Does anyone take a supplement to improve circulation? Did ..

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.

Postby jimmylegs » Sun Oct 17, 2010 4:49 am

on the subject of buildup of plaques, that reminds me niacin is viewed as a reasonable substitute for the statin drugs sometimes prescribed to ms patients.

there is a caution about the use of niacin and impacts on the liver. however, the problem appears to be with the 'slow release form' which i *assume* means niacinamide.

http://www.ajconline.org/article/S0002-9149(06)02236-3/abstract
Safety Considerations with Niacin Therapy
Although serious hepatic toxicity from niacin administration has been reported, it is largely confined to the use of slow-release formulations given as unregulated nutritional supplements.
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Postby jimmylegs » Sun Oct 17, 2010 4:57 am

hmm niacin, niacinamide... a little more of the picture...

http://tinyurl.com/2evgj25

Co-administration of equimolar doses of betaine may alleviate the hepatotoxic risk associated with niacin therapy
Abstract
High-dose niacin has versatile and substantial efficacy for the treatment of hyperlipidemias, but its utility is compromised by various side effects, the most serious of which is liver damage. It is proposed that this hepatotoxicity reflects the high demand for methyl groups imposed by niacin catabolism, leading to a reduction in hepatic levels of S-adenosylmethionine (SAM). Depletion of the hepatic SAM pool has likewise been shown to mediate, at least in part, the hepatotoxic effects of ethanol, methotrexate, and niacinamide. If niacin does indeed decrease SAM, a likely consequence would be a counterproductive elevation of plasma homocysteine. Conceivably, methyl group deficiency, by altering membrane properties of skeletal muscle, also contributes to niacin-induced insulin resistance. Concurrent betaine supplementation – preferably administered as a complex with equimolar amounts of niacin – may represent the most cost-effective way to prevent niacin-mediated depletion of SAM and thus avoid hepatotoxicity (and possibly other adverse effects) while controlling homocysteine. Betaine also merits evaluation as an adjuvant to methotrexate and niacinamide therapies.
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Postby sbr487 » Sun Oct 17, 2010 7:32 am

I have just ordered Gingko capsules but I want to know if people are aware of any serious side effects.
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Postby silverbirch » Sun Oct 17, 2010 12:37 pm

sbr487 wrote:I have just ordered Gingko capsules but I want to know if people are aware of any serious side effects.


Sorry I have no Idea - I threw away the leaflet .
I get mine from the uk Boots 120mg


Box says- 1/2 per day and to take for a minimum of 3 months !! hm
Ive been taken it for 10 months or so and can report no ill effects !!

Not to be taken if breastfeeding and inform your Dr when takeing ginko
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Postby silverbirch » Sun Oct 17, 2010 12:41 pm

NotFound wrote:I take 500mg Niacin daily on an empty stomach with Vit C (could be any acid) to produce a strong flush.

For about 20 min a day (while the flush lasts) I feel almost normal. I think I can even pretend to run during that time (normally walk with a cane).

Do not see effects past that though.


Sorry forum I think Ill up the Ginko for the brain help here is another question from me what is a flush ??

Jimmy legs thank you for comeing to my call again ...

Thnak you to all that answered my question your all just lovely and careing
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Postby NotFound » Mon Oct 18, 2010 11:12 am

silverbirch wrote:
Sorry forum I think Ill up the Ginko for the brain help here is another question from me what is a flush ??



I almost want to say "Try it, you'll see" :lol:

Seriously though (describing my own sensations) - it is a slightly feverish feeling on your skin, usually visible reddening of skin as a result of intense dilation of the vessels (including the smallest capillaries, as was mentioned).

Somewhat similar to the feeling you get on your face after coming into warmth from outside in sub-zero weather.

Also, as mentioned, start with about 100mg at a time. 100 did not flush me even the first time, but everybody is different.

Make sure not to get "timed release" or "non-flush" versions, those, obviously, do not produce flush.

Taking it on empty stomach with acid = increases flush.
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Postby jimmylegs » Mon Oct 18, 2010 11:14 am

hi silverbirch

try taking 500mg straight niacin :evil grin: as long as you are not PUFA deficient, you should soon discover what the flush is :)

oh, okay i'll just tell you - basically your skin goes fire engine red and you feel sunburned and prickly and itchy for a while as your blood charges madly around your body.
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Postby jimmylegs » Mon Oct 18, 2010 11:15 am

ah, haha NF we had the same thoughts :D
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Postby kc » Mon Oct 18, 2010 5:55 pm

I have taken krill oil (thins blood) before the procedure and still do. I have recently added nattokinase after hearing Irishbear76's video on youtube. I am post procedure 3mos and improving weekly.

Ps DONT FORGET THE VITAMIN D!
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Postby cheerleader » Mon Oct 18, 2010 7:35 pm

kc wrote:I have taken krill oil (thins blood) before the procedure and still do. I have recently added nattokinase after hearing Irishbear76's video on youtube. I am post procedure 3mos and improving weekly.

Ps DONT FORGET THE VITAMIN D!


Hi, KC--Irish bear got his blood thinning info from the Endothelial Health program. There are proteolytic enzymes, lots of antioxidants, vitamin D and all of the science behind it at www.ccsvi.org
Look under "helping myself" for the program. And if you want more info, check out this thread--started this research 2 years ago...
http://www.thisisms.com/ftopict-6318-endothelial.html
hope it helps--
cheer
Husband dx RRMS 3/07
dx dual jugular vein stenosis (CCSVI) 4/09
http://ccsviinms.blogspot.com
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Postby ConstableComfortable » Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:01 pm

Off the back of reading this topic, I bought some 100mg Niacin and took some for the first time today with 500mg of Vit C.
HOLY MOLEY!! Now I see what you mean by 'Flush'. It was like having 'Deep Heat Rub' injected into my veins. My whole body turned pink!

Hats off to those people taking 500mg. Sheesh!
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Postby newlywed4ever » Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:39 pm

ConstableComfortable wrote:Off the back of reading this topic, I bought some 100mg Niacin and took some for the first time today with 500mg of Vit C.
HOLY MOLEY!! Now I see what you mean by 'Flush'. It was like having 'Deep Heat Rub' injected into my veins. My whole body turned pink!

Hats off to those people taking 500mg. Sheesh!


Well, I bought some today!!...now just getting up the nerve...250mg tablet which I intend to cut in 1/2? Sound about right?
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Postby eve » Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:41 pm

Newlywed, i would not take more than 100mg for a first time. For some people that produces a real heavy flush already. For others it might not.

Drink some cold water if it is too intens.

ConstableComfortable, you grow a tolerance to the stuff. So after a while 100 mg will do nothing and you will need to increase the dosage to have a flush. So 500 mg sounds like a lot but honoustly my first flush was worse than any other I had.

btw, I also take an extra strong vitamin/mineral supplement and additional vit D.
dx 2002,RRMS,  suspected begin of MS 1978 (age 10)
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Postby newveins » Wed Oct 20, 2010 6:08 pm

I take nattokinase, eat lots of garlic. Hard to prove whether it helps or not, I have taken nattokinase for over a year for circulation I thought it might warm up my feet no such luck, but it has a lot of benefits besides circulation and blood clot prevention such as join pain reliever and bone density enhancer all unproven, of course, but it has been around for long time so why not it might help.
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Postby EJC » Thu Oct 21, 2010 3:12 pm

Forgive my ignorance on this particular subject, but what is the goal of the Niacin treatment?

I've not come accross this before so do you take Niacin for the 20-30 min "Rush" or is there some lasting relief or build up of relief over time?

How does this compare with Asprin? And for those that take Asprin is this taken in one hit or smaller doses spread over the day?

questions questions!
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