Strenuous Exercise. Is it bad for CCSVI?

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Strenuous Exercise. Is it bad for CCSVI?

Postby Taurus » Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:57 am

Dr Zamboni wrote in his one of the papers "During a duplex scanning examination on the carotid arteries of a 55-year-old patient with multiple sclerosis (MS), I observed an unexpected reflux from the chest into the internal jugular vein after the patient coughed involuntarily. I then noted this unusual phenomenon in other MS patients".
I wondered if involuntary cough could produce reflux in MS patients, then similar effect could also be seen with MS patients doing regular exercise or physical jobs as exercise increases the heart rate which could generate reflux in similar fashion. I noticed it on myself. Whenever I visit Gym and start strenuous exercise, temperature of my head rises and I start sweating from the same side.
Anyone experiencing same, please post. Does this mean that MS patients with CCSVI should not go for exercise at all?
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Postby Jasper9 » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:07 am

I was also wondering about exercise and CCSVI but from a slightly different angle.
If CCSVI is related to the slow transit of blood, would exercise help reduce the impact because during exercise blood moves quicker through the vascular system?
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Postby Cece » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:25 am

I think both are true. (Exercise helps and hurts. Resting helps but results in deconditioning which hurts.)
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Postby Jugular » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:36 am

I'm going to put myself down on the pro-exercise column. Being in shape translates into improved blood flow overall. Also during exercise, the veins dilate and the increased blood flow may have a flushing effect.
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Postby PCakes » Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:09 pm

Cece wrote:I think both are true. (Exercise helps and hurts. Resting helps but results in deconditioning which hurts.)


..i agree and believe that healthy blood flow is key to good health and exercise is key to healthy blood flow.
There seems to be so many different roads to CCSVI.. stenosis, valves, various malformations, low blood pressure and on and on. So, I wonder if the type and level of healthy exercise will become dependent on the cause?
For example.. stenosis or low blood pressure that might be improved with vasodilation would benefit from physical exertion/increased blood flow while an inverted valve or a 'web' might not, as that same increased blood flow could exacerbate reflux?

note: this all pre-angio/veno.. post would be a whole new game :)
Last edited by PCakes on Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby JCB » Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:34 pm

I have not heard of a condition yet that implores people to be couch potatoes.

I am an excercise nut, only because it makes sense. Our bodies function better when our bodies move. Our lung's are required to pump more oxygen when we excercise. Our hearts are required to become more efficient as our muscles require more oxygen. I don't always like to exercise, but I do it because I know it's good for me.

This is probably the only point my neurologist would agree with me.
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Postby PCakes » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:18 pm

JCB wrote:I have not heard of a condition yet that implores people to be couch potatoes.

This is probably the only point my neurologist would agree with me.


I agree, although in my case, my neurologist advised that rest during bouts of fatigue was critical to cns health.
I suggest given CCSVI, that there may be cases when fatigue is a direct result of hypoxia and a signal to 'get moving'?

Further... http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2913959 ..although a discussion of venous flow in the legs, the comment on exercise is interesting, as is ..
Surgical treatment of venous incompetence abolishes the abnormal venous reflux and restores the normal vasodilator response to exercise, thereby correcting the sustained hypoxia
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Postby zap » Wed Oct 13, 2010 8:16 am

I think that strenuous exercise can be good or bad - and I wonder if a major difference might be the position the head and neck are held in, and/or other factors that may open up or occlude brain-drainage.

I've noticed throbbing headaches that seem perhaps related to my pounding heart getting more blood up into my skull than can get out easily in some exercise situations, but when I get my heart pounding on my longboard - with my full core engaged, body in motion, breathing deeply and regularly (vascular pump engaged) I have no such problems, ever. huh
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Postby Cece » Wed Oct 13, 2010 8:33 am

I do well with the elliptical, maybe it hits the mark between intense enough to get blood flowing but not too intense.

Here's my crack at this: Exercise is good for long-term health of the body, brain and veins. Exercise gets the blood flowing so more oxygen gets to the brain, which our brains are desperate for. But exercise also uses up glucose in the blood, so even as our brains are being given more oxygen, they are being starved in the short-term for glucose. With blockages in the venous outflow, exercise can result in the usual reflux and hypoxia as the veins cannot accomodate the increase in blood flow. Exercise can tire out limbs because of the shortage of electrical signals through damaged myelin, so that every action costs the body more than it would if the myelin were healthy.

Supposedly the cardiovascular benefits of the target thirty minute workout are the same if the workout is done continuously or if it is broken up over the day. It might help to do that, get the workout in three ten-minute bursts that are separated by enough time for everything to settle again. But I think we do need to listen to the body's signals and I agree with Pcakes and her doctor that it is wise to pay attention to the fatigue signals, at least to some extent.
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Postby David1949 » Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:53 pm

When I was first Dxed my neuro advised me not to get too hot and not to strain. I think for men the straining thing is more likely to be a problem because when we exercise we tend to be macho and do things like trying to benchpress 200 pounds. That's a lot of strain. Women tend to be smarter in that respect and not do that kind of straining.
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Postby Jasper9 » Sun Oct 24, 2010 4:16 am

so what effect is exercise generally known to have on venous health? does exercise promote optimal vein functionality, elasticity etc.? if so then surely exercise is a good thing to do.
Or would it be detrimental to push more blood into the brain if there are drainage problems - this might cause a backlog of blood around the brain..?
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