This Is MS Multiple Sclerosis Community: Knowledge & Support

Welcome to the world's leading forum on Multiple Sclerosis research, support, and knowledge. For over 10 years, This is MS has provided an unbiased community dedicated to Multiple Sclerosis patients, caregivers, and affected loved ones.
It is currently Wed May 22, 2013 7:31 am


All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:32 pm 
Offline
Family Elder

Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:00 pm
Posts: 8506
Fourth Chilean Workshop on Numerical Analysis of Partial Differential Equations
January 14 - 18, 2013

http://www.ci2ma.udec.cl/wonapde2013/mi ... r-TORO.pdf

Lucas Mueller and Eleuturio Toro are presenting on the mathematical modelling of CCSVI.
Quote:
MODELLING OF CHRONIC CEREBRO SPINAL VENOUS
INSUFFICIENCY (CCSVI)

Abstract. Recently, Zamboni (2009) and collaborators have empirically discovered that a signiffcant number of Multiple Sclerosis (MS) patients suffer from malformations in the veins that drain blood from the brain and the spinal cord. Such condition has become known as Chronic Cerebro Spinal Venous Insuciency, or CCSVI for short. Zamboni and collaborators go further, see Singh and Zamboni (2009). They have put forward the hypothesis that anomalous venous haemodynamics could ultimately be the triggering mechanism of axon demyelination and MS.

In this presentation we describe our current work that aims at the construction of a closed-loop mathematical model of the human circulatory system to study the haemodynamical implications observed by Zamboni. Based on MRI data we have been able to construct a complex vascular network treated in multi-scale fashion as a combination of 0D (ODEs) and 1D hyperbolic systems. Here we address some of the mathematical and numerical challenges posed by the problem of interest. See Mueller et al. (2012). Preliminary results will be shown.

Computational physics is not something I've studied, to say the least. But this looks interesting.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:35 pm 
Offline
Family Elder

Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:00 pm
Posts: 8506
some more information
http://www.ing.unitn.it/~toroe/Document ... roject.pdf
Quote:
Computer simulation of blood flow in the intra/extra cranial venous
system in humans with multiple sclerosis and the CCSVI condition

Summary and aims of the research programme

This research programme is motivated by the recently proposed association between multiple sclerosis (MS) and a vascular anomaly termed chronic cerebro-spinal venous insufficiency (CCSVI) by Zamboni and collaborators. The CCSVI condition is characterized by the presence of obstructions of various kinds in the extracranial veins. Such obstructions prevent a normal drainage of blood from the brain to the heart. CCSVI is present in a relevant number of MS patients and such occurrence is of great clinical interest. However such association does not yet explain the gestation of MS, although it has been hypothesized a potential link between the altered fluid dynamics, transport and deposition of iron, disruption of the brain- blood barrier and penetration of autoaggressive immune cells into the CNS, with the known consequences of demyelization of the nerve’s sheath.

This research programme is limited to a theoretical study of the bio-fluid dynamical aspects of the CCSVI condition by means of a mathematical model. The aim is to further investigate the physical phenomena observed empirically by Zamboni and collaborators by means of colour Doppler sonography measurements. The research programme has several distinct parts, including (1) the determination of the computational domain, (2) the construction of a mathematical model for the fluid dynamical problem and (3) the development of computational methods that would allow a computer simulation of the phenomena of interest. There would follow a (4) comparison between theoretical simulation and empirical measurements, (5) use of the theoretical model to study of Zamboni's protocol for testing the CCSVI condition and (6) the formulation of recommendations. If successful, the theoretical tool developed could subsequently be used as the basis for further research, for example to assist potential surgery and to perhaps even associate the anomalous fluid dynamics to the anomalous behaviour of the brain blood barrier, an accepted component of multiple sclerosis.


http://www.ing.unitn.it/~toroe/Research ... oject.html
Quote:
REMISSION: a long-term research project on REsearch into Mathematical modelling of multIple SclerosiS and its vascular connectION
Professor Eleuterio Toro


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:37 am 
Offline
Family Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:00 pm
Posts: 34
Cece

Thanks for posting this. The application of Computational Fluid Dynamics to venous flow in CCSVI is exactly what I had advocated in my papers and presentations a year ago. I expect this approach should be able to calculate the dynamic pressure distributions in the venules and hopefully relate the over-pressures to BBB disruption. I note they are using US for trials validation of computational results. I suspect they may have, ultimately, to use Flow Quantification MRI for the trial measurement accuracy they may need for computational model validation. However, to me it looks like a great initiative.

Thanks again for posting this because except for the occasional browse through TIMS, other things in my life have dictated I put down my watching brief on the science as it occurs.

Trev. Tucker


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:42 am 
Offline
Family Elder

Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:00 pm
Posts: 8506
Quote:
The aim is to further investigate the physical phenomena observed empirically by Zamboni and collaborators by means of colour Doppler sonography measurements.
Quote:
Based on MRI data we have been able to construct a complex vascular network treated in multi-scale fashion as a combination of 0D (ODEs) and 1D hyperbolic systems.

The doppler sonography measurements is mentioned but then MRI data is mentioned too. Based on MRI data, we have been able to construct a complex vascular network treated in multi-scale fashion as a combination of 0D and 1D hyperbolic systems -- could that mean they are using flow quantification MRI data?
ttucker3 wrote:
I expect this approach should be able to calculate the dynamic pressure distributions in the venules and hopefully relate the over-pressures to BBB disruption.

I am curious if their equations and findings will be in agreement with some of the ideas you presented a year ago. The incoming pressure wave combining additively with the refluxing pressure to create points of focal hypertension.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:42 pm 
Offline
Newbie
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 30, 2010 3:00 pm
Posts: 9
I understand only enough of this to wonder why CSF is not being included in a study of the fluid dynamics of the brain. CSF and it's flow (or lack of) affects pressure in the brain and venous system.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:15 am 
Offline
Family Elder
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 3:00 pm
Posts: 940
Location: St Lazare Quebec
Bluejeans wrote:
I understand only enough of this to wonder why CSF is not being included in a study of the fluid dynamics of the brain. CSF and it's flow (or lack of) affects pressure in the brain and venous system.

I am with Bluejeans here. From my experience and others that angioplasty did not have lasting effects, possibly It starts with impaired CSF flow which will cause blood flow problems. Check this out.
http://uprightdoctor.wordpress.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:15 pm 
Offline
Family Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:00 pm
Posts: 34
I also agree that ultimately CSF pressure distributions will have to be included is CFD analysis. With compliant vein walls the pressure distributions in the veins are going to be transmitted into the CSF and the boundary conditions for CFD analysis, including both blood and CSF pressures, will ultimately be the non-compliant hard shell of the skull. I have a vision of an outline for the solution direction, but I don't have the patient trials data and I don't have the CFD analysis software. But I am fully familiar with doing computations of models of equal or even greater complexity.
Trev. Tucker


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:13 am 
Offline
Family Elder
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 4:00 pm
Posts: 690
An animal model has been slow in arriving, comp sic models sound good.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:41 am 
Offline
Family Elder

Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:00 pm
Posts: 8506
http://www.fondazionehilarescere.org/pdf/VHISS-CSF.pdf
Quote:
Our findings, demonstrating that CCSVI has a significant impact on brain pathophysiology, and particularly on the balance of intracranial fluids, could provide stimulation for the development, in the future, of mathematical models currently lacking (probably because the description of CCSVI is so recent). A model is needed in which increased resistance of venous outflow is partially corrected by the development of collateral circulations (2, 19). Speculatively the imbalance in CSF filtration-reabsorption processes might be related to increased transmural pressure in the condition of CCSVI (1,5,23,24).

Dr. Zamboni himself sees the need for the mathematical modelling of CCSVI.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:48 am 
Offline
Family Elder

Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:00 pm
Posts: 8506
http://www.ing.unitn.it/~toroe/
Quote:
My research includes the construction of computational methods for solving differential equations, with particular emphasis on hyperbolic balance laws. Scientists world-wide have applied these methods to many areas, such as astrophysics, shock-wave physics, relativity, meteorology, combustion, propulsion, aerodynamics, environmental sciences, industrial and biomedical problems.

For the last 20 years I have been working on the construction of non-linear numerical methods of arbitrary order of accuracy in space and time, the ADER methods. Very high order methods have a huge efficiency gain that increases the power of mathematical modelling and simulation in science and engineering. The ADER numerical techniques have so far been found to be relevant in astrophysics, aero-acoustics, seismology, tsunami wave propagation and biomedical applications.

I am currently focused on the study of the physics of neurodegenerative diseases and their potential link to venous haemodynamics. Of particular interest is the theoretical elucidation of the link between Multiple Sclerosis and vascular anomalies, such as Chronic Cerebro-Spinal Venous Insufficiency (CCSVI), empirically discovered by Zamboni (2009). We are making progress on this very timely theme of practical relevance to so many people around the world. Advances are possible thanks to the contribution of PhD students, post-doctoral fellows, colleagues in Trento and collaboration with academics and medical doctors in Europe, USA and elsewhere.


Professor Toro is moderating a workshop today in Italy: http://www.ing.unitn.it/~toroe/Document ... 2012_B.pdf
Quote:
14:00-14:15. Professor Eleuterio Toro. Welcome address and introduction
14:15-15:15. Dr. MD Franz Schelling. Invited Speaker. Predictable outcomes of interventions for CCSVI in Multiple Sclerosis?
15:15-16:00. Lucas Mueller. Introduction by Professor Eleuterio Toro. Construction of a mathematical model for the study of haemodynamical aspects of CCSVI
16:00-16:15. Break
16:15-16:45. Dr. Alfonso Caiazzo and Gino Montecinos. Computational haemodynamics in stenotic internal jugular veins.
16:45-17:15. Miss Laura Facchini. Introduction by Professor Alberto Bellin. The impact of pressure disorder on solute exchange across micro-vessel walls.
17:15-17:30. Discussion.
Everyone welcome!
Contact: Professor E F Toro.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:12 pm 
Offline
Newbie
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 30, 2010 3:00 pm
Posts: 9
Would upright positioning add value to the computer modeling?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:30 pm 
Offline
Family Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:00 pm
Posts: 34
Thank you Prof. Toro and U Trento. Brilliant set of initiatives. May your vision on the application of CFD to venous haemodynamics match that of Prof Zamboni in his vision of relating MS to venous haemodynamics. I shouldn't be surprised if, from these initiatives, the origins of MS (and some similar diseases) are identified with sufficient scientific substance to be broadly accepted. If so, all those involved will deserve to be on the short list for the Nobel Prize for Medicine - perhaps win it outright at some point in time.
Trev. Tucker


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:00 pm 
Offline
Family Elder

Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:00 pm
Posts: 8506
If the abstract mentions Navier-Stokes, then I know we're talking physics, even if I don't understand all of the abstract.
Dr. Tucker, your work is listed in the references.
Quote:
COMPUTATIONAL HAEMODYNAMICS IN STENOTIC INTERNAL JUGULAR VEINS

Alfonso Caiazzo, PhD1, Gino Montecinos, MS1, Lucas Mueller Omar, MS1, Eleuterio
Toro Francisco, PhD1, Ewart Haacke Mark, PhD2

1 Universita di Trento, via Mesiano 77, Trento, TN, Trento, Italy
2 Wayne State University, 3990 John R Road, Detroit, MI 48201, USA.
Quote:
Figure 1 shows a set of preliminary results for a stenotic LIJV. In particular, in the original configuration (Fig.1, left) the pressure difference between LIJVs inlet and outlet is around 1 mmHg, while, in the case of a stenosis, we observe that a significant increase in IJV pressure drop (above 1.5 mmHg) is achieved with a reduction of the CSA of more than 50% (Fig. 1, center and right). Further results will be presented during the conference.

This work represents a first step towards a computer-aided understanding of CCSVI haemodynamics in a patient-specific context. Future developments will focus on the implementation of Fluid-Structure Interaction models to account for veins compliance, and on the incorporation of this framework into a multi-scale global model of the cardiovascular system.

The full abstract and the graphs are here: http://isnvd2013.euromedicpoland.com/us ... tracts.pdf


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Related topics
 Topics   Author   Replies   Views   Last post 
There are no new unread posts for this topic. Physics of hematology

1eye

10

1633

Tue Jan 04, 2011 8:07 am

jimmylegs View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. 2011 CCSVI Symposium Videos--a great CCSVI primer

Anonymoose

0

279

Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:53 am

Anonymoose View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. CCSVI "CCSVI tracking project" french language !

Fred1208

2

1103

Thu May 06, 2010 7:27 am

Fred1208 View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. CCSVI TESTING / TESTS CCSVI *CANADA*

SickButHappy

2

2296

Fri Apr 30, 2010 9:48 am

eveable View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. CCSVI 101--a new video by Dr. Siskin from CCSVI Alliance

cheerleader

4

1368

Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:16 am

cheerleader View the latest post

 


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: