on omega 3 fatty acids / fish oils etc

Discuss herbal therapies, vitamins and minerals, bee stings, etc. here

Postby RedSonja » Mon Jun 02, 2008 11:30 pm

When I first got MS I took fish-oil capsules as recommended. Then "they" decided it didn't help with MS after all. OK.

Lately I attended a lecture on nutrition. The lecturer said we are all taking far too many supplements, a healthy varied diet makes all supplements redundant for normal healthy people. Then he mentioned omega-3. He said, it is recommended for people with MS. OK. Then he said, but which omega-3? He spouted a long list of different ones. He said, look at the packet and see which ones are in it.

So my question is, which omega-3 is the one we need, and do we really need it anyway?
Bibo ergo sum
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Re: Omega 3 & 6 - how much do you take?

Postby NHE » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:45 am

RedSonja wrote:So my question is, which omega-3 is the one we need, and do we really need it anyway?

One of my prior posts on this topic may be helpful for you.

http://www.thisisms.com/ftopicp-28551.html#28551

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Postby RedSonja » Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:34 am

How very interesting.

I have been sprinkling flax seed (linseed) on my muesli for decades, for the roughage. Now I know it has some of the right omega-3 in it.

I shall check out all the fish-oil caps in the drugshop and see if any have the "right ones". (DHA and EPA). But I don't think I could handle 15 a day. Wow. The neighbours would start to complain.
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Postby jimmylegs » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:15 am

varied healthy diet is important, but i've been on that for two years and if i didn't keep pushing to find out where my problem areas are, i wouldn't know that i had all these deficiencies. months after finding out that my magnesium levels affect my throat, when i eat plenty of magnesium laden foods now, still if i back off the supplements - not even stop just lower the dose - my throat goes haywire. and i have been eating meat since '06 too and at the end of '07 i was still zinc deficient. so i think it's quite important for people yes, to take diet seriously (i call mine "the biodiversity diet") but watch your levels and don't neglect nutritional supplements if they are needed!
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Postby DIM » Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:05 am

[b]
it's quite important for people yes, to take diet seriously (i call mine "the biodiversity diet") but watch your levels and don't neglect nutritional supplements if they are needed![/
b]
Agree 100%!
My wife takes 50mg zinc daily and although someone could say her zinc levels will be sky high they are in the middle of the scale!
Imagine without the supplementation.
I thing only omega-3 are required for our generation, most foods contain omega-6 and olive oil (omega 9) is everywhere!
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Postby jimmylegs » Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:16 am

i hear that DIM
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Re: Omega 3 & 6 - how much do you take?

Postby NHE » Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:55 am

RedSonja wrote:I have been sprinkling flax seed (linseed) on my muesli for decades, for the roughage. Now I know it has some of the right omega-3 in it.

I may have not been clear. In my prior post I wrote...
For myself, I decided to take a TBSP of ground flax seed per day just to help round out my omega-3 intake. I chose the ground flax seed over the flax oil as there are nutrients and fiber which are not present in the oil.

The omega-3 fatty acids that are really useful are DHA and EPA. These primarily come from fish. ALA is from plant sources and a small percentage gets converted to DHA and EPA. ALA is good for people who cannot consume fish perhaps due to an allergy. In addition to the TB of ground flax seed that I mentioned above, I'm currently taking 5 grams/day of fish oil. This provides about 1.5 grams of DHA and EPA combined.

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Postby jimmylegs » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:29 am

i checked the blend in the fridge and it has 1200mg gelcaps composed of flax borage and fish oils. it specifies amounts of the various types of O-3s involved, and says take 1-2 capsules per day, accompanying meals. i should check on the grams of each type, but it's all the way upstairs right now! ;)

why do you spell fridge with a g, but refrigerator without?
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Postby DIM » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:46 pm

I found Solgar's 950 formula the best omega-3 around and free from heavy metals but if someone can have a presription for Omacor (anti-colesterol drug from Merck that has almost 1gr omega 3 per caps) they are also fine.
EPA converts almost 100% to DHA so if someone takes only DHA there is no problem at all but IMHO 2grams/day omega-3 are required for MSers.
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Postby Abe » Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:13 pm

Yes, not all fish oil pills are created equal. Some have considerably better ratios of omega 3 to other fats.

Always read the label :idea:
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Take the plunge...take your oil in liquid form

Postby Longing4Cheese » Thu Jul 31, 2008 12:08 am

I am saving money and having fewer pills to swallow by ingesting my omega3s in liquid form. I haven't settled on the "perfect" approach yet, so right now I have, in the fridge, a bottle of each:

Udo's Oil - DHA - 3-6-9 Blend (2:1:1 ratio)
-- 1 Tbsp. has 13g total fat, of which 5g are omega-3s, which breaks down into roughly 5g of ALA, 100mg of DHA, and 3mg of EPA; and 3g of om-6, of which 40mg is GLA. Add in 3g of Omega-9 (oleic acid), and that's this variety of Udo's Oil.

"Health From the Sun" brand Omega 3-6-9 oil, vegetarian, organic.
1 Tbsp. has 5800mg of omega-3 (ALA), 290mg of om-6 in the form of GLA, and 2300mg more of om-6 in the form of LA (linoleic acid). Also has 1700mg of Oleic Acid (omega-9).

Cod Liver Oil - Spectrum brand - has the most DHA, of course. Nutrients are listed per teaspoon, so multiply by 3 to compare with Tablespoons, to get (all omega-3s):
1620mg DHA
1080mg EPA
and "other omega 3 - 230 mg"

I get most of these at Whole Foods, and yeah, the pills are pricey, esp. for the fish oil. We still have a $38 bottle of fish oil capsules in the fridge, but in the nightly ritual of putting all my supplements together to take with dinner, I've been giving my wife her 2 capsules of fish oil, but I'm a big boy now and take my oil by the tablespoon. The bottles of oil give me more bang for the buck ... I think they're all in the $7 to $15 range, and one Tbsp. has about as much omega-3 goodness as, like, 10 capsules of fish oil. (It's way too late for me to do a direct mg for mg comparison -- if you want exact numbers, be my guest.)

I am also doing the Swank Diet, so I limit my daily saturated fat intake. Some of these oils have sat fat (the cod liver oil has the most, at 3g per tablespoon; the others have 2.5g (Udo's) and 1.5g (the vegetable oil mix [flax, borage, evening primrose, etc.]). So I keep track of that along with keeping track of the sat fat that I get in my meals. It's really not that hard to do.

I tend to take the oil in the morning with breakfast, so I have all day to burn off the calories. It's still less of a fat blast than a lot of people have, say in their latte and butter croissant at a café, but I gotta watch my girlish figure (OK, that's not so funny when you can't see that I'm not a girl -- my bad...).

I'm still figuring this stuff out, too. But I'm done with capsules, except perhaps for convenience when travelling.

Courage,

Jack Sprat
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Review Article on Omega 3 and 6

Postby Shayk » Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:41 pm

Hi all

Stumbled across a nice review article on the omegas...

Polyunsaturated fatty acids and their potential therapeutic role in multiple sclerosis
There are some indications that PUFA intake has an inverse relationship with MS risk, but the controlled studies performed to date have not produced definitive results with regard to the potential benefits of PUFA supplementation in patients with MS.

They are encouraging clinical trials.

Sharon
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Fatty acid balance anyone ?

Postby skydog » Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:49 am

I will be going to a talk on MS treatment on March 12 at 7pm in Portland Oregon. Using a protocol to diagnose and treat fatty acid balance in the body. This is extremely important because of the fatty acid content of brain cell membranes that controls what enters and leaves the brains neurons. A PhD by the name of Patricia Kane is responsible for this protocol and she has had some very good success with MS as well as other neurological diseases. Has anyone on this site heard of this ? In case anyone noticed I had forgot the Oregon state part. all fixed... M
Last edited by skydog on Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby cheerleader » Sat Feb 28, 2009 9:52 am

Hi Skydog...
It's great you are getting proactive about your health and looking into nutritional balance. Looks like Patricia Kane, Phd. (she's not an MD, and I'm not sure what her doctorate is in) is looking into the links between fatty acids and the body. Here's an article she wrote awhile ago on "Lorenzo's Oil"-
http://www.explorepub.com/articles/nutrition1.html
In our struggle to direct the immune, endocrine, cardiovascular and nervous systems we have neglected to use the very substrate that is basic to all biochemical interactions -- fatty acids. Instead we have shunned lipids, removed them from our diets, blamed them for the ills of society-obesity, cancer, heart disease, degenerative illness-when in fact they are the critical substrates to the immune (cytokines, prostaglandins), endocrine (hormones, neurohormones) neuronal (myelin) components we attempt to manipulate. The administration of hormones, for example, often fails when an individual exibits very low serum cholesterol which is the base substrate for the cascade of regulatory hormones. Thus when an individual is loaded with a hormone they are often unable to properly utilize the hormone due to a deficiency of substrate (fatty acids, coenzymes). Recently the addition of DHEA has been suggested but this often further complicates the patient's chemistry rather than corrects the hormonal imbalance because the basic raw materials are missing and the ingestion of trans fats literally blocks fatty acid metabolism and hormonal production. The very availability of fatty acids (found in unrefined, cold processed oils, coconut butter, raw nuts and seeds) is often a challenge in the United States and now across Europe as our oils are hydrogenated to prolong shelflife.


Her premise is that unsaturated fats and fatty acids can help disease by returning serum balance. My husband follows Dr. Swank's dietary program, which limits animal fat and removes transfats and saturated fats and allows for plenty of good unsaturated fats found in fish, nuts and olive oil. It's worked for people with MS for 40 years...and continues to work...nothing really new here. I suppose one new component is that she recommends having your lipid levels tested, which is a terrific idea to monitor lipid storage in the body.

My one comment would be not to look to only one area of diet to the exclusion of all others, and don't get sucked into spending alot of money at the "talk." You can get all of Swank's advice on the web for free, and buy your own supplements. Wishing you well, and let us know how it goes!
AC
Husband dx RRMS 3/07
dx dual jugular vein stenosis (CCSVI) 4/09
http://ccsviinms.blogspot.com
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