An Open Letter to Mark Freedman

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.

Postby scorpion » Fri Dec 10, 2010 5:11 am

NHE wrote:
scorpion wrote:Hey Tmrox. Dr. Embry has developed a diet that he claims slows down(or maybe even stops) the MS diesase process. You can find the list of his foods on Direct-MS with lots of testimonials stating how the diet has "stopped MS in its tracks" and in some cases even improved symptoms. Dr. Embry stated he values empirical evidence and I was curious how he determined "empirically" that his diet was an effective therapy against MS. The 90% statement also baffled me. As for Freedman I wish he would change his style of confronation because as with Dr. Embry he sounds like a little child screaming "nanananana!" Thanks for responding to my post with some good solid points.


My encounters with Ashton Embry's writing is that it typically comes across as highly professional.

NHE


I also believe Embry to be a very articulate and professional writer. That is not what I am saying. I was referring to his lack of scientific proof relating the claims he made in his article.
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Postby pairOdime » Fri Dec 10, 2010 5:26 am

Dr. Embry mentioned in his letter that leading MS researchers found
the CRABS drugs lacking in their ability to even slow MS progression.

In fact, we now have a three long term studies which indicate that the drugs do not slow MS progression by showing that those on the drugs reached the same EDSS end points in the same time as those not on the drugs (Boggild et al, 2009; Veugelers et al, 2009; Ebers et al, 2010).

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Postby scorpion » Fri Dec 10, 2010 5:31 am

pairOdime wrote:Dr. Embry mentioned in his letter that leading MS researchers found
the CRABS drugs lacking in their ability to even slow MS progression.

In fact, we now have a three long term studies which indicate that the drugs do not slow MS progression by showing that those on the drugs reached the same EDSS end points in the same time as those not on the drugs (Boggild et al, 2009; Veugelers et al, 2009; Ebers et al, 2010).

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There are studies showing that CRAB drugs slow progression and studies showing they do not have much effect on MS. People tend to focus on whichever studies best suit what they believe. However if you reread my post I was not referring to Dr. Embry's statements regarding CRAB drugs.
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Postby erinc14 » Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:57 am

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Postby scorpion » Fri Dec 10, 2010 8:01 am



I did not have sexuall relations with that girl ericnc14!!!!!!Good one. Seriously though I would like a response from Dr. Embry to the questions I posed and not for him to "blow me off". :wink:
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Postby concerned » Fri Dec 10, 2010 8:03 am

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Postby VeeBee » Fri Dec 10, 2010 8:10 am

It's an "Open Letter", more of an invitation to discuss. It's intended for a larger audience because doors are closed within the hierarchy of the scientific field where scientists can talk science till their hearts content.

If it was purely science based, Dr Embry has a website to publish on but talking to a facebook audience is hardly the place for a scientific discussion although a few scientists will read.

Peer pressure has a part to play as many patients are beginning to think the medical hierarchy are snorting superglue

"of the 12,000+ patients treated so far, over 90% have had undoubted CCSVI."


If I was to be picky I'd ask Dr Embry to rephrase the above statement as there seems to be much confusion over actual figures. It doesn't really detract from the point but I don’t think anyone is sure of the numbers, so it might appear sensationalism.

I don't know Dr Freedman's views on superglue but from what I understand he clearly focuses on chemicals. Dr Embry stated his concerns on the lack of support for Vitamin D, etc, backed strongly by science. Much of his 42 years revolves around vascular health.

Call it serendipity if you want but Dr Embry has an educated opinion, and much can be backed with solid scientific theory. Dr Freedman is making bizarre statements on a regular basis, possibly backed by superglue or some other chemical ideology, that lacks sound scientific proof. I think Dr Embry is asking him why & just hoping to further the conversation scientifically or asking him to shut his gub.

Science goes round in circles & it sure as hell hasn't come close to fixing MS (quite the opposite). Personally, I rate Dr Embry's contribution to CCSVI higher than Dr Freedman's but like the rest of this post, just an observation.

I question Dr Freedman's motives for his outbursts in the media. I question his logic & reasoning. I question his ability to represent those with MS impartially. I suggest Dr Freedman is avoiding issues with disinformation tactics, avoiding issues with his own variation of nonsense.

I advise Dr Embry to check over his information until there is no possibility of rebuff, facebook or otherwise because he knows nothing short of watertight will fly, unless it's a discussion on superglue.
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Postby concerned » Fri Dec 10, 2010 8:14 am

VeeBee wrote:
I advise Dr Embry to check over his information until there is no possibility of rebuff, facebook or otherwise because he knows nothing short of watertight will fly, unless it's a discussion on superglue.


or grape seed extract!
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Postby scorpion » Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:09 am

concerned wrote:
VeeBee wrote:
I advise Dr Embry to check over his information until there is no possibility of rebuff, facebook or otherwise because he knows nothing short of watertight will fly, unless it's a discussion on superglue.


or grape seed extract!


Hey concerned funny you mentioned the grape seed extract. There was actually an article on the interent yesterday about purple fruits and MS! I can not seem to find it though...
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Postby concerned » Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:10 am

Yeah I read that. Just google news search multiple sclerosis.
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Postby concerned » Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:13 am

http://www.craegmoor.co.uk/industry-new ... lzheimers/


Dr Simon Ridley, head of research at the Alzheimer's Research Trust, the UK's leading dementia research charity, said: "It is important to note that this author's report does not describe the results of a new study, but puts forward one theory about the possible causes of Alzheimer's disease.

"We need to see more research into this theory before we'll know if iron has any role to play in developing dementia."

Last month, research conducted at the University of Dundee found that a drug commonly used to treat diabetes could have a positive effect on people with Alzheimer's.
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Postby scorpion » Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:15 am

concerned wrote:http://www.craegmoor.co.uk/industry-news/article/800282975/purple-fruit-can-help-ward-off-alzheimers/


Dr Simon Ridley, head of research at the Alzheimer's Research Trust, the UK's leading dementia research charity, said: "It is important to note that this author's report does not describe the results of a new study, but puts forward one theory about the possible causes of Alzheimer's disease.

"We need to see more research into this theory before we'll know if iron has any role to play in developing dementia."

Last month, research conducted at the University of Dundee found that a drug commonly used to treat diabetes could have a positive effect on people with Alzheimer's.


Nice to see they are humble enough to admit it is just a theory!
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Postby HappyPoet » Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:17 am

VeeBee wrote:It's an "Open Letter", more of an invitation to discuss. It's intended for a larger audience because doors are closed within the hierarchy of the scientific field where scientists can talk science till their hearts content.

If it was purely science based, Dr Embry has a website to publish on but talking to a facebook audience is hardly the place for a scientific discussion although a few scientists will read.

Peer pressure has a part to play as many patients are beginning to think the medical hierarchy are snorting superglue

"of the 12,000+ patients treated so far, over 90% have had undoubted CCSVI."


If I was to be picky I'd ask Dr Embry to rephrase the above statement as there seems to be much confusion over actual figures. It doesn't really detract from the point but I don’t think anyone is sure of the numbers, so it might appear sensationalism.

I don't know Dr Freedman's views on superglue but from what I understand he clearly focuses on chemicals. Dr Embry stated his concerns on the lack of support for Vitamin D, etc, backed strongly by science. Much of his 42 years revolves around vascular health.

Call it serendipity if you want but Dr Embry has an educated opinion, and much can be backed with solid scientific theory. Dr Freedman is making bizarre statements on a regular basis, possibly backed by superglue or some other chemical ideology, that lacks sound scientific proof. I think Dr Embry is asking him why & just hoping to further the conversation scientifically or asking him to shut his gub.

Science goes round in circles & it sure as hell hasn't come close to fixing MS (quite the opposite). Personally, I rate Dr Embry's contribution to CCSVI higher than Dr Freedman's but like the rest of this post, just an observation.

I question Dr Freedman's motives for his outbursts in the media. I question his logic & reasoning. I question his ability to represent those with MS impartially. I suggest Dr Freedman is avoiding issues with disinformation tactics, avoiding issues with his own variation of nonsense.

I advise Dr Embry to check over his information until there is no possibility of rebuff, facebook or otherwise because he knows nothing short of watertight will fly, unless it's a discussion on superglue.

VeeBee,
Fantastic post! Everything you say is spot on. You have a gift of translating astute observations into terrific prose. Love the superglue joke woven throughout.
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