Bacteriotherapy - 3 cases of MS remission

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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby RyanYum » Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:34 pm

Whatever causes ms probably effects the gut microbe and causes other symptoms. I actually started having bad stools after my symptom onset, so i'd imagine it could clear up some nutrient deficiencies. What would be more interesting is if they checked up on those patients gut flora in a few years to see if the micro flora had changed back.
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby NHE » Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:35 pm

Pills made from poop cure serious gut infections
By Marilynn Marchione, The Associated Press, 10/3/2013

It’s a gross topic, but a serious problem. Half a million Americans get Clostridium difficile, or C-diff, infections each year, and about 14,000 die. But now there is a pill full of clean microbes that doesn’t smell and can replace an invasive procedure.

Hold your nose and don’t spit out your coffee: Doctors have found a way to put healthy people’s poop into pills that can cure serious gut infections, a (slightly) less yucky way to do “fecal transplants.” Canadian researchers tried this on 27 patients and cured them all after strong antibiotics failed to help.

It’s a gross topic, but a serious problem. Half a million Americans get Clostridium difficile, or C-diff, infections each year, and about 14,000 die.

The germ causes nausea, cramping and diarrhea so serious that it is often disabling. A very potent and pricey antibiotic can kill C-diff, but also destroys good bacteria that live in the gut, leaving it more susceptible to future infections.

Recently, studies have shown that fecal transplants — giving infected people stool from a healthy donor — can restore that balance.

But they’re given through expensive, invasive procedures such as colonoscopies or throat tubes. Doctors also have tried giving the stool through enemas, but the treatment doesn’t always take hold.

There even are YouTube videos on how to do a similar treatment at home via an enema. A study in a medical journal of a small number of these “do-it-yourself” cases suggests the approach is safe and effective.

Dr. Thomas Louie, an infectious-disease specialist at the University of Calgary, in Alberta, devised a better way: a one-time treatment custom-made for each patient. “There is no smell. We basically have a little cubette of microbes and we pour it into the capsules,” he said.

Donor stool, usually from a relative, is processed in the lab to take out food and extract the bacteria and clean it. It is packed into triple-coated gel capsules so they won’t dissolve until they reach the intestines.

“There’s no stool left — just stool bugs. These people are not eating poop,” and there are no smelly burps because the contents aren’t released until they’re well past the stomach, Louie said.

Days before starting the treatment, patients are given an antibiotic to kill the C-diff. On the morning of the treatment, they have an enema so “the new bacteria coming in have a clean slate,” Louie said.

It takes 24 to 34 capsules to fit the bacteria needed for a treatment, and patients down them in one sitting. The pills make their way to the colon and seed it with the normal variety of bacteria.

Louie described 27 patients treated this way on Thursday at IDWeek, an infectious-diseases conference in San Francisco. All had suffered at least four C-diff infections and relapses, but none had a recurrence after taking the pills.

Dr. Curtis Donskey of the Cleveland Veterans Affairs Medical Center, who has done fecal transplants through colonoscopies, praised the work: “The approach that Dr. Louie has is completely novel. I am optimistic that this type of preparation will make these procedures much easier for patients and for physicians.”

The treatment now must be made fresh for each patient so the pills don’t start to dissolve at room temperature, because their water content would break down the gel coating. Minnesota doctors are testing freezing stool, which doesn’t kill the bacteria, so it could be stored and shipped anywhere a patient needed it.

“You could have a universal donor in Minnesota provide a transplant for someone in Florida. That’s where we’re heading,” Donskey said.
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby CureOrBust » Sun Oct 06, 2013 8:35 pm

source wrote:Pills made from poop cure serious gut infections
By Marilynn Marchione, The Associated Press, 10/3/2013

Donor stool, usually from a relative, is processed in the lab to take out food and extract the bacteria and clean it.
If its sooo clean, why a relative? :-|


source wrote:It is packed into triple-coated gel capsules so they won’t dissolve until they reach the intestines.
No option to pay more and get it packed 6 times?

source wrote:“There’s no stool left — just stool bugs. These people are not eating poop,”
...
Minnesota doctors are testing freezing stool, which doesn’t kill the bacteria, so it could be stored and shipped anywhere a patient needed it.
If there is "no-poop" in what they are swallowing, why not extract the bacteria first, and then just freeze those?

source wrote:“You could have a universal donor in Minnesota provide a transplant for someone in Florida. That’s where we’re heading,” Donskey said.
I would of thought they would be combining or extracting the best, and make a SUPER POOP! err.. i mean super-bacteria-combination. :razz: ie just maybe extract and breed the better bacteria? like the current general "stomach bacteria" pills you see.
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby plethora » Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:08 pm

I would of thought they would be combining or extracting the best, and make a SUPER POOP! err.. i mean super-bacteria-combination. :razz: ie just maybe extract and breed the better bacteria? like the current general "stomach bacteria" pills you see.


No kidding. Other scientific studies have shown that having specific bacteria influence how fast or slow you gain weight. Bacteria that is very good at breaking down food=you get every calorie. Bacteria that isn't as efficient at breaking down food=you can eat more and not gain weight. What we need is a menu of poop choices-- "Yes, I'd like to order some skinny no MS poop...."
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby NHE » Wed Oct 09, 2013 12:56 am

True, it's not a scientific article. However, it is interesting that one can obtain benefits from the treatment without having either an endoscopy or colonoscopy. :geek:
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby cervocuit » Fri Oct 11, 2013 3:34 am

erimus wrote:this treatment is now available in the UK at the Taymount clinic
http://www.taymount.com/
You were right. They have updated their website, where they now talk about FMT for MS and other "gastro-neurological" condictions. Look at the video.

There is also an interview of this doctor in ThePowerOfPoop. Quite long but worth it.
http://thepowerofpoop.com/interview-wit ... ctitioner/

From ECTRIMS 2013, about gut microbiota in MS.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qF8EwFyOwek
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby lyndacarol » Fri Oct 11, 2013 8:22 am

cervocuit wrote:From ECTRIMS 2013, about gut microbiota in MS.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qF8EwFyOwek


Thank you, thank you. I found this 5 min. video to be encouraging; someone is finally looking in a new direction! The gut/gluten may be the starting point.
My hypothesis: excess insulin (hyperinsulinemia) plays a major role in MS, as developed in my initial post: http://www.thisisms.com/forum/general-discussion-f1/topic1878.html "Insulin – Could This Be the Key?"
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby leonardo » Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:32 pm

Anyone tried FMT?
Is there any study other than the one with 3 participants?
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby cervocuit » Tue Jan 07, 2014 3:09 am

I don't know if it has already been posted elsewhere. It was published 1 year ago.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23293933
Antibody response against gastrointestinal antigens in demyelinating diseases of the central nervous system.

BACKGROUND: Antibodies against gastrointestinal antigens may indicate altered microbiota and immune responses in the gut. Recent experimental data suggest a connection between gastrointestinal immune responses and CNS autoimmunity.

METHODS: Antibodies against gliadin, tissue transglutaminase (tTG), intrinsic factor (IF), parietal cells (PC) and Saccharomyces cerevisiae (ASCA) were screened in the sera of 45 patients with AQP4-seropositive neuromyelitis optica (NMO) and NMO spectrum diseases (NMO/NMO-SD), 17 patients with AQP4-seronegative NMO, 85 patients with clinically definite multiple sclerosis (MS), and 48 healthy controls (HC).

RESULTS: Thirty-seven percentages of patients with AQP4-seropositive NMO/NMO-SD and 28% of patients with MS had at least one particular antibody in contrast to 8% of HC (P < 0.01, respectively). Antibodies were most common (46%) in AQP4-seropositive myelitis (P = 0.01 versus HS, P = 0.05 versus MS). Anti-gliadin and ASCA were more frequent in the AQP4-seropositive NMO-spectrum compared to controls (P = 0.01 and P < 0.05, respectively).

CONCLUSION: Antibody responses against gastrointestinal antigens are common in MS and AQP4-seropositive NMO/NMO-SD, especially in longitudinally extensive myelitis.
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby TiffaNiffaNi » Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:22 am

First time poster.

Not just because of the findings for this small sample that started this thread- but due to my cummulative research & personal history, I did an at-home FMT yesterday.

I will periodically post updates on my condition to this thread. Depending on how I feel throughout this week, I may follow up with another FMT. Dr. Borody's MS patients did 5 infusions, with one patient doing 10.

Background:
Recently diagnosed in August with RRMS. Numbness in face.
Started Copaxone almost immediately. Stopped Copaxone after approximately 1 month.
3 years prior, had a perforated bowel due to complicated diverticulitis. 2 bowel resections.
Age 28. Female.

Day 1
FMT performed at approximately 3PM.

Day 2
Most significantly, I have suffered for the past 2 years+ from plaque palmoplantar psoriasis, with it being the most severe the last 2 months. At this time, the psoriasis is 90% clear. I am shocked.
I am in good spirits. My energy levels are up. In fact, I woke at 4am with so much energy I was almost unable to fall back asleep.
It is very early, but so far, I am feeling great.
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby SLOV8213 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:02 am

How do you perform an at home FMT?
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby TiffaNiffaNi » Mon Jan 13, 2014 12:26 pm

Quite a few protocols can be found online. I wasn't sure about the rules on this site for adding lnks so:

Google: "Thefreeman FMT"

The first link should be to the IBSgroup.org forum. TheFreeman (user) posts his protocol and links to 3 others that he used in developing his methodology.

Likewise, The Power of Poop website is a great source with instructions as well.


I did not do a course of antibiotics first, as recommended by some protocols. I felt that antibiotics were what got me in this mess to begin with so I didn't want go there.
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby Kronk » Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:50 pm

TiffaNiffaNi wrote:I will periodically post updates on my condition to this thread.


Thank you for trialing this and most of all for updating all of us on your progress. I will be following this thread. I may be looking at my sons poopy diapers in a whole new way :confused:
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby leonardo » Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:32 am

TiffaNiffaNi wrote:First time poster.

Day 1
FMT performed at approximately 3PM.

Day 2
Most significantly, I have suffered for the past 2 years+ from plaque palmoplantar psoriasis, with it being the most severe the last 2 months. At this time, the psoriasis is 90% clear. I am shocked.
I am in good spirits. My energy levels are up. In fact, I woke at 4am with so much energy I was almost unable to fall back asleep.
It is very early, but so far, I am feeling great.


I'm 90% sure it's placebo effect, but we'll see, keep us posted.

I didn't know that there's "at home version" of FMT. Big pharma will not like it...
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Re: Fecal Microbiota Transplantation - 3 cases

Postby SLOV8213 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 11:20 am

May I ask what are your symptoms? I suffer from terrible excessive gas and constipation.
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