Vit D3>125nmol/L min in blood. FIRST SMALL STEP for pwMS

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.

Postby tzootsi » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:39 am

I believe the only problem with D3 5000 gel caps is that they contain soy. A lot of people try to avoid soy if they are on any kind of MS diet. We use the D3 tablets, which from what I can find, only go up to 2000, so the regimen is 2-3 tablets a day for us.
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Check the ingredients

Postby MarkW » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:56 am

Liquid filled capsules usually contain Vit D3, an oil (usually vegetable, sometimes olive oil), gelatin and glycerin. Some people do not like to take gelatin because it is made from animal bones (cow and pig). I am interested to know which brands of D3 contain soy.

MarkW
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Mark's CCSVI Report 7-Mar-11:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/8359854/MS-experts-in-Britain-have-to-open-their-minds.html
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Postby 1eye » Thu Mar 03, 2011 7:23 am

Of course I would have to hear we get D from the skins of pigs.
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Gelatin is widely used

Postby MarkW » Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:40 am

Pharmaceutical gelatin usually comes from bovine (cow) bones, rather than pig (porcine) bones. However food grade gelatin comes from both porcine (pig) and bovine (cow) bones. Gelatin is used as an additive more widely than many people suspect. Some strict Jews and some strict Muslims will not take gelatin unless they know the source is not porcine.

Not really CCSVI info but I hope it does not stop people using Vit D3 liquid filled soft gelatin capsules as they are the most bioavailable capsule/tablet.

MarkW
Mark Walker - Oxfordshire, England. Registered Pharmacist (UK). 11 years of study around MS.
Mark's CCSVI Report 7-Mar-11:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/8359854/MS-experts-in-Britain-have-to-open-their-minds.html
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MarkW over 200

Postby MarkW » Tue Mar 22, 2011 6:32 am

231 nmol/L was my 25-OH VITAMIN D in a recent (3/3/11) test. This may sound high if you read US/UK guidance. The test was taken just after a long stay in The Gambia (West Africa) during which I continued with my usual dose of 10,000 iu/day of D3. I felt much better in the dry heat (30C/90F) with the vit D. I have no idea if there is a relationship as my n=1 sample was too small.

5-10,000 iu a day is recommended by me for pwMS, a cheap option.

MarkW
Mark Walker - Oxfordshire, England. Registered Pharmacist (UK). 11 years of study around MS.
Mark's CCSVI Report 7-Mar-11:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/8359854/MS-experts-in-Britain-have-to-open-their-minds.html
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vit D

Postby zinamaria » Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:23 am

Hey Mark,

I just read your 'update' article. Thank you for writing it, you make some great points (great pic of you too!)

I appreciate the info on gelatin. I am amazed when I read the fine print (I'm always sitting on the floor in the store isles to make sure what I'm buying is what I want) how much 'stuff' goes into even vitamins. Lately when buying a zinc supplement, I found all kinds of stuff added, like rice starch, soy, or vegetable flour etc. I was surprised.

I wanted to ask you, if you don't mind, what brand of Vit D capsules are you taking?

Thanks,
Z
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Brand of Vit D3 Soft Caps

Postby MarkW » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:38 am

No change since my post on 6 Feb, zinamaria:

"I use Healthy Origins brand but I have no reason to say it is better than any other soft gelatin capsule (liquid filled cap). Making soft gelatin capsules is very specialised (few manufacturers). If the product is US/EU production I am relaxed about the brand."

I buy 5000iu/cap from iherb in California, as they ship worldwide and 5000iu is difficult to purchase/very expensive in UK. PwMS at our therapy centre (www.omstc.org) buy together to reduce shipping costs. Also do not forget local taxes (UK VAT is 20% ! ) when comparing prices.

There are 10,000 iu softcaps available but I suggest starting with 5000iu/day for 2-3 months before getting a blood level check. I am happy with a result of 150-250 nmol/L for 25-OH VITAMIN D. UK GPs may be happier with 150. Not sure about other parts of the world.

A new product of Vit D3 in sub-lingual tabs (10,000iu/tab) are available. The theory behind this tablet is fine but I have not seen dissolution or bioavailability data for them so would not recommend them at this time. This tab contains lactose.

Liquid products are fine, if you are prepared to do the precise measuring.

Sorry for the late reply, I was on a short getaway/micro vacation.

MarkW
Mark Walker - Oxfordshire, England. Registered Pharmacist (UK). 11 years of study around MS.
Mark's CCSVI Report 7-Mar-11:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/8359854/MS-experts-in-Britain-have-to-open-their-minds.html
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Postby jimmylegs » Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:54 am

i had a quick scroll back looking for mention of balancing supplemental d3 with calcium, magnesium, and zinc, not to mention timing it right.

i suffered major problems from magnesium depletion as a result of taking my daily calcium and magnesium supplement at the same time as the d3.

i happened to be in a pharmacy one day and asked a couple of unrelated questions but quickly the man behind the counter was questioning me about the d3 and my symptoms and he told me to take some magnesium with the d3 but to make sure i took some at a different time.

i followed up on his advice and some issues i'd had with my throat resolved in days. it wasn't a coincidence because i stopped taking mag and it came back. for some months every time i took magnesium i would feel it kick in with a series of quick 'knocks' in my throat.

at this stage i have been supplementing magnesium properly for so long that i don't get the knock any more. that's not to say i didn't run into problems with the various available forms of supplemental mag. but i also make a concerted effort to have lots of magnesium rich foods in my diet.

also, i used to take x amount of vit d3 with such and such change in my levels. then while trying to resolve a refractory low uric acid condiiton (i was at 188-194 umol/L for years, this is basically the average for ms patients, to a little below average), i discovered the link to zinc. ie depleting zinc depletes serum uric acid. maybe if i took zinc my uric acid level would go up.

ms patients are low in zinc and i had been a vegan for so long it made sense i'd be deficient. tested it and i was 8.6 umol/L when healthy controls average around 18 umol/L.

supplemental zinc got my levels up to 16.1 umol/L, and the low uric acid improved dramatically (from 194 - the ms average - to 278 which approaches healthy control levels of 290-300) i had been eating gout-inducing foods unsucessfully for years but the zinc pills did the trick.

also, my dose-response to vit d3 tripled and at one test my level was 271 nmol/L.

so zinc is helping my body work better in two ways that i've been able to measure with lab testing. there were a number of other improvements that i don't have lab results for but zinc was very important to helping my body deal with d3.

HTH anyone!
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Keep it simple or seek advice

Postby MarkW » Mon Mar 28, 2011 9:33 am

I am just trying to get pwMS to take daily Vit D3, Jimmylegs. You are correct that calcium, magnesium, and zinc, and timing taking them right are important for many pwMS. Selenium should be added to a 'think about this' list of minerals. As as vegan I hope you receive personalised nutritional advice. There are many factors to consider with mineral supplements so I avoid trying to give general advice to pwMS.

Vit D3 is an important gene and immune system regulator, as well as being beneficial for vascular health. Hence the title of this thread.

MarkW
Mark Walker - Oxfordshire, England. Registered Pharmacist (UK). 11 years of study around MS.
Mark's CCSVI Report 7-Mar-11:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/8359854/MS-experts-in-Britain-have-to-open-their-minds.html
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Postby jimmylegs » Mon Mar 28, 2011 4:45 pm

i would not recommend d3 on its own especially not at high doses. i thought i would just suffocate one day stuck half way through a swallow. i really thought i was going to die before i learned it was a side effect of too much d3 dragging down my magnesium levels.

selenium's definitely on my list of dailies! 2 brazil nuts per day, for those who like em! :)

i got horrible nutritional advice when i was a vegan. as an ex vegan i have figured my own way out of the hole, by reading and using the lab a lot. long tough slog! but it works :D
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vit D

Postby zinamaria » Mon Mar 28, 2011 4:53 pm

yes! I too eat my two brazil nuts a day!!
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Postby jimmylegs » Mon Mar 28, 2011 4:56 pm

like! lol :D
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Take Vitamin D Before and After De-Stenosis

Postby MarkW » Sat Apr 09, 2011 2:10 am

Bump - Take Vitamin D Before and After De-Stenosis

Vit D3 is an important gene and immune system regulator, as well as being beneficial for vascular health. Hence the title of this thread. Yes think about other vitamines and minerals you take but do not miss vit D3.

Quoting Cheer:
There are more and more studies coming out every day confirming vit. D's positive effect on the endothelial cells that line our blood vessels. Here's a study out this week that discusses vasodilation and Vit. D---
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 205232.htm

for more information, make sure to check out the Endothelial Health Program---
http://www.ccsvi.org/index.php/helping- ... ial-health

MarkW
Mark Walker - Oxfordshire, England. Registered Pharmacist (UK). 11 years of study around MS.
Mark's CCSVI Report 7-Mar-11:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/8359854/MS-experts-in-Britain-have-to-open-their-minds.html
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Postby Ernst » Sat Apr 09, 2011 3:05 am

Vitamin D, so important in many things, especially with MS.. or with vascular health. I have been very interested about D3 and red quite many research papers about it. I also made one webpage, just to promote the importance about vitamin D here in Finland. My page:

http://sites.google.com/site/erkkikuure/d-vitamiinijams

(sorry, in finnish.. but there are reseach links about vitamin d in multiple sclerosis). I should update the page now.
My wife's 3 yrs post video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLeqLps8XR8

Our family: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_QCKxeQAlg
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Postby Liberation » Sat Apr 09, 2011 3:57 am

Someone posted the following:

A small dose of vitamin D3 resulted in significant exacerbation of intimal hyperplasia in this rat carotid artery model and raises the question of the role of dietary vitamin D3 in restenosis following vascular intervention


Any view on this?
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