Relapse free for 20 years, my friend's reccomendations

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Relapse free for 20 years, my friend's reccomendations

Postby Apuman » Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:35 am

Hi all, I thought that some of you might be interested in reading the thoughts of my friend. He was diagnosed with RRMS about 25 years ago, and hasn't had a problem for the past 20. Below is the body of an email that he sent me, outlining his approach.

When I was 30 I was dying. I was obese, had the beginnings of typeII diabetes, had active MS with some severe episodes, I was very depleted weak and sick. I made a number of changes, and have a sense of how each change affected me, but to be honest I'm not totally sure why I got better.

The main change was how I looked at things (i.e. health issues). I've been around two groups (Native American and Western) my whole life and strongly influenced by both. I realized there are profound differences in the fundamental assumptions of these two groups. I confronted these differences in myself, but I find it almost impossible to explain it to a Western mind.

I found that in all tribal peoples of the world what the West calls science, medicine, law, and religion are a single thing to the tribal mind. How could this be, and what separated them?

You believe in getting somewhere (like optimum health, and a promised land). Growth, progress, development, improvement-- your life depends on these. For example, we all now are dependent on a growth economy. What doesn't grow will consumed by those that do.

This is contrasted with a belief in equilibrium. The highest form of equilibrium is a cycle. This is why science, health, religion and law were once one. The goal of all four was equilibrium and alignment with natural cycles. Once the assumption of infinate growth and progress was adopted they separated.

If you look at health from this perspective what can you see. First, all disease is either your body out equilibrium, or not economically valuable (a purely functional definition on which your life depends).

There are a number of dis-ease states unique to Westerners. This includes auto-immune diseases. M.S. of course being one. I would consider most all Western disease as humans being out of equilibrium with with their evolution. Westerners defy subtle influences, then mitigate, then simply acquiesce to institutionalization (so your out of the way of progress and growth).

As to what I did to get better there is a backdrop of a lifestyle. This is a very complex piece. I'm writing down what I've come up with in regards to diet and exercise. I'll send you a copy if you're interested once I've gotten a bit farther. Basically evolution can't be ignored for long, and if you want to stay in this system and out of their institutions it has to be addressed. But here are some specifics:

Stop eating like a child: Children need to eat many times a day. Basically each time you eat there is a release of hormones a growing body needs. The adult body of Westerners are being poisoned by an overdose of these hormones.

Sun: Homosapians evolved in a desert during a drought. Sun is like oxygen to us. Both are powerful poisons and eventually are the cause of our deaths, but both are absolutely essential to our functioning. Never allow sunburn, but get as much as you can. There has long been a known corolation of MS with latitude.

Milk: Because you're european you probally have the genetics to handle milk pretty well, but even among europeans there are problems with it. Milk, like our eating habits, is something we need to mature out of. There has been much looked at with milk and MS.

Exercise: Humans do have physicall endowments which have no rival in the animal kingdom. It was not just our big brains that gave us such an advantage. First, humans can handle the hot sun better then any other animal. Second, though not the fastest, strongest, and having armor or weapons, we can exert our muscles all day. Many hunters use to just pick up a trail in the morning, then follow and run them down (all day!). Men especially need to bring their skelatal muscles to exhaustion on a regualr basis. If you can't yet move to a basic agricultural life style, lift weights such that you experience muscle failure three times a week.

Wisdom: Western medicine has a couple of hundred years of wisdom, your body has 4 billion years of wisdom. Learn to listen, and don't aquiese to the artifactual conclusions and rationalizations of clever children.

Dirt: Auto-immune disease happens when we are always clean little children our mothers' show off. Even Western medicine has shown us this over and over. A law of evolution is that whatever a population encounters (either initially detrimental or incedental) becomes esential.

In conclusion, go outside, work very hard, get dirty, and quit eating like a child.


Now, I am a bit torn about this, because before I was diagnosed, I was very active, and spent lot's of time outside getting dirty. I wasn't quite as in line with his thoughts on eating, because although I liked to eat healthy foods, I did like to eat often, and I've always had a real sweet tooth ;)

For me, this also serves as a reminder that culture plays a very strong role in MS, something that seems to warrent more attention than it recieves.

At the very least, I figured that his dramatic turnarond could serve as a source of real inspiration.
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Postby carolew » Tue Dec 29, 2009 3:15 pm

Makes me think..... Carole
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Postby Karazhan » Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:08 am

VERY interesting thoughts!
I'm also torn about these. I've always been inclined (in theory if not in practice) to go with the natural vs. artificial approach to things but I have to wonder, if the species adapted to conditions a few thousand years ago, would we not also adapt to current conditions, like multiple meals, reduced exposure to sun & reduced physical demands. Let's not romanticize the past too much, although I do that often. We may have MS, Diabetes, Heart Disease, etc...,in our culture but I would imagine that tribal cultures 5000 years ago had some common health issues too. Still, I can't help but think that in another few thousand year, the human body will look somewhat different, bigger bottoms from sitting, for starters. 8O
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Postby Apuman » Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:56 pm

Karazhan wrote:I have to wonder, if the species adapted to conditions a few thousand years ago, would we not also adapt to current conditions, like multiple meals, reduced exposure to sun & reduced physical demands.


The problem is that our lifestyles have changed faster than out bodies can adapt. 5000 years, reletivly, is just a tic on the clock of evolution. To compound this, the idea of "survival of the fittest" which drives evolution and adaptation, has been stifled by medicine. Whereas 5000 years ago, a sick person would be left to die off, and thus not allowed to procreate, today we go to great lengths to keep sick people alive and functioning.

Please don't get me wrong, I believe medicine is very necessary, because as I've just stated, our enviroment is changing faster than our bodies can adapt. Medicine can help us do this, help us stay in equalibrium by treating the conditions our bodies suffer when they can't keep up with our changing lifestyles. However, it appears that it's also changing faster than our current medical system can keep up with.

Many of our health problems may also stem from the fact that we are simply living longer lives. In hunter-gatherer times, one would be very lucky to live to age 30. One might imagine that MS could have existed in that time, but people genealy wouln't live long enough for it to be a factor in the "survival of the fittest" game.

I am of the belief, however, that MS is a very recent disease, coming into existance within the past 150-200 years. That being said, instead of focusing on the past 5000 years, I feel it's most productive to look at what's changed in the past 200 years or so. Looking at it this way, many of his observations still hold up well.
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Postby Karazhan » Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:07 am

Apuman wrote: the idea of "survival of the fittest" which drives evolution and adaptation, has been stifled by medicine. Whereas 5000 years ago, a sick person would be left to die off, and thus not allowed to procreate,


Good Point!
I love this topic, it really fires my imagination.
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Postby carolew » Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:24 am

' Many of our health problems may also stem from the fact that we are simply living longer lives. In hunter-gatherer times, one would be very lucky to live to age 30. One might imagine that MS could have existed in that time, but people generaly wouln't live long enough for it to be a factor in the "survival of the fittest" game. '


I also think that back then, many diagnoses were just not made. Exemple, the lady across the street was limping more and more but no one knew why....No one could explain why she walked like her mom before her death...
And like Apuman said, people did not grow very old and where often malnourished... they blamed everything on the lack of special medicines and wanted to know the secrets of the native indiens ( here in Canada).
Happy New Year and I wish mobility to all.... haha... Carole
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Postby Wonderfulworld » Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:43 pm

Hmmm.
Some food for thought.

But I have to raise some doubts - I was actually working outdoors, getting a lot of sun, and pretty filthy all the time (archaeologist), eating about 4 times a day max, exercising to exhaustion etc. - and yet MS still hit me.

I wonder if your friend wouldn't have just experienced a mild course of MS anyway.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Concussus Resurgo
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RR-MS dx 1998 and Coeliac dx 2003
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Copaxone, Cymbalta. EPO, Fish Oils, Vitamin D3 2000 IU daily, Cal/Mag/Zinc, Multivitamin/mineral, Co-Enzyme Q10, Probiotics, Milk Thistle.
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Postby Bubba » Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:01 pm

The whole email is "Deep" and makes alot of sense.
That being said, I don't think it is meant as a way to prevent MS, but rather that fellas thoughts on why he hasn't had a relapse in 20 years. Maybe, maybe not? But it is definately a different angle of thinking about things.
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Postby zinamaria » Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:31 am

Wow, great to see a forum like this one! And I greatly appreciate all that I have read here.
I too am one of those whose health I 'thought' was optimum, like excersise (ran 2 marahons, 10k's etc) and grew up in southern Cal, so got plenty of sun...my peers thought I was the healthiest person they knew. Then MS.
What I have realized though, when MS arrived, there were (and are!) changes that could be made that really made and make a difference for me.
In diet, for example, I thought I was quite healthy, but until I gave up sugar, in ALL its forms, including hidden sugar (and also natural sugar like fruit and honey) for 3 months (this was several years ago) I did not realize what a sugar addict I was. When I re-introduced even fruit back into my diet the sugar cravings kicked in again. The point: It is hard to understand what one has until one no longer has it. Sugar is poison and are bodies are not equipped to handle the overload we as a culture have introduced into diet.
I know so many people that say "Oh, I don't have a problem with sugar" but they are overloading on breads, pastas, alcohol, fruit, fruit juice; and just because they do not eat chocolate cake they think they don't have a sugar dependence!
Evaluating carefully is not easy, but is so worthwhile and our bodies love us when we love it. All we do for our bodies is a form of love.

By the way, Sugar is added to the items we least expect would have sugar, like soymilk. Ann Boroch states in her book, Healing MS: “When you begin to read labels, you will see almost every food on the market, from canned goods to breads to salt, contain sugar in some form. Refined sugar is disguised as sucrose, fructose, dextrose, brown sugar, glucose, evaporated cane juice, high-fructose corn syrup, lactose, and maltose.”
And again from Ann Boroch: “The United States is a nation addicted to sugar. In 1890, the average America ate 10 pounds of sugar a year. Today, that figure is between 150 and 200 pounds.”

How's that for evolution! Also grains are newly introduced in our diets and they are not easy to digest, especially gluten grains. Not to mention they are another form of sugar.
In the far east (like in China) the 'gut' is viewed as the seat of wisdom, not the brain. 75% of our energy is taken up by the digestion process, so eating less and giving our guts a break; (and not eating like a 'child' is great wisdom; eating less is so wise!!); NOT eating after 5 or 6pm is a great way to utilize the energy we do have for healing. America suffers from over-eating and stressing the digestive system, which in turn stresses the organs.
And one would be amazed at how much good sleep you get and how great you feel when you don't eat after 5pm, until morning time.

Much of the changes I have made are and were not easy, at all. But the quality of my life is so much healthier, even AS I suffer the effects of MS.
And Attitude, the great vehicle of our spirit, can and does heal.

Am I lonely socially? Sometimes because I can no longer eat the way I used to, do not 'embibe' like once before; but I have made and kept the friends and family that respect my need for optimum health. After all, eating is such a social activity. But what's more important, going out to dinner or feeling good?
After many years of adjusting eating habits, I now crave only what is good for my body and cells. AND it is always a process, for I am not perfect, nor is there a destination, but rather all is a journey.

Happy New Year!!
Peace,
Zinamaria
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