Some Interesting Connections

If it's on your mind and it has to do with multiple sclerosis in any way, post it here.

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby Annesse » Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:40 pm

Protease are also necessary for keeping the body free from parasites (such as intestinal worms), yeast overgrowth, and pathogenic bacteria and viruses. Parasites, fungal forms, and bacteria are proteins (protease digest proteins) that additionally disguise themselves in a protein shell that our bodies may view as normal. A virus is essentially a nucleic acid (DNA or RNA) enclosed in a protein shell.

Proteases work by removing this protein shell. With the protective barrier down, your immune system can then recognize and destroy the invading organism. Autoimmune patients often say their disease was preceded by a viral or bacterial infection. If you are bordering on a protease deficiency and you contract a viral or bacterial infection, this would further deplete your protease, as they would be needed to ‘disarm’ the invader.
Annesse
Family Elder
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:57 pm

Advertisement

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby PointsNorth » Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:41 pm

Hello Annesse,

Protease (I-IV) found in a new digestive enzyme I'm taking might account for the B12 I'm injecting is starting to work once again! I would like to try to introduce DNAse-1 into the mix - once I understand how I can accomplish this?

Best, PN
Albany 2010. Brooklyn 2011
Calcitriol+D3 2013-
Hurry up and wait.
PointsNorth
Family Elder
 
Posts: 498
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2006 3:00 pm
Location: LeftCoast Canada

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby Annesse » Tue Nov 05, 2013 8:50 pm

Hi PN~DNase 1 doesn't exist in supplement form. The German researchers that discovered the lack of DNase 1 in lupus are trying to engineer a fake DNase 1 that is safe. It makes me nervous that you are taking digestive enzymes and vitamin B12 in supplement form. I posted some information on the thread about some serious side effects that could result. We could start discussing ways to get these enzymes and vitamin B12 back through diet and herbs, with no risk of side effects. For instance, protease and DNase 1 are both found in raw fermented organic sauerkraut. Vitamin B12 is found attached to dietary animal proteins, but the animals must have been pastured, because vitamin B12 is made by organisms in the soil. You should always consume a raw fermented vegetable such as sauerkraut whenever you eat an animal protein. This will insure you have the necessary enzymes to break down the proteins. Proteins that are not properly broken down by protease will elicit an immune response.
Annesse
Family Elder
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:57 pm

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby PointsNorth » Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:28 pm

Annesse,

So if I understand correctly: I shouldn't combine a supplement (digestive enzyme) containing protease with B12 (injectable)??

Thx, PN
Albany 2010. Brooklyn 2011
Calcitriol+D3 2013-
Hurry up and wait.
PointsNorth
Family Elder
 
Posts: 498
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2006 3:00 pm
Location: LeftCoast Canada

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby Annesse » Thu Nov 07, 2013 3:30 pm

Hi PN~

I personally would not take either one. Protease, DNase 1 and vitamin B12 can all be safely restored through whole foods and lifestyle modifications alone. Here is the information on protease from my book I posted earlier on the thread.


"Protease Supplements

The pancreas releases protease in an “inactive” form due to their strong potential to destroy the cells that produced them and to “digest” other parts of the body, such as the lining of the stomach. To protect the body’s own cells inactive protease are secreted into the digestive tract and only activated when and where they are needed.

Research shows that supplementation with protease can destroy the body’s lipases (Layer, 1993). These are the enzymes that digest fats. Supplemental protease can also lead to a serious condition involving damage to the large intestines called fibrosing colonopathy (Bakowski, 1999). In some cases, the problem was linked to the use of high supplemental amounts of enzymes (Milla, 1994). However, the amount of enzymes used has not been linked to the problem in all reports (Jones, 1995).

Our ultimate goal is to restore the health of the entire gastrointestinal (GI) tract in order to properly digest and metabolize proteins. As we have seen, the proper digestion and absorption of proteins requires the functional integrity of the entire gut. If the stomach lining or other parts of the GI tract are further damaged through the use of supplemental enzymes, then we will not be able to achieve our goal.

In addition, as serious a problem as the inability to digest proteins is, it would be equally as serious if the body were not able to digest fats. The destruction of the body’s lipases by supplemental protease could lead to very harmful consequences."
Annesse
Family Elder
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:57 pm

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby Annesse » Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:56 pm

I thought this was interesting. In the following study the researchers found that homocysteine causes a decrease in blood flow to the brain due to an increase in vascular resistance because of arterial remodeling in the carotid artery.


Neurochem Int. 2008 Dec;53(6-8):214-9. doi: 10.1016/j.neuint.2008.07.008. Epub 2008 Aug 3.
Homocysteine decreases blood flow to the brain due to vascular resistance in carotid artery.
Kumar M, Tyagi N, Moshal KS, Sen U, Kundu S, Mishra PK, Givvimani S, Tyagi SC.


"An elevated level of Homocysteine (Hcy) is a risk factor for vascular dementia and stroke...The gamma-Amino Butyric Acid (GABA) presents in the central nervous system (CNS) and functions as an inhibitory neurotransmitter. Hcy competes with GABA at the GABA(A) receptor and affects the CNS function. We hypothesize that Hcy causes a decrease in blood flow to the brain due to increase in vascular resistance (VR) because of arterial remodeling in the carotid artery (CA)...These results suggested that Hcy caused arterial remodeling in part, by increase in collagen/elastin ratio thereby increasing VR leading to the decrease in CA blood flow."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18725259
Annesse
Family Elder
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:57 pm

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby Annesse » Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:20 pm

I posted the following information on my books Facebook page and though it might be of interest here as well.


ALUMINUM, VITAMIN B12, AND AUTOIMMUNE DISEASE

The metallic chemical element aluminum, also known as aluminium, is ingested into the body through such things as the use of food additives, antacids, buffered aspirin, raising agents such as baking powder, sunscreen, nasal sprays, vaccinations, aluminum foil, cookware, etc. The body needs to be able to properly detoxify and eliminate aluminum in order to prevent cellular damage.

Research has found that patients with autoimmune disease have elevated levels of aluminum. For instance, in the following study scientists compared levels of aluminium in the urine of people with multiple sclerosis and controls. Significantly higher levels of aluminium (up to 40 times more) were found in those with multiple sclerosis.

Elevated urinary excretion of aluminium and iron in multiple sclerosis.
Exley C, Mamutse G, Korchazhkina O, Pye E, Strekopytov S, Polwart A, Hawkins C. 2006.
Mult Scler. 2(5):533-40.

"...Urinary concentrations of aluminium were also significantly increased in RRMS (P<0.001) and SPMS (P <0.05) such that the levels of aluminium excretion in the former were similar to those observed in individuals undergoing metal chelation therapy…”


The body has a system in place to properly eliminate aluminum. This system depends on protease (enzymes that digest dietary proteins and also metabolize vitamin B12).

In the human body, “malic and succinic” acids are the most effective chelators of aluminum, as the following study confirms.

Comparative effects of several chelating agents on the toxicity, distribution and excretion of aluminium.
Domingo JL, Gómez M, Llobet JM, Corbella J. 1988. Hum Toxicol. 7(3):259-62.

“The relative efficacy of citric, malic, malonic, oxalic and succinic acids, and deferoxamine mesylate (DFOA) on the toxicity, distribution and excretion in mice exposed to aluminium…Malic and succinic acids were the most effective…”


Malic acid is generated from succinic acid. Vitamin B12 is a “crucial” component in the generation of succinic acid (Halarnkar, 1989).

Protease are necessary for the binding and transport of vitamin B12. Due to a lack of protease, all autoimmune sufferers lack the ability to properly metabolize vitamin B12, which would then lead to elevated aluminum. For instance, in the following study the researchers stated they suspected the vitamin B12 deficiency in multiple sclerosis may be due to problems with binding and/or transport. In addition, the researchers concluded that further studies of vitamin B12 metabolism, binding, and transport in multiple sclerosis are indicated, as they feel this may offer a clue to the understanding of multiple sclerosis.

Multiple sclerosis associated with vitamin B12 deficiency.
Reynolds EH, Linnell JC, Faludy JE. 1991. Arch Neurol. 48(8):808-11.

“…A vitamin B12 binding and/or transport is suspected. The nature of the association of multiple sclerosis and vitamin B12 deficiency is unclear but is likely to be more than coincidental. Further studies of vitamin B12 metabolism, binding, and transport in multiple sclerosis are indicated, as these cases may offer a clue to the understanding of a still mysterious neurologic disorder.”

Take home message:

The inability to properly metabolize vitamin B12 would explain the elevated levels of aluminum found in patients with autoimmune disease. Taking additional vitamin B12 in supplement form would not reduce the levels of aluminum, as the problem lies in the “binding and transport” of vitamin B12. Restoring the enzymes responsible for the proper metabolism of vitamin B12 would, however, restore the system your body has to chelate aluminum.


Also, in a stroke of irony, vitamin B12 injections contain aluminum. Here is the warning issued from the FDA on the use of Cyanocobalamin (vitamin B12): “WARNING: This product contains aluminum that may be toxic…”

Of course, it would be best to avoid anything your body views as “toxic”, but if the system your body has to deal with such toxins is disabled, it becomes even more important to avoid ingesting these toxins.
Annesse
Family Elder
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:57 pm

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby want2bike » Thu Nov 21, 2013 10:43 am

Aluminum has been link to Alzheimer's disease. Anything that is suspect of brain problems is not good for MS patients.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3056430/
want2bike
Family Elder
 
Posts: 652
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:15 am

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby DrGeoff » Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:23 pm

While true Alzheimers has been linked to Aluminium, there is no evidence that it is a causal link.
You have to differentiate between true Alzheimers (brain cells fusing into placques), and SDAT (the more general form of senile dementia).
Next, you have to consider that in the Western world, the vast majority of cooking utensils were (post WW II) made from aluminium when the aircraft industry lo longer required the output of the Aluminium plants. In much of Europe, stainless steel has replaced Aluminium for a similar economic reason (and for a similar time period).

If the Aluminium hypothesis is valid, it should be possible to differentiate between those whose food was cooked in Aluminium pots and pans (say between 1950 and 1980) and those who had their food cooked in stainless steel (1980 to date), or by the regions where each type of utensil is prevalent.
Geoff
DrGeoff
Family Member
 
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 3:44 am

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby NHE » Fri Nov 22, 2013 5:53 pm

DrGeoff wrote:If the Aluminium hypothesis is valid, it should be possible to differentiate between those whose food was cooked in Aluminium pots and pans (say between 1950 and 1980) and those who had their food cooked in stainless steel (1980 to date), or by the regions where each type of utensil is prevalent.

I had aluminum pans until 1995. I used one quite a bit to make brown rice.
User avatar
NHE
Volunteer Moderator
 
Posts: 3246
Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2004 4:00 pm

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby CaveMan » Sat Nov 23, 2013 3:49 am

If you're talking Aluminium, don't forget all that flaking Teflon coating we all ingested through the 70's & 80's.
I am just an interested individual trying to crack the autoimmune nut.
Partner has Graves Disease, 5 years, showing good test results, looking forward to potential remission in the near future.
3 friends have MS, 1 just recently diagnosed, severity 7/10.
CaveMan
Family Elder
 
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:11 pm

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby want2bike » Sat Nov 23, 2013 7:58 am

The big problem with aluminum is the vaccines. When you inject aluminum directly into the blood it is harder for the body to get rid of it. It is amazing all the place were exposure to aluminum exist. Could be the reason we have all these mental problems in the children.

http://www.naturalnews.com/034607_alumi ... detox.html

http://www.angelfire.com/az/sthurston/a ... icity.html
want2bike
Family Elder
 
Posts: 652
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:15 am

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby DrGeoff » Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:31 pm

How interesting that the old scare story about Aluminium in vaccines should pop up again - and, of course, it is just a scare story.
If we are throwing URLs about, lets consider something from the World Health Organisation:
http://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/commi ... n_2012/en/
which does, incidentally, support the FDA approach as well.

The "Angelfire" URL leads to what appears to be a scholarly article on the evils of Aluminium - but if you read all of it, it is somewhat inaccurate. For example, it suggests that the popular antacid Tums could give a regular user a high dosage of Aluminium. This would be quite a good trick considering that Tums is Calcium Carbonate based.
In fact, most of the popular antacids are Magnesium Hydrochloride based, and Aluminium uptake does seem to vary inversely with the consumption of Magnesium Hydrochloride.

That is not the only error in the "Angelfire" article. I saw enough to convince me that there was a high degree of bias, and a low degree of factual accuracy.

As for Natural News, lets look at a quote from their website:
" Natural News employs a staff of over 20 writers and researchers who write up to 15 original news stories each day.
Having co-authored several scholarly papers in my time, I find the idea of a paper being researched and written in about 1.5 days to be frightening in the extreme. It can take a week just to do a literature review after you have gathered the literature together. A day-and-a-half sounds like a tabloid newspaper or the National Enquirer.
Geoff
DrGeoff
Family Member
 
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 3:44 am

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby CaveMan » Sat Nov 23, 2013 5:56 pm

Don't think your Acronyms of WHO & FDA are any more credible, maybe 50-100 years ago a govt organisation might carry some weight with regards to credibility, but nowdays with the mantra of privatisation and health outcomes being driven by profit margins I wouldn't take any comfort from what FDA or WHO have to say.

They are fundamental to the current state of health and drug companies have been shown time & time again to behave in a fradulent and deceptive manner with regards to study data, and the FDA by association is implicated in this process, as they are primarily funded by drug companies.
Who was on this WHO commitee, did they then or do they now have any links to vaccine manufacturers, who was responsible for collecting data for side effects and how was it compiled, what factors have been excluded and for what period has it been collected?
I am just an interested individual trying to crack the autoimmune nut.
Partner has Graves Disease, 5 years, showing good test results, looking forward to potential remission in the near future.
3 friends have MS, 1 just recently diagnosed, severity 7/10.
CaveMan
Family Elder
 
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:11 pm

Re: Some Interesting Connections

Postby DrGeoff » Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:45 pm

Ah-Ha, a conspiracy fundamentalist.
The WHO is rather larger than a mere "government organisation" - so why would you trust it less than an organisation that does not even have a home page or a title at all?
if you had actually read the link that I gave, you would have been able to find out the names of the current Committee on Vaccine Safety, and the previous one. In fact, if you had read that report (instead of being so quick to rubbish it) you would have seen how the report was put together - and that the rest of your questions are not relevant
DrGeoff
Family Member
 
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 3:44 am

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

 


  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users