1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby THX1138 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:11 pm

I bought the rowing machine back in 2012. My rowing form was good in the beginning, but a few months later, after not many uses, my legs started to spread out when I went forward. What do I have to do to have good form again :?: I asked the physical therapy people and they did not know.

How can I row without my legs spreading out when I go forward :?: :?:
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby Scott1 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:54 pm

Hi,

That's coming from your hips, your psoas, your hip flexors and TFL. It will depend on the posture you adopt through your torso and how you use your arms.

Your legs splay because your body wants to cheat and find the path of least resistance.

Take nearly all the weight and power out of the settings and focus exclusively on form. You need to engage your core muscles and find out what is tight and what is weak. That will also involve when you choose to breath in and out and whether you hold your breath or not. I can't see you but you need someone looking at you who is endlessly picking on you (nicely) or your body will cheat.

Regards,
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby THX1138 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 7:23 pm

Thanks :-D I'm very eager to be exercising in more ways that get my blood flowing more vigorously. Movement that gets my blood flowing better is so helpful to me.

Regarding the rowing, do you think that putting a band around my legs to force them to not spread as much would be a good idea, also. I actually have the following bands, but I haven't used them yet. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004I ... UTF8&psc=1

I just noticed that "Pilates" is in the title for the product.
:-O Somehow :-O :lol: I've become sensitized to that word.
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby Scott1 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 10:07 pm

Hi,

A Theraband can be very useful but that's probably not a great way to use it because you are not activating the right muscles.

Sticking a ball between your knees (like the yellow one) is more likely to activate the muscles that need the focus. https://www.ebay.com.au/i/152493527633? ... dispItem=1

I actually can't imagine how that would work on a rowing machine simply because of its design!

There is a point where you have to wake up the right muscle. That's when I suspect you will feel the discomfort.

Pilates equipment can be surprisingly diabolical and don't ever think you have gone as far as you can go. An instructor just makes a small change and you realise how much you still have to learn.

Regards.
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby vesta » Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:17 am

Greetings:

"THX1138" writes

Thanks :-D I'm very eager to be exercising in more ways that get my blood flowing more vigorously. Movement that gets my blood flowing better is so helpful to me.


In my opinion poor blood flow is at the origin of the muscle spasms. During sleep the blood circulation slows down. Would sleeping at a slight incline to keep the blood flowing out of the head help?

Best regards, Vesta
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby THX1138 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 12:26 pm

I bought these https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00MH ... =UTF8&th=1 in late 2014 and tried them for maybe a month or so. I did not use the 8-inch block (that seemed like it would feel way too extreme). But I did use the 5-inch one for a while. I used the 3-inch riser for a much longer period of time. I'm not so sure either helped, but maybe it's worth another try.

I was surprised and how extreme the angle felt when lying down, even from just raising the head of the bed 5 inches. When I took the risers out from under the bed, bringing the bed back to parallel with the floor, I felt like my head was lower than my feet. This feeling went away after a few weeks however.

Come to think of it, when I use the bed risers, I had my old bed and I had a thick (4") memory foam topper on top of the bed. Maybe that made it more uncomfortable having the bed at an angle.
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby vesta » Sun Oct 29, 2017 1:22 pm

THX1138 wrote:I bought these https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00MH ... =UTF8&th=1 in late 2014 and tried them for maybe a month or so. I did not use the 8-inch block (that seemed like it would feel way too extreme). But I did use the 5-inch one for a while. I used the 3-inch riser for a much longer period of time. I'm not so sure either helped, but maybe it's worth another try.

I was surprised and how extreme the angle felt when lying down, even from just raising the head of the bed 5 inches. When I took the risers out from under the bed, bringing the bed back to parallel with the floor, I felt like my head was lower than my feet. This feeling went away after a few weeks however.

Come to think of it, when I use the bed risers, I had my old bed and I had a thick (4") memory foam topper on top of the bed. Maybe that made it more uncomfortable having the bed at an angle.


Hello:

I had a disastrous experience with a foam inclined bed mattress, it had the effect of "crushing" my spine. An osteopathic adjustment allowed me to recover, fortunately. So I wouldn't recommend an extreme riser. (Actually, I would warn against it.) but recently I've just lifted my back slightly on the "hospital" bed (whatever it's called), really very little but so I'm not flat on my back and that seems to help. I'm always depressed in the morning which means the blood/fluids aren't circulating well, but either I get my husband to massage my back for less than a minute to visualize bringing the blood out of head, or I give myself a TENS acupressure treatment for 5 minutes and that cheers me up (the depression lifts) which means the fluids are flowing better. We need to find practical ways to overcome the fluid stagnation during the night. It's really better for me if I don't sleep too long. I wonder what sleeping on a vibrating mattress would accomplish?

Best regards, Vesta
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby THX1138 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 2:56 pm

I had a disastrous experience with a foam inclined bed mattress,

Vesta, Do you mean a standard bed positioned at an angle with a typical foam topper added to the top the bed, or a foam wedge topper on top of a regular, flat bed that, together, provide an inclined sleeping position. Or a foam bed positioned at an angle :?:

It's really better for me if I don't sleep too long.
Me too. I'm a very different person when I wake up in the morning as compared to when I go to bed. Sometimes around bedtime, I can actually move not so badly; this happens when I've eaten enough (which I often don't) and drank enough water throughout the day and evening (but not eating near bedtime as this makes things worse in the morning, also). During these good times late, late at night I can even pick my feet up about 8" off the floor. But when I get up in the morning, I struggle to get out of bed in less than 10 minutes or so.
If I sleep for about 2 to 4 hours and then wake up to go bathroom, my ability to move is worsened, but oh so much better than after seven or eight hours of sleep.

I wonder what sleeping on a vibrating mattress would accomplish?
I really wonder about this too.

It sounds like you sleep on your back. I sleep on my side almost all the time .
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby vesta » Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:38 am

Vesta, Do you mean a standard bed positioned at an angle with a typical foam topper added to the top the bed, or a foam wedge topper on top of a regular, flat bed that, together, provide an inclined sleeping position. Or a foam bed positioned at an angle :?:

I mean "A foam wedge topper on top of a regular, flat bed that together provide an inclined sleeping position," I realize that isn't ideal but I live in France and the only inclined bed is for babies to prevent food backing up to choke them. CCSVI hasn't occurred to anyone here that blood can reflux back into the brains, CNS of MSers. That bed was such a disaster I won't try even a good one. My body weight either crushed the spinal cord directly or cut off the CSF fluids and I could barely walk until my skeleton was adjusted.

It's really better for me if I don't sleep too long.
Me too. I'm a very different person when I wake up in the morning as compared to when I go to bed. Sometimes around bedtime, I can actually move not so badly; this happens when I've eaten enough (which I often don't) and drank enough water throughout the day and evening (but not eating near bedtime as this makes things worse in the morning, also). During these good times late, late at night I can even pick my feet up about 8" off the floor. But when I get up in the morning, I struggle to get out of bed in less than 10 minutes or so.
If I sleep for about 2 to 4 hours and then wake up to go bathroom, my ability to move is worsened, but oh so much better than after seven or eight hours of sleep.

I wonder what sleeping on a vibrating mattress would accomplish?
I really wonder about this too.

It sounds like you sleep on your back. I sleep on my side almost all the time .[/quote]

Vesta: I sleep on my back because I have pins in my arms after a bad accident. Before trying a vibrating mattress
I'm thinking of buying an EMS electrical muscle stimulation set to stimulate the bands of muscles running parallel the spine, there is 3 in 1 Monbelt 400 (cost 35 euros)set for the stomach, back, arms and thighs. Stimulate the lower back at the waist and the upper back to see if that will keep the fluids circulating through the night. Maybe keeping it on all night might not be so great, need a minor pulse. There is an abdomen belt one could put on the back. Anyway, it's up to us to experiment and see what works to get the fluids circulating. It is VERY important because in my opinion every time the blood/CSF backs up I think it does some damage which accumulates. This is a bit sketchy because my computer has gone down and I'm on borrowed time on this one.

Regards, Vesta
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby THX1138 » Mon Nov 06, 2017 1:08 am

Vesta, Everyone gets somewhat dehydrated overnight. Do you think you get excessively dehydrated overnight :?:

I sure do. And that seems to be the cause for much of my problems when I wake. And, the longer I sleep, the more dehydrated I get and the worse my symptoms get.
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby vesta » Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:27 am

THX1138 wrote:Vesta, Everyone gets somewhat dehydrated overnight. Do you think you get excessively dehydrated overnight :?:

I sure do. And that seems to be the cause for much of my problems when I wake. And, the longer I sleep, the more dehydrated I get and the worse my symptoms get.


Greetings:

In the last year or so I do get dehydrated overnight, but I think that is more related to my age (69) than the MS. My husband (no MS) has the same issue. Since I started working on boosting fluid circulation, and resumed a correct diet, I feel much better. I no longer have that stuffed up feeling in my head and little to no progression.

Best regards, Vesta
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby THX1138 » Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:48 pm

I'm happy to hear about your success with the head stuffiness. :-D

Did you find that the head stuffiness went with your symptoms? My head stuffiness and warmth go along with many of my ms symptoms. What, specifically, did you do to cause the improvement ?
I'm about a quarter of a century younger and dehydration, especially overnight and after meals, is a serious issue with me.
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Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Postby vesta » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:51 am

THX1138 wrote:I'm happy to hear about your success with the head stuffiness. :-D

Did you find that the head stuffiness went with your symptoms? My head stuffiness and warmth go along with many of my ms symptoms. What, specifically, did you do to cause the improvement ?
I'm about a quarter of a century younger and dehydration, especially overnight and after meals, is a serious issue with me.


Greetings:

The symptoms you have mentioned – muscle cramps/spasms on waking, symptoms worse the longer you sleep, head stuffiness, and heat sensitivity – point to stagnant, obstructed blood/CSF circulation in the head/brain. (Dr Flanagan pointed out that if the brain is usually cooler than the body it’s because of the cooling effect of fluid circulations. Stagnant fluids cause the brain to heat up which exacerbates injury to the tissue and MS symptoms.)

Apparently my morning TENS self treatment (5’) or upper back massage (1’) has been enough to release blood circulation. (Dr. Owiesy’s idea that when the middle smooth muscle layer of the brain’s draining veins go into spasm, blood flow is cut off, makes perfect sense to me since a brief massage is enough to release the spasm.) Swimming brings total relief. Try it and note the difference in mood, well being.

Consider consulting my site for a fuller discussion. www.mscureenigmas.net/

Best regards, Vesta
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