Influenza Vaccination?

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Influenza Vaccination?

Postby hijeenie » Wed Jan 16, 2013 3:40 pm

My husband was diagnosed last year and I think I remember the neurologist saying not to get the flu shot or use anything that can stimulate your immune system (he was against Vit C use!?). He takes Copaxone. Do others get the flu shot? This is such a bad year and I would hate for him to get sick. I work in a dental office and we have a 10 yr old so we are both exposed to lots of germs. We have had our vaccinations. Thanks for your input.
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby PointsNorth » Wed Jan 16, 2013 5:45 pm

I experienced first MS symptoms exactly five (5) days after the seasonal flu vaccine. Diagnosed initially with Guillain-Barre. GB occurred en masse back in the '76 following a Swine Flu vaccination. 500 cases 25 deaths.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1976_swine_flu_outbreak

Coincidence? One of my specialist MDs didn't think so. I think it was the straw that broke the camel's back in my case. Personally, I think the risk outweighs any reward. I think for select groups e.g. elderly it might be worth it but not for the young/healthy. So many nurses in acute care refuse to take it :confused:

Ironically, it was because I had another 'autoimmune' disease (Crohn's) that I was advised to take the flu shot. I believe that there should be 'vaccine injury' in Canada as there is in the USA. It's a greater good initiative that should compensate those that suffer injury.
Albany 2010. Brooklyn 2011
Hurry up and wait.
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby MarkLavelle » Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:24 pm

I always get the flu shot. There's no connection between the vaccine & MS, and no reason to skip the vaccine.

Stories are not evidence of anything...

RRMS dx 3/3/11; Copaxone since 12/1/11
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby Cece » Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:26 pm

My neurologist advised to get the flu shot but he also said that the leader of the clinic advises against the flu shot. So that rather left me to make up my own mind. I get the flu shot.

PN, that's terrible. I wouldn't think the timing was a coincidence esp knowing the flu shot gets the immune system activated.
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby nellie » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:15 pm

I have asked numerous times & my neurologist has told me it's perfectly fine to get the flu shot. I am a firm believer in it this year for sure as my 30 yr. old niece is comatose & in critical condition with pnemonia after contracting influenza a. So sad to see.
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby euphoniaa » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:27 pm

hijeenie wrote:My husband was diagnosed last year and I think I remember the neurologist saying not to get the flu shot or use anything that can stimulate your immune system (he was against Vit C use!?). He takes Copaxone. Do others get the flu shot? This is such a bad year and I would hate for him to get sick. I work in a dental office and we have a 10 yr old so we are both exposed to lots of germs. We have had our vaccinations. Thanks for your input.

I'm notoriously medphobic and super sensitive to all meds, vitamins, supplements, foods, adhesives, cardboard (yes, that's right). But I ALWAYS get the flu shot. For the last 25 or 30 years, ever since I was laid low with a bout of the real, honest-to-goodness, knock-you-on-your-ass flu and spent 2 of the most painful, miserable weeks of my life with it.

I've never had any bad reaction to the flu shots, and I've never come close to being as sick as I was with the flu. I understand that the flu vaccine is supposed to be from a dead virus, and can't give you the flu.
Dx'd with MS & HNPP (hereditary peripheral neuropathy) 7/03 but must have had MS for 30 yrs before that. I've never taken meds for MS or MS symptoms except 1 yr experiment on LDN. (I found diet, exercise, sleep, humor, music help me the most.)
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby NHE » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:59 am

I recall that there was a post some time ago that stated that people with MS should avoid the nasally delivered flu vaccine, but that the standard flu shot was ok.

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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby euphoniaa » Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:06 am

NHE wrote:I recall that there was a post some time ago that stated that people with MS should avoid the nasally delivered flu vaccine, but that the standard flu shot was ok.

NHE

Right, NHE. Here's the link to the NMSS recommendations and some quotes. I thought it interesting that the flu vaccine has been studied extensively, but not yet with those taking Gilenya or Tysabri.

The link to a whole page of vaccine recommendations & cautions:
http://www.nationalmssociety.org/living ... index.aspx

Here's the flu vaccine section from NMSS:

The 2012-2013 Injectable Seasonal Flu Vaccine (includes H1N1)

The 2012-2012 seasonal influenza (flu) immunization is a single preparation that provides immunity to three different flu virus strains. It contains an H3N2 virus, an influenza B virus, and this year's H1N1 virus, which means that only one "shot" is needed.

The injectable flu vaccine, which is an ‘inactivated’ vaccine, is recommended for everyone over 6 months of age. It has been studied extensively in people with MS and is considered quite safe. The injectable flu vaccine may be taken by people who are taking an interferon medication, glatiramer acetate, mitoxantrone, natalizumab, or fingolimod. However it is not yet known whether the vaccine is as effective for those talking natalizumab or fingolimod.

People who are experiencing a serious relapse that affects their ability to carry out activities of daily living should defer vaccination until 4-6 weeks after the onset of the relapse.

FluMist® is a live-virus flu vaccine (sometimes called LAIV for "live attenuated influenza vaccine”) that is delivered via a nasal spray. This live-virus vaccine is not recommended for people with MS. Live, attenuated vaccines are those whose biological activity has been reduced so that their ability to cause disease has been weakened but not totally inactivated.

A high-dose flu vaccine is available for people over age 65. This high-dose vaccine has not been studied in people with MS of any age. At present, the Centers for Disease Control is not recommending the high-dose vaccine over the seasonal flu vaccine for the general population.
Dx'd with MS & HNPP (hereditary peripheral neuropathy) 7/03 but must have had MS for 30 yrs before that. I've never taken meds for MS or MS symptoms except 1 yr experiment on LDN. (I found diet, exercise, sleep, humor, music help me the most.)
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby DougL » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:00 am

for the first time that i remember, the consent form here in Canada said "DO NOT GET THE FLU SHOT IF YOU HAVE A NEUROLIGICAL CONDITION".

we did not notice any ill affects
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby milesap » Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:36 am

I get the flue shot every year with no problems. If the nuero is against the flue shot I wonder if he is against LDN?
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby hijeenie » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:20 pm

Yeah he wasn't receptive to LDN or other suggestions such as diet modification. And this is at our "MS Clinic" at MacMaster for other Candians. I think I'll send him for the shot thanks for all your input.
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:09 pm

hijeenie who's your neuro, i'm ostensibly at mac but i don't tend to darken the doors..

i don't get the shot. before your hubby goes, is he doing any nutrient work at all? in spite of the neuro slamming the idea? by the way he sounds like he doesn't really get how the immune system functions, oddly.. you can certainly input nutrients that will boost the immune system *braking* function.. eg vit d3 and so on..

my neuro at mac is hilarious - he argues with me, but resistance is futile :D the proof of the pudding is in my lab work. left a msg with my doc today to see if she can hook me up with an academic supervisor at mac, for a masters related to nutritional biochem.

nelllie that is terrible re your niece - can you encourage any bloodwork? serum zinc test? any reasons to suspect nutritional deficits?

unfortunately i can't find a study looking at young adults but here are the findings for children and elderly vis a vis zinc status and incidence of / recovery from pneumonia:

Zinc for severe pneumonia in very young children: double-blind placebo-controlled trial
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar ... 3604162521
in this study they only used 20mg per day and it was still considered beneficial
i don't have full text access so can't see the serum levels before and after, but you need to be in the high teens to fight off infections.

Serum zinc and pneumonia in nursing home elderly
http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/86/4/1167.short
Compared with subjects with low zinc concentrations, subjects with normal final serum zinc concentrations had a lower incidence of pneumonia, fewer (by almost 50%) new antibiotic prescriptions, a shorter duration of pneumonia, and fewer days of antibiotic use (3.9 d compared with 2.6 d) (P ≤ 0.004 for all). Normal baseline serum zinc concentrations were associated with a reduction in all-cause mortality (P = 0.049).

fyi 'normal' is 11.5-18.5 but you still need to ensure levels are up around 18. i would want my levels to be up in that range before considering any sort of vaccine, too.
READ ME key info on nutrient targets - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
my approach: no meds so far - just nutrient-dense anti-inflammatory whole foods, and supplements where needed
info: www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby lyndacarol » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:59 pm

This information does not concern the flu vaccine, but similar to FluMist, a LIVE-virus vaccine, the BCG (Bacillus Calmette-Guerin) vaccine against tuberculosis is also a LIVE, attenuated (weakened) bacteria.

Dr. Denise Faustman, Director of the Immunobiology Laboratory in Boston, seems to have found a way to reverse type I diabetes with repeated BCG vaccinations . In the following interview she is talking about using multiple BCG vaccines: http://www.myfoxboston.com/story/192352 ... t-diabetes

Here is a Bloomberg article with more details: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-0 ... or-tb.html

I know that this vaccine (for tuberculosis) is required for school-age children in the UK (I believe it contributes to the prevalence of MS there.). If Dr. Faustman is correct about it increasing insulin production, and if excess insulin triggers MS, and since the live flu virus vaccine is not recommended for people with MS then it may not be a good idea for people with MS get the BCG vaccine against tuberculosis either.
My hypothesis: excess insulin (hyperinsulinemia) plays a major role in MS, as developed in my initial post: http://www.thisisms.com/forum/general-discussion-f1/topic1878.html "Insulin – Could This Be the Key?"
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby mmpetunia » Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:50 pm

i work in a hospital so i have basically been forced to get the flu shot the last 2 years. no, i do not think this is an acceptable policy... :?

prior to that i never took the flu shot and i never got the flu. now that i have MS i would really prefer to not take anything that messes with my immune system function--it's confused enough all on it's own. however, since i am coerced and strong-armed into it at work i make sure that it is not the nasal mist, since as others have said that one is not indicated for PwMS. the first year i had 2-3 days of flu-like symptoms but this year it was no biggie. if i had the choice (which i don't...seems unconstitutional to me for someone else to tell me what i am required to put into my own body) i would not get the shot. they tell us it's ok for PwMS and that getting the flu can actually be more dangerous than the vaccine. and maybe that's true. i just think i'm doing fine without it. and i'm pretty sure i'm better off without the mercury and whatever else they put in there too. being vaccinated from the flu only protects others around me if i end up infected with the flu and in my 32 year history this has not happened. i do not believe it is beneficial in preventing flu transmission to others.
Dx: 9/8/11 RRMS
Gluten and dairy free diet
copaxone x3: let's hope the third time is the charm!
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Re: Influenza Vaccination?

Postby blossom » Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:00 pm

i eat a lot of garlic "raw". take good supplements and try to eat well. since nobody "knows for sure" just what causes these symptoms someone decided to name ms and the autoimmune theory is "only a theory" i choose to keep it up and running as good as i can. i'm not crazy about getting something put in me that i'm not sure of on purpose. there's enough crap getting into our systems that the good old boys say will do no harm now but down the line there's an add saying if you took this or that "call me" or if you eat this or that that was grown here or there. so far so good. pretty good shape "for the shape i'm in."

true, i can hardly move but what if i'm one that the spine is the culprit?

a friend of mine got the swine flu shot back in the day. she was very healthy and young and active. shortly after she developed rheumatory arthritis-it hit her hard and fast and she is a mess. my cousins wife was fine-got the flu shot-same thing happened.

i guess each to his own-weigh out what you feel are the pro's and cons. and, hope it's right for you.
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