of iron and MS

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Postby indigoinmotion » Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:21 pm

D3 anywhere from 5, 000 - 10, 000 iu per day (I'm tested regularly and am still on the low side) + In multi 1, oooIU
Trispartate: Calcium 400mg, Magnesium 360mg, Potassium 120mg +
In Multi calcium 300mg, Magnesium 285mg, Potassium 90mg
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Iron and connections to MS?

Postby phoxychocolat » Fri Sep 11, 2009 8:55 am

Hello,

I was wondering if anyone is familiar with possible links to too much iron in the diet and MS. Are there people with MS who have decided to eliminate iron supplements from their diets but are still getting iron through foods like Spirulina, Chlorella, Quinoa, etc? Are there people who have all together stopped eating ANYTHING that is a significant source of iron? I'm just wondering, as I'm reading about the possible links Iron has to MS (MRIs can apparently show iron deposits in the brain).

I'm wondering if such deposits could be a result of supplementing iron through certain vitamins or prescription iron pills that are too high in a type of iron that isn't absorbed well or gets lost in the body and ends up where it's not supposed to.

If I were to take Spirulina and chlorella (which I consider food and NOT vitamins), as well as Quinoa and Amaranth (high in iron), would one's body react that same way that it does to "iron pills"?

Most STANDARD iron supplements seem to make people sick, but I'm wondering if people have the same problem if they were to get just as much iron found in a standard iron supplement but they get that same measurement in a well rounded meal of food based iron.

Please let me know if I'm making any sense, as I can't imagine that taking ALL foods out of one's diet, if they contain any significant amount of iron, is "healthy".
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Postby Terry » Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:12 pm

phoxy,
I have had low iron for years, and yet decided to skip any iron supplementation. I do not worry about iron in my foods.
I saw a homeopathic doc for a while and he thought I should skip the iron supplements because iron is oxidative.
I wonder often if I am making the right decision. I have many times looked into this, and I come out unsure.
I have alopecia areata and my fingernails are pitted, both things I think would be helped by iron supplementation. And yet, I still don't.
The iron deposits in the brain add another reason to my decision not to supplement.
We have to have some iron, which is why I don't worry about iron-rich foods. I just don't add supplements.
I will be watching this thread with you to see what others think.
Terry
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Postby jimmylegs » Sat Sep 12, 2009 4:47 am

terry you know what i think!
low zinc is seen in ms, affects membrane integrity such as intestinal wall and blood brain barrier, and affects status of various things seen to be low in ms such as uric acid, and (i suspect) d3 absorption, and the ability of retinol to keep the eyes sorted out.

low zinc also causes problems with how your body handles iron. i've posted abstracts on that topic here at TIMS previously.

for one example, boosting zinc when you're low or deficient,also boosts your liver's ability to create uric acid. uric acid is low in ms patients. through zinc supplementation i have been able to optimize my zinc status, and my uric acid came along for the ride and is much higher now.
uric acid is a powerful antioxidant.

the risks of iron deposits in ms are there, *if your iron levels get too high*
but the benefits of iron are not worth forgoing, if you're not going to bother looking at the other aspects involved.

it's my feeling that adding iron deficiency to ms is a bad idea.
monitor your iron to make sure you are not deficient.
at a minimum, monitor and optimize your zinc status too.
of course zinc is only one of many factors involved!

you can be wary of iron deposits without depriving your body of the many benefits of this important element.
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Postby Terry » Sun Sep 13, 2009 10:51 am

terry you know what i think!


I do know, JL.
This post got me searching again. Reading on desquamation of iron.

Phoxy,
It does seem that all iron is absorbed the same. After that, I dunno.

Terry
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Postby shye » Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:55 pm

Terry,
Jimmylegs is right--areata is most often due to zinc deficiency, and zinc deficiency causes weak, pitted, and pale nails.
Once you have a mineral imbalance, lots of other things go wrong.
One of most classic examples: thyroid problems can be caused by imbalance between ratio of copper and zinc.
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Postby jimmylegs » Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:39 pm

shye, i think terry is talking about iron! it's me that continually bangs the zinc gong :)
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Postby jewelia » Tue Dec 15, 2009 9:40 pm

Hi,

There is some good information about iron chelation in the brain using antioxidants (Green tea extract EGCG). As study is currently being done on MS patients examining the benefits of taking EGCG.

It is something that we can do on our own and is relatively inexpensive. I'm going to try it in addition to taking A- Lipoic Acid, another powerful antioxidant. You can find the information on the facebook page - CCSVI in Multiple Sclerosis.
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Can iron pills affect MS?

Postby mrsjitters » Mon May 17, 2010 11:16 am

I have not been diagnosed yet. I had my first MS attack (ithink thats what it was) last year and fell pregnant before i could get an MRI. Well, I'm not pregnant anymore (i gave birth last month) and I was prescribed iron pills after having my baby. I haven't had an attack yet, and I'm dreading it. But, I've been having these weird headaches & neck pain and it made me wonder if its the iron pills..? Should I stop taking them?
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iron pills

Postby Alexandra » Mon May 17, 2010 9:36 pm

to my knowledge, iron intake is to be avoided by people with MS. vitamins are recommended, but preferably without iron. maybe you should do a blood test first to see if you do have an iron deficiency first of all?
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Iron supplementation and ms articles

Postby indigoinmotion » Wed Sep 01, 2010 5:54 am

Does anyone have any info or articles that I can print re: the use of iron supplementation and ms. Worried that iron supplementation will do more harm than good. MD is suggesting iv iron therapy, script and non script pill form iron supplements have failed. Any thoughts? Thanks.
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Postby shye » Wed Sep 01, 2010 2:37 pm

What are the results of your iron panel testing and of your CBC? Can't get advice without telling us what the problem is
.
Iron can be dangerous to supplement with whether you have MS or not.

A long thread, but which might have some answers for you is the Phlebotomy Anyone thread under the CCSVI topic.
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Postby jimmylegs » Wed Sep 01, 2010 4:25 pm

i'll have a look, iim.

My ferritin level is 18, my hair is falling out, and I am exhausted on top of the ms fatigue!


just wondering.. where's your ferritin level at compared to last year?

with low ferritin, you're definitely looking like an iron deficiency case without looking much further.

for other iron-related conditions such as hemochromatosis, hemolytic anemia, dideroblastic anemia, or iron poisoning, ferritin would be normal to high.

i have seen conflicting info on iron in anemia of chronic disease. one source said ferritin would be low, others say it could be normal/high.

you might want to look at Serum iron, Transferrin, and TIBC to rule out anemia of chronic illness. we can calculate your transferrin saturation from that to see what's what.

as for the tablets failing, what kinds of foods, drinks, or other supplements would you typically ingest at the same time? i wonder if it's a timing and combination issue?

what kind of dietary iron sources are in your routine? here's a little bit of reading on dietary iron bioavailability:

Boosting iron absorption: A guide for the science-minded
http://www.parentingscience.com/iron-absorption.html

have you even analysed your routine food combinations for iron inhibitors?

and one other question.. did you ever get a zinc test since last year?

as for iron supplementation and ms, one not exactly bang-on but still interesting abstract:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18573825
Mult Scler. 2008 Jul;14(6):857-9. Epub 2008 Jun 23.
Interferon beta therapy increases serum ferritin levels in patients with relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis.


that said there is iron dysregulation going on in ms. i'm looking into ferritin binding in the brain which is absent in ms lesions, and trying to figure out why exactly it doesn't get bound.

need to read more... i'm figuring out which search terms to use still.

i suspect zinc issues. hard to say, more reading ahead :)
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Postby indigoinmotion » Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:55 am

My original ferritin level was 18. After taking lots of various forms of iron (i.e liquid, pill, food), I raised it to 24, not a significant jump. Exhaustion was a concern and MD thought it was due to low iron. Dr. refused to order a Zinc test, hoping a new Holistic MD I'm scheduled to see will. I did add Zinc to the regimen and of course, C, but it didn't seem to make a difference. Thanks for the article JimmyLegs. I'm thinking the high fiber diet I've been on is a hindering factor to iron absorption! I'll try adjusting food schedule.
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Postby shye » Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:15 pm

IIM
I just got my iron panel back, and my ferritin is 24--I am very happy with this (low end of range is 20)--better to be low.
But I got mine low thru a phlebotomy.
If you fear yours might again go lower, definitely look into your zinc status--I know I need a lot, due to various other tests in the past, and never take less than 50 Mg per day, usually more--yet my zinc serum just tested is LOW.
I don't have the time at this moment to go into it, but check out a lot of Jimmylegs posts re Zinc and its importance.
Zinc has a lot to do with energy.
It defintitely affects iron levels. (as does copper status, and if take zinc must take copper in ratio 1 to ten (coppper to zinc)--unless on mega dose of zinc, than need to take a lesser ratio since clearly need excess zinc but not excess copper).
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