herbals

Discuss herbal therapies, vitamins and minerals, bee stings, etc. here

Postby kats » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:00 pm

Hi JL,

This Home/Doc thought it is a waste of money having bought all the vitamins that my son was on.
I will have to find the bag to list them all.
Going forward though what blood tests would I need to organise for him. & would it be done through local GP referral.
Or would I need to see some specialist for MS diets?.
Our Neuro just says have a good diet but does not really beleive changing your diet will help MS.
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Postby sou » Wed Jan 13, 2010 6:10 pm

Just a warning:

Do not ever ever ever use olive leafs that contain chemicals. They might help you feel less fatigued, but you will end up fatigued again by running to the bathroom.

sou(r)
Shortest joke: "We may not be able to cure MS but we can manage its symptoms."
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Postby jimmylegs » Wed Jan 13, 2010 6:15 pm

like this sou? ;)
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Postby jimmylegs » Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:16 pm

hi kats, when it comes down to it everyone's ms is different, but in terms of what research generally finds in ms patients, your son may want to look at his levels of vit B12, vit D3 (that test would be 25(OH)D3), zinc, uric acid, selenium, omega 3 fatty acids (PUFAs) and it couldn't hurt to get a magnesium level too. especially considering the spasticity.

i have typically gone through my family doc to get the requisitions for these tests. most of them have been covered under ontario's health insurance plan. i had to pay for about 3 tests since i started doing all this at the beginning of 2006. each one about $30-$35.
hope that helps :)
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Postby kats » Thu Jan 14, 2010 3:51 am

Thanks JL.
I wil try to convince him to have these tests done....qppreciate your time.
He is honestly sick of trying different herbs, teas, capsules, juices and the lot including holy waters.
Especially whilst taking these things he was still getting worse and has started to give up on a lot of them.
He has had a hair analysis done previously by another naturopath and the guy that tested him he went saying that he had all these problems internally and put him on all these detox things and was taking the stuff for over 6 months and was still having relapses with the ms...So now does not beleive in a lot of these natural things he beleives the only thing that has put a hold on the disease is the chemo mitoxantrone.

How much Swimming do you do weekly? Are u able to use/move/kick legs ?
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Postby jimmylegs » Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:35 am

i bet he would be! it makes a lot more sense to know from your bloodwork, where you are starting from, and what you are aiming for. if you can see in your bloodwork over time that the levels you are supplementing are not sufficient to get your results into an optimal spot, of course the regimen is going to seem useless. also, many natural remedies are meant to support healthy function. many vitamins out there come in 'servings' that are meant to augment diet in healthy people.

personally i don't believe there's much point to taking supplements blindly without measuring what is happening in your blood both as a starting point, and for monitoring over time. no wonder your son is discouraged.

if he will agree to some bloodwork, the findings could be that all his nutrient levels are optimal - but i doubt it.

the results for the tests i mentione WILL likely come back 'normal', but that is a whole other kettle of fish. 'normal' is just the bell curve and includes everyone that is sick.

IQ example: gump and einstein are both in the 'normal range' too.
who would your son rather be, from a nutritional health perspective??

here's hoping your son has the patience for a little detective work!
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Postby notasperfectasyou » Thu Jan 14, 2010 1:12 pm

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Postby kats » Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:05 am

I will let him read what you have written and I am sure he will ask to be tested. The problem is he is a big chicken when it comes to injections and that is another reason for not having some of these blood tests.
Thanks for your advise. :)
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Postby jimmylegs » Fri Jan 15, 2010 6:08 am

kats, tell him i used to be a huge chicken too. childhood trauma. had to get hypnotized and everything just to get a needle at the dentist. avoided inoculation programs at school. used to cry with relief when any needed tests were over. when i was getting my lumbar puncture i had to ask for more freezing because i was so freaked by even the dulled sensation of the needle going in. i chose not to take any ms meds at all, in part because of the continual injecting involved.

by comparison nutrition bloodwork is infrequent and the knowledge far outweighs the fear. you can get used to anything you're afraid of! at least, that's my feeling as a former phobic.

i did the same thing with heights. i noticed that small things that used to incapacitate me would have less impact if i was forced to do it repeatedly over time. for instance a certain set of stairs i had to use to get to work at one particular job. so i did rock climbing, skydiving, flying, intentionally looking over cliffs while hiking (dizzy!!), and most recently (couple years back now), a treetop obstacle courses with a massive high zip line.

when i have adult ski students who are afraid of the 'fall line' i give them the 'fall line challenge', making them do a straight run down a short pitch with a long flat runout. they overcome the fear and end up having fun, sometimes literally giggling, it's awesome and helps give them the confidence they need to execute turns on steeper slopes.

so back to needles, i still need to take some deep breaths and i can't watch the needle go in or the blood come out and all that. but i am very glad to know a lot about what is going on in my body. i hope this info helps your son too.

JL
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Postby kats » Fri Jan 15, 2010 6:30 am

JL you sound so young yet so amazing -you seem to be full of knowledge and have had lots of experience in all the things you mention.
I will deffinetly get him to read your posts and I think he might even join in this forum..one day! I am sure he will learn lots.
You seem to have the ms under control..
Do you expeience any ms symptoms at all currently or is that all in the past now ?
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Postby jimmylegs » Fri Jan 15, 2010 2:30 pm

aw shucks :) yea, i'm the 'idealist teacher' personality type so i guess sharing knowledge is my deal haha - i teach many things :D

whoops i did not answer your swimming question before.. i have been out of the habit lately but when i go i do a kilometer (40 lengths) and i'm just trying to get the time down - i'm SO SLOW, 40 minutes and my one friend i used to swim with could do it in under 20 :S sigh. i like to go two or three times a week but i don't have any local swimming buddies right now and i am not good at going by myself. i totally should though, i know there would be a bunch of regulars in there that i would end up getting to know... hmmm...

anyway i do hope your son joins the forum. it's a great place (no bias here :roll: ) hahaha

yes i do feel like i have the ms under control. but i have some permanent damage and that's that. i have 'stocking and glove' neuropathy. so, mild numbness in the hands and feet. thankfully my position sense came back during the 'klenner' protocol, and i can play guitar again WHEW!!!

anyway, yea when i exert myself and my core temp goes up, i lose functionality. for example when i get out of the pool after swimming a 40 lengths, yep i do have trouble walking for a few minutes.

also, if i stop taking my supplements, things go squirrelly. i abused myself with poor nutrition (vegan) for 15 years, and i'm only 4 years into trying to do things right. [eek it's my 4 year anniversary soon :S ] anyway i figure i need to give myself a little more time to build back up.

and i will also be looking into the CCSVI thing down the road - my dx attack came right after a major snowboarding whiplash headsmash... no helmet.. possible vein smusher? we'll see :)

anyway, here's hoping your son can find some optimism here at TIMS, if not from me, from the interesting developments in CCSVI :D

take care kats,
JL
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Postby kats » Mon Jan 18, 2010 1:27 am

Thanks for all your info JL much appreciate your time.
I will keep you posted on any progress looking further into some of the tests you suggest.
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Postby jimmylegs » Mon Jan 18, 2010 8:07 am

good luck kats!
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Postby kats » Mon Jan 18, 2010 3:32 pm

thanks again :D
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Ruscus Aculeatus // CCSVI

Postby ikulo » Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:40 pm

Does anyone have experience with Ruscus Aculeatus? It is generally used for venous disorders, but considering the possible CCSVI connection, wasn't sure if anyone had any experience? Here is a study about its success in treating venous stuff.

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