Vitamin D deficient....again!

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Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby mpalla » Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:25 pm

Hi! Been a while since I was on....I have had MS 1.5 years now. I have been on 2k iu a day. My vitaminD now is still below the low end of the normal range. How can this be??
Diagnosed 2-13-13. RRMS.
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby mpalla » Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:26 pm

I don't do heat....so sun when it's humid isn't an option....
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby NHE » Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:54 pm

mpalla wrote:Hi! Been a while since I was on....I have had MS 1.5 years now. I have been on 2k iu a day. My vitaminD now is still below the low end of the normal range. How can this be??


How's your magnesium status? Magnesium is used in many of the steps in processing vitamin D3 and low magnesium can contribute to vitamin D3 deficiency.

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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby ElliotB » Fri Jun 20, 2014 12:46 am

How can this be? Probably because you have MS. Take more. I take 20,000 IU daily. Many with MS take a lot more than 2000 iu daily. Because your D3 level is low, you likely should be taking more than you are currently taking which is kind of obvious since your vitamin D level is low. What does your doctor say about you being low. Why not ask him for his recommendation as to how much you should be taking. If your body is having trouble absorbing the vitamin D you are taking, do an internet search for tips of how to better absorb it.
Last edited by ElliotB on Fri Jun 20, 2014 11:45 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby lyndacarol » Fri Jun 20, 2014 7:37 am

mpalla wrote:Hi! Been a while since I was on....I have had MS 1.5 years now. I have been on 2k iu a day. My vitaminD now is still below the low end of the normal range. How can this be??

Since you have been using oral capsules to get your vitamin D and are unable to get it from the sun through your skin, I think there could be a problem with absorption of nutrients in the duodenum (The duodenum is the first section of the small intestine where most all of our nutrients are absorbed.), especially if many of your other nutrient levels are low too.

I suggest that you see a gastroenterologist and investigate possible damage to the intestinal villi (the fingerlike protrusions necessary for absorption). Or perhaps you have insufficient digestive enzymes coming from the pancreas and cannot break down the capsules and vitamin D.

If you have been taking steroids or other strong oral medications for an extended period of time, these could have negatively impacted your intestines.

6/22/2014 Correction: The duodenum is the site of most of our digestion; the ileum is the site where the important nutrients of vitamin B12, A, D, E, and K are absorbed. The possibility of a problem with absorption should be investigated with your gastroenterologist.
Last edited by lyndacarol on Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby mpalla » Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:44 pm

Lyndacarol...i am on tysabri. It has been at least 6-8 mos since I've touched a steroid. Should I ask my gp or my neuro? I haven't had my mg checked...I take that daily too....
My gp gave me copies...I had an unexplained fever. I figured that out...was a flare of my ebv. My glands were swollen...felt like I did ayear ago. Doubled upon my antivirals....my gp said nothing about my d. Got the fever better...so I went with tysabri.
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby Anonymoose » Fri Jun 20, 2014 10:28 pm

Hi mpalla,

Thought I answered this earlier but it's not there. Odd. Anyway...

Are you taking valacyclovir or acyclovir? Valtrex made my calcitriol (active vitamin d) high and made my serum vitamin d drop from low thirties to low twenties within just a couple of weeks. The high calcitriol happened to me both times I took valtrex (I didn't test the first time but the symptoms were identical to those that presented the second time when I did test) and the problem goes away when I stop valtrex or stop supplementing vitamin d. I think it also made my copper and ceruloplasmin levels go low though I haven't tested to see if they've come back up since quitting valtrex.

If you are taking one of those anti-virals, maybe that is why your vitamin d level is low?
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby mpalla » Sun Jun 22, 2014 5:37 am

Yes Anymoose...I take acyclovir 2x dailyx 800 mg. I take this as I have had shingles 2xs and ebv levels high. Never thought of that......any thing natural I can take for an antiviral.
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby Anonymoose » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:58 am

Hi mpalla,

I don't know if there are natural antivirals that work for msers. Everything seems to be complicated for us. You might not even react to acyclovir the same way I do to valacyclovir. I would have vitamin d, calcitriol, copper, and ceruloplasmin tested and if those levels come back weird, ask your doctor if you should stop taking the acyclovir.

Scott1 has a thread in regimens titled "avonex and valtrex" (or something like that). His approach to fighting ms is, in part, to fight ebv. Perhaps there are some alternative answers for you there.
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby THX1138 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 9:07 am

ElliotB wrote:How can this be? Probably because you have MS. Take more. I take 20,000 IU daily. Many with MS take a lot more than 2000 iu daily. Because your D3 level is low, you likely should be taking more than you are currently taking which is kind of obvious since your vitamin D level is low. What does your doctor say about you being low. Why not ask him for his recommendation as to how much you should be taking. If your body is having trouble absorbing the vitamin D you are taking, do an internet search for tips of how to better absorb it.


Dr. Cannell: Is it important to take magnesium with vitamin D? Judith, New York

Yes, it is important to have adequate magnesium intake and most Americans do not. A number of people have written about muscle cramps after they start sunbathing or taking Vitamin D. This is likely caused from the neuromuscular hyperexcitability of magnesium deficiency that is somehow unmasked by higher Vitamin D levels.1
https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/newsletter/newsletter-vitamin-d-questions-and-answers-2/#


A client emailed that he heard a doctor on a talk show recommending 5,000 IU of Vitamin D instead of the RDA of 400 IU. He asked me what I thought.

I said that everyone thinks there’s a Vitamin D deficiency epidemic but I’m not convinced. The big question is, why all of a sudden are we so deficient. What could Vitamin D be responding to and what do the low levels indicate?

Here’s one possible answer. Vitamin D is really a hormone with a feedback loop to calcium. When the body has enough calcium less Vitamin D is required and the levels drop.

We are a calcified country, so the effect of high calcium may be lower levels of Vitamin D. And without understanding the complex chemistry involved, most people think we just need to take more.
http://drcarolyndean.com/2013/03/too-much-vitamin-d/
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby THX1138 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:15 pm

Two interesting cases of Mg dependent Vitamin D-resistant rickets appeared in the Lancet in 1974. Two children, one age two and the other age five, presented with classic rickets. 600,000 IU of Vitamin D daily for ten days did not result in any improvement in six weeks—in either x-rays or alkaline phosphatase—and the doctors diagnosed Vitamin D-resistant rickets. Almost by accident, serum Mg levels were then obtained, which were low in both children. After the treatment with Mg, the rickets rapidly resolved.6

What does that mean? How can one treat rickets with Mg? Remember, these children took a total of 6 million units, that’s a total of 6,000,000 IU of vitamin D over ten days (it was given as injections so we know the children actually took it). Thus, they had plenty of vitamin D but, in their cases, the vitamin D needed Mg to work.
https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/newsletter/newsletter-vitamin-d-questions-and-answers-2/#
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby want2bike » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:37 pm

According to my understanding of vitamin D 2000iu a day is not enough. To get my level up to 73ng/ml I needed 5000iu a day. In adjusting the amount of vitamin D you need there are 6 things to consider. How much sun exposure you get, where you live, what is your age, is your skin light or dark, are you overweight, and do you have a chronic disease. Here is an article explaining it. Make sure you are using D3 and it is an oil based supplement.

http://www.naturalnews.com/027345_Vitam ... e_sun.html
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby mpalla » Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:26 pm

Wow want 2 bike...good informative article. I stepped up to 5k and may want a niter thousand. Thank you so much for the info!
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby THX1138 » Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:27 am

Dr. Cannell: Is it important to take magnesium with vitamin D? Judith, New York

Yes, it is important to have adequate magnesium intake and most Americans do not. A number of people have written about muscle cramps after they start sunbathing or taking Vitamin D. This is likely caused from the neuromuscular hyperexcitability of magnesium deficiency that is somehow unmasked by higher Vitamin D levels.1
https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/newslet ... nswers-2/#
https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/newsletter/newsletter-vitamin-d-questions-and-answers-2/#
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Re: Vitamin D deficient....again!

Postby zjac020 » Sun Jun 29, 2014 1:46 pm

I strongly believe in the role of vitamin D in MS, but don't expect neurologists to tell you that.

I started working on my vitamin D levels immediately after my first (and for now only) relapse. I started sunbathing daily or every other day 25-30mins (in Madrid summer sun) and taking 2.000 IUs of D3. Three months later I had my vit D tested (I didn't have it tested at time of diagnosis because I stupidly relied on Neuros to tell me things, good thing that was very short lived). My level was at 34ng. It showed me that when I had my relapse and before all my deliberate effort to increase my vit d levels, I must have been very deficient.

I have since progressively upped my dose (5.000IUs, for a a month or two, then 10.000 for another two, then 20.000 and recently 30.000). When I was at 20.000IUs I had my vit d3 level, it was at 74ng/ml. I then upped my zinc and magnesium and vit d3 to 30.000IUs, 6 weeks later my level is now at 180ng/ml!! Maybe a tad too high (but I half follow Dr Ciceros vitamin D protocol for MS), but what I am getting is that level of other nutrients and minerals in the body definitely influence vitamin D absorption.

I have yet to hear of an MSer who doesn't have issues with Vitamin D3. Whats more, I also seriously believe that LYme and/or Chlamydia Pneumoniae is heavily involved in MS, and was wondering why Vitamin D3 in high doses was being so effective against MS (or those with supposed lYme or Chlamydia Pn), and Ive just come across this...

http://www.endocrine-abstracts.org/ea/0 ... 15p306.htm

I wonder if now its all starting to make sense...
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