-distraction table and other) methods of blood and CSF mobilization can be very effective if applied appropriately in light of the patient's particular anatomy, physiology and pathology. I have developed more advanced specific manual methods of blood and CSF mobilization based on the anatomy and physiology of the circulatory systems of the brain and cord, not bones and muscles. The maneuvers make sense to use for neurodegenerative conditions, as well as hydrocephalus, Chiari malformations, Dandy-Walker complex, traumatic brain injuries, strokes, coma etc. Much more needs to be done.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Hi doc,

The woman i told you about is a menner now. She has some questions :-D
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uprightdoc
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Hi Robert,

That's terrific. She is a very interesting case. I look forward to her questions.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Hi all, Dr F I have studied Bodymind therapies and trained as a Therapist for decades and have seen successes in this type of insight that can improve health in an 'illness' context as well as 'mental' health.

Does this approach 'fit' with your understanding of the body and the metaphors for 'ill-ness' or 'dis-ease' that the body provides us with?

Regards,
Nigel :)
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Hi again,
thought I should be more specific in my word Bodymind therapy;

Louise Hay wrote about metaphors in her book 'You can heal you Life' at least 30 years ago and Lowen, Shultz, Prestera, Rolf, Pierrakos, Reich, Dychtwald and a host of other Dr's have designed a system that provides insights from the metaphors that 'ill-ness' sends us such as 'diseases' like MS .................

:)
Nigel
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uprightdoc
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Hello Nigel,

I did classic yoga with and excellent teacher for several years. He was fairly old when I met him and was still very spry. He inspired me in many different ways from interest in alternative construction and natural foods to health care. Soon after that I got very involved in martial arts, chi kung, bushido and zen. Yoga and martial arts are all based on the development of mind, body and spirit and part of Asian health care systems.

That said, body-mind therapies are part of my philosophy not my theory. Norman Cousin's book, Anatomy of an Illness, was popular when I was in school. I have never seen philosophy or positive thinking heal anyone, including myself and other patients involved in martial arts, yoga and chi kung etc. On the other hand, a positive attitude is much more conducive to overall health and you need an open mind to be receptive to solutions that come from the ether.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Good to hear Dr,

Zen is my focus and I see that improvements have to begin at essence or source, so I tend to also see that change doesn't always confront the cause, neither to the effects.

I have been researching the insights found from identifying and, in depth/detail, describing the cause of anything and how the cure is kept in the same space or put another way if you research the cause fully you will also have learned the cure in the same process of researching, because the 'fault' will be seen clearly with its pathway to dys-function or ill-ness or 'dis-ease' of the system. Change may not be simple or even possible due to cascade effects that compound and morph on the journey.

;)
Nigel
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

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Thanks Nigel.

I spent a long day today editing the section on Neuromyelitis Optica for my next book. Neuromyelits Optica is also known as Devic's Disease and Asian Optic-Spinal MS. It's always been an interesting topic for me. Devic's disease and Optic-spinal MS are considered to be rare diseases seen predominantly in people with African and Asian genetics who otherwise have a very low incidence of classic western style MS. As in MS, regardless race, females have a much higher incidence of neuromyelitis optica compared to males. At first scientists thought it had to do with the tropical and subtropical environments. Then they found that Eskimos and North American Indians likewise have very low MS but when they do get MS it is the much more aggressive and dibilitating form of NMO. African-Americans similarly have a low incidence of MS but tend to get NMO when they do get MS. Recent studies also show that since Asian began to adopt western lifestyles in addition to NMO they began to get classic western-type MS. They thought maybe westerners introduced a different diet or pathogens but it didn't pan out. There were still different expression of MS in Asians versus westerners. By thoroughly researching the subject with an open Zen-like mind I was able to connect the dots to MS many years ago. The difference in prevalence is in the different racial and gender designs of the skull. The Japanese also started driving more cars. In the area where I came from, despite being phenomenal athletes, the Asians in general are notoriously bad drivers. My sister in law is Chinese and can't drive at all. Brain scans will soon prove my theory. I get answers because I am open.
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