Paleo Diet discussion

A board to discuss various diet-centered approaches to treating or controlling Multiple Sclerosis, e.g., the Swank Diet

Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby lyndacarol » Sun May 05, 2013 12:13 pm

These are hypotheses. When one of these or another hypothesis is PROVEN – with repeatable, irrefutable evidence – that is a theory, and will hold the answer to our MS!

I think you have a good suggestion, chico: a basic set of dietary/lifestyle guidelines would be a good idea. Let us start with:

#1 Remove ALL trans fats from the diet.

#2 Remove all sugar (including beer, wine, etc. which have sugar), remove all artificial sweeteners, including sugar alcohols (polyols) such as sorbitol, xylitol, mannitol, erythritol, lactitol, etc. (sugar alcohols are "sweeter" than sugar), and remove white flour, white bread, white potatoes, white rice (which convert readily to glucose, a.k.a. blood sugar, in the body) from your diet.
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Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby CaveMan » Sun May 05, 2013 3:04 pm

chico wrote:Everyone (including myself) with celiac or gluten sensitivity should be concerned about gluten.
Thats clear to me. This is also my takeaway from reading the article from huffingtonpost. I missed out on the MS connection thou.

I am aware that one study has found a higher incidence of celiac among people with MS. Other have failed to show this correlation.
But I am still in need of solid evidence that one without gluten sensitivities should cut out whole grains. There is strong evidence that whole grains can lower risk of cardiovascular diseases.


How will you know if you are sensitive to Gluten or Grain products, the only test for a singular antibody against Gliadin, which is only one of the thousands of different complex proteins present in grains. Coeliac disease is just the tip of the iceberg, it goes down in layers and they are discovering Non Gliadin Gluten sensitivity, that is individuals with a range of different symptoms that self resolve when the wheat products are removed from the diet. Now you need to understand this is only individuals with severe symptoms because they are seeking relief, there is countless people out there with apparantly mild symptoms that they just bear with it because they are too vague for doctors to diagnose.
Before I dropped grains, I was healthy or so I thought, but within 3 months a whole range of different minor issues just resolved, and I'm pretty sure it was wheat products because I did fall off the wagon and the symptoms came back and then went away again when I stopped them. Point is you won't really know if you are sensitive unless you actually do a full elimination diet.

That link you posted was a press release and I could not access the study, unless you can see the actual study and determine how they drew their conclusions, there is no way to verify the claims of a press release. They were persistantly referring to wholegrain bread and that suggests to me it probably not far different to every other study I've seen on that topic and they all draw a conclusion to say wholegrain bread is healthy when they compare wholegrain to processed grains, there have been none that I have seen that actually compared grain to no grains consumption. So you can not conclude that wholegrains are healthy, they are just healthier than processed grains.
I am just an interested individual trying to crack the autoimmune nut.
Partner has Graves Disease, 5 years, showing good test results, looking forward to potential remission in the near future.
3 friends have MS, 1 just recently diagnosed, severity 7/10.
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Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby CaveMan » Sun May 05, 2013 3:07 pm

lyndacarol wrote:These are hypotheses. When one of these or another hypothesis is PROVEN – with repeatable, irrefutable evidence – that is a theory, and will hold the answer to our MS!

I think you have a good suggestion, chico: a basic set of dietary/lifestyle guidelines would be a good idea. Let us start with:

#1 Remove ALL trans fats from the diet.

#2 Remove all sugar (including beer, wine, etc. which have sugar), remove all artificial sweeteners, including sugar alcohols (polyols) such as sorbitol, xylitol, mannitol, erythritol, lactitol, etc. (sugar alcohols are "sweeter" than sugar), and remove white flour, white bread, white potatoes, white rice (which convert readily to glucose, a.k.a. blood sugar, in the body) from your diet.


I'd add:
3/ Remove all processed foods, they have the bulk of additives and toxins.
I am just an interested individual trying to crack the autoimmune nut.
Partner has Graves Disease, 5 years, showing good test results, looking forward to potential remission in the near future.
3 friends have MS, 1 just recently diagnosed, severity 7/10.
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Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby want2bike » Mon May 06, 2013 6:42 am

Everyone is looking for the cause of MS. That is a loser game. There is no one cause of MS. MS is cause by toxins in the body. MS is reversed by diet. To some people gluten becomes a toxin. The only way to find out if it is a toxin for you is to try an elimination diet for a month and see how you feel. Gluten is not the only toxin out there. Our bodies are all different and each of us must find the correct diet. One thing for sure you can't go wrong with the fruits and vegetables if you stay away from the GMO garbage. As Dr. Bergman explains when you stop putting toxins in the body and eat healthy food you get better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGmyUppmt-g
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Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby CaveMan » Mon May 06, 2013 3:48 pm

want2bike wrote:stop putting toxins in the body and eat healthy food


I think everyone agrees with that as a general statement, the questions arise as to the definition of toxins & healthy foods.
Everyone has a different set of experiences and knowledge based on their own reading and with the conflicting amount of information at this stage there is no clearly defined singular approach, so it is a matter of working from the outside and determining what are the universally agreed toxins as far as food goes, even there you see significant dispute.
In my opinion Wheat family grains, Soy & Vegetable oils are absolute toxins and I think everyone should stop eating them, but others do not have the same view as me, am I wrong or are they wrong, only time will tell, maybe we're both right and it is dependant on the individual and that then just makes it even more confusing.

One can only look at the data and make an informed decision for themselves always keeping in mind that new information may come to light which may suggest they may need to revise their original decisions and modify their process, when we close our minds and refuse to consider other information this is when we become lost.
I am just an interested individual trying to crack the autoimmune nut.
Partner has Graves Disease, 5 years, showing good test results, looking forward to potential remission in the near future.
3 friends have MS, 1 just recently diagnosed, severity 7/10.
CaveMan
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Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby lyndacarol » Tue Jun 11, 2013 12:25 pm

chico wrote:I am aware that one study has found a higher incidence of celiac among people with MS. Other have failed to show this correlation.
But I am still in need of solid evidence that one without gluten sensitivities should cut out whole grains. There is strong evidence that whole grains can lower risk of cardiovascular diseases.

I am almost halfway through reading Wheat Belly, a book by Dr. William Davis, which discusses celiac disease and gluten sensitivity. The book has many references to studies and information; the author has specifically mentioned that one can have gluten sensitivities without the traditional symptoms and markers – he recommends that wheat in any form – whole wheat, whole grain, high fiber – should be eliminated from the diet.

By the way, one of wheat's effects is on the glucose/insulin system. Wheat spikes insulin more than table sugar or eating candy bars! I encourage every reader here to read this book.
Last edited by lyndacarol on Sat Jun 22, 2013 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
My hypothesis: excess insulin (hyperinsulinemia) plays a major role in MS, as developed in my initial post: http://www.thisisms.com/forum/general-discussion-f1/topic1878.html "Insulin – Could This Be the Key?"
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Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby erinc14 » Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:29 am

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Re: Paleo Diet discussion

Postby CaveMan » Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:19 pm

lyndacarol wrote:
chico wrote:I am aware that one study has found a higher incidence of celiac among people with MS. Other have failed to show this correlation.
But I am still in need of solid evidence that one without gluten sensitivities should cut out whole grains. There is strong evidence that whole grains can lower risk of cardiovascular diseases.

I am almost halfway through reading Wheat Belly, a book by Dr. William Davis, which discusses celiac disease and gluten sensitivity. The book has many references to studies and information; the author has specifically mentioned that one can have gluten sensitivities without the traditional symptoms and markers – he recommends that wheat in any form – whole wheat, whole grain, high fiber – should be eliminated from the diet.

By the way, one of wheat's effects is on the glucose/insulin system. Wheat spikes insulin more than table sugar or eating candy bars! I encourage every reader here to read this book.


The thing about Wheat and Gluten is that modern wheat is far removed from it's wild counterpart, it is a high gluten GMO and gluten (Gliadin) is not the only poly peptide in wheat that the body reacts to with antibodies, the problem is we do not have tests to identify all the different antibodies, so we classify such individuals as "non gluten sensitivity", which means yes they do react badly to wheat, but we have not identified the particular compound or mechanism yet.
I am just an interested individual trying to crack the autoimmune nut.
Partner has Graves Disease, 5 years, showing good test results, looking forward to potential remission in the near future.
3 friends have MS, 1 just recently diagnosed, severity 7/10.
CaveMan
Family Elder
 
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:11 pm

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