all things vitamin D

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Postby patientx » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:44 am

The latest news he gave me was regarding a study, where pwMS were given high daily doses of D, around 70,000 units....

... Another advantage to this is that the body knows how to essentially shut off vitamin D production before it starts reaching toxic levels.

I'd be careful here. That's an incredibly high dosage of vitamin D. The body does regulate the amount of active 1,25 D circulating, but vitamin D toxicity and hypercalcemia can still be concerns.
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Postby jimmylegs » Tue Mar 16, 2010 1:38 pm

agree. if the 25(OH)D3 gets up over 250 you're into the hypercalcemia risk range. i accidentally got up to 271 recently. d'oh!
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Postby L » Tue Mar 16, 2010 1:51 pm

Oh yes, this isn't something that you'd want to try out on a whim..

Perhaps the paper will reveal more. It's possible, for example, that such a high dose was administered weekly, perhaps even foods rich in calcium were to be avoided for a couple of days. It's imaginable that a burst of high dose vitamin D might do what it does to B cells and EBV/whatever without the body having enogh time to overdose on calcium (not that that is the only problem associated with an overdose of D (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_D# ... _ingestion).

Suffice to say that people with MS, especially those who don't get out as much as they used to and especially in winter, ought to be taking 10,000iU of D3 daily (and occassionally getting their levels checked).
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Postby Apuman » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:55 pm

Yeah, I'm definetly not sure on the details of the study, and I surely wouldn't think anyone should take that much D without the close supervision of a physician. I'm sure the subjects of this study are being monitored very closely for any signs of complication.

On the other hand, the more the medical community understands about vitamin D, the more they have been increasing the celing for what they consider to be a safe level. More than 700 units was once thought to be dangerous, and currently I'm taking 4000 daily. I guess only time will tell.

I agree with him, that for the time being, getting plenty of sun seems to be a good plan for any MS patient who it wouldn't raise other issues for (melenoma, sun allergies, ect). After all, the body knows how to produce it, and it also knows when it's had enough.
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Postby jimmylegs » Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:02 am

actually i think you'd need to megadose calcium to prevent hypercalcemia while d3 megadosing.. hc happens because a high d3 dose pulls calcium from your bones to get what it needs.
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Postby L » Wed Mar 17, 2010 5:02 am

jimmylegs wrote:actually i think you'd need to megadose calcium to prevent hypercalcemia while d3 megadosing.. hc happens because a high d3 dose pulls calcium from your bones to get what it needs.


Ah, ok, I was getting hyper and hypo mixed up! I thought that it would be a case of avoiding calcium..
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Postby patientx » Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:37 am

One thing that Cantorna and others found in their experiments with Vitamin D and animal models of autoimmune disease, was that the animals did better with a combination of Vitamin D/calcium than with just Vitamin D alone - particularly the female subjects. Of course, these were animal experiments, so take it for what it's worth.

I'm sure JL will agree, if you're supplementing with high doses of Vitamin D, you will probably want to get your blood checked at some point, to see what the level is. At the time of my diagnosis, I was around 21 ng/ml. I started supplementing, and though I wasn't real consistent, the last few months I was doing about 5000 IU's per day (at no point was I ever more than this). In January, after about a year and a half, I got my level tested again, and it was in the high 70's (ng/ml). This was such a big swing, I'm going to get it checked again, just to verify the level. Of course, that 5000 IU/day didn't include natural sources (I have been eating a lot of fish).
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Postby L » Sat Mar 20, 2010 6:37 pm

jimmylegs wrote:actually i think you'd need to megadose calcium to prevent hypercalcemia while d3 megadosing.. hc happens because a high d3 dose pulls calcium from your bones to get what it needs.


Hold on, I wasn't getting hyper and hypo mixed up, I was just a bit confused. So D3 augments the bodies uptake of calcium, to the bones and to the kidneys in particular, but at super high doses it will scavenge calcium from the bones?
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vitamin D

Postby boog » Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:26 pm

Ok, I'm wondering Patientx, if you felt a difference considering that the level of Vit D in your blood was so elevated?
Has anyone out there felt a difference when taking Vit D3?

Also, what is the best way to take Vit d - and is it in fact Vit D3 that pwMS should be taking?
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Postby jimmylegs » Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:44 pm

L, yes.

boog, can't say that i feel a big diff when megadosing d3. all i know is that i don't feel worse, and the numbers look much better. certain types of aches and pains can be relieved with vitamin d3 but i never noticed a dramatic difference like i did on the modified klenner protocol or on magnesium.
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Re: vitamin D

Postby L » Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:58 pm

boog wrote:Ok, I'm wondering Patientx, if you felt a difference considering that the level of Vit D in your blood was so elevated?
Has anyone out there felt a difference when taking Vit D3?

Also, what is the best way to take Vit d - and is it in fact Vit D3 that pwMS should be taking?


It's D3, (cholecalciferol.) I take 20,000iU in the winter. 10,000 when the sun is shining. I have had to have a few blood tests recently so I've asked them to also check D3/calcium levels. I take 10,000iU pills. At the moment the brand is 'Healthy Origins' but it's whatever's cheapest on ebay when I look for it..

I think the best I can hope for is no deterioration and, since I've been taking it, about 8 months, I've experienced none.
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Postby scorpion » Mon Mar 22, 2010 4:35 pm

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Vitamin D deficiency and allergies

Postby lyndacarol » Mon Mar 22, 2010 5:33 pm

My local newspaper carries a weekly doctor's column by Dr. Peter Gott. I'm sure it appears in many other newspapers -- perhaps yours.

On Sunday, March 21, 2010, the column focused on vitamin D. Most of the information was familiar to us -- essential for calcium absorption; affect on the immune system; sources of vitamin D; etc.

The one tidbit that was news to me was "Your low vitamin D level may indeed be the cause of your allergies, which are causing your cold and flu-like symptoms;..."

CAUSE? Perhaps people with allergies should have their vitamin D level tested routinely. This may be a good idea for any of us -- allergies or not.
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Postby jimmylegs » Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:54 pm

yes d3... the alternative is d2 which is a plant variety not animal.
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Re: My doctor's thoughts on vitamin D

Postby NHE » Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:33 am

Hi boog,
I've done fairly well with a combined calcium, magnesium, zinc and vitamin D3 combination supplement. I recently had my vitamin D levels checked and 25-hydroxy D3 was at 109 nmol/L (no megadosing here just 400IU D3/day of the combined supplement). By the way, I found that my Raynaud's syndrome coincidentally disappeared when I switched over to the combined supplement from plain D3 at 1000IU/day (it's been 2 years and it still hasn't returned).

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Last edited by NHE on Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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