of iron and MS

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Postby L » Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:29 pm

Remember that vitamin C helps the body absorb iron.

I am a little anaemic but pistachio nuts _ vitamin C seem to fix it..
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Postby jimmylegs » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:31 pm

ah ha, glad we might have tracked something down here, iim.

L - you are exactly right: from the article link above re science minded blah:

What about phytic acid? Phytates, which are found in most plant foods, can reduce iron absorption by up to 80%. But vitamin C—consumed along with a meal--can counteract the effect. In one study, preschoolers with iron deficiency anemia were given vitamin C supplements twice a day—100 mg at each of two phytate-rich meals. After two months, most of the kids were no longer anemic (Seshahdri et al 1985).

This underscores the importance of vitamin C. Many grains and legumes (including soy) can be good sources of iron--if you consume them with vitamin C.
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby THX1138 » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:49 am

jimmylegs, do these results look healthy? I'm especially wondering about the iron saturation being so close to the bottom of the "normal" range.

Component ------------- Standard Range--------Your Value
IRON -------------------- 33 - 155 ug/dL---------52
FERRITIN --------------- 30 - 300 ng/mL---------67
TIBC -------------------- 200 - 400 ug/dL--------321
IRON SATURATION --- 15 - 50 % --------------- 16

--------------------------------------------


Component Standard Range Your Value
TRANSFERRIN 190 - 350 mg/dL 235
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby jimmylegs » Tue Feb 11, 2014 4:20 am

you could try getting the serum ferritin up to 80, but you don't want it any higher esp while you are working on imbalances... might be as simple as working to increase iron absorption/utilization. what is your daily intake of vit C right now?
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby THX1138 » Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:23 pm

what is your daily intake of vit C right now?


most days it is minimal, but on the few days a week that I do a niacin flush, it is 500-1000 mg.
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby jimmylegs » Tue Feb 11, 2014 3:52 pm

to help with absorption of dietary iron, try adding daily vit C foods to your diet, via 1c servings of:
papaya, red peppers, broccoli, Brussels sprouts, strawberries, cauliflower, etc

parsley is good in large volumes as well. have you ever tried tabbouleh salad? loads of parsley which is FULL of vit C (has a decent shot of potassium too)

vit C foods:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tnam ... #foodchart

as you know, you'll need to keep an eye on your iron status as you work on your zinc situation. vit C will be one way to help.
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby THX1138 » Tue Feb 11, 2014 4:12 pm

can I just take vitamin C supplements for now?
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby jimmylegs » Tue Feb 11, 2014 5:01 pm

yes - but obviously whole foods provide a more diverse array of nutrients and other beneficial factors that would not be contributed via an isolated supplement.
general recommendations are along the lines of 5-12 servings of veggies and fruit per day. so if you can start working on even one to two *full* servings per day (in addition to any V8 on the menu), it'll be a step in the right direction.
could be as simple as buying some snacks in the form of pre-cut mixed veg from a salad bar or stir fry section, plus a bottle of balsamic salad dressing for dipping.
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby jimmylegs » Sat Dec 27, 2014 11:45 am

i have posted this study around the site a few times over the past year and a bit, but thought this info (elevated iron with low zinc and copper in MS patients) deserved a spot here as well.

Serum level of iron, zinc and copper in patients with multiple sclerosis
http://jmj.jums.ac.ir/~jumsjmj/files/si ... 0187b3.pdf
"Introduction:
Multiple sclerosis (MS) is one of the most common neurologic disorders. It appears that in addition to the common risk factors, there may be other factors, such as serum level of trace elements, which affect the development or course of the disease. The aim of this study was to evaluate the serum levels of iron, zinc and copper in patients with MS and compare them with the control group.
Materials and Methods:
In this study, serum levels of iron, zinc and copper were determined in 25 patients with MS and compared with those of 25 healthy individuals matched with age and sex. Data were analyzed in SPSS, version17 using statistical descriptive methods (mean- percentage, SD) and t-test
Results:
In this study, there were 9 males in the case and control groups and the rest were female. The mean age of the patients was 28 ± 3.44 years for men and 24 ± 2.55 years for women. Mean serum iron levels were significantly elevated in MS patients (127.04 ± 34.67) compared to these levels in the control group (103.95 ± 33.81). Mean serum zinc levels were significantly decreased in MS patients (10.92 ± 2.114) as compared to these levels in the control group (14.05 ± 3.2). Also, mean serum copper levels were significantly decreased in MS patients (88.58 ± 19.56) compared to the levels in the control group (110.37 ± 37.1).
Conclusion:
The findings of this study show that serum levels of Iron, Zinc and Copper in patients with MS are different from those in normal population."
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby Health7 » Wed Apr 22, 2015 9:04 am

Hello,

Am undiagnosed, but suspect MS. My serum ferritin couple months ago showed 10 (last November 7 only). Is it possible to rise ferritin levels naturally? Or with such low level I should put my trust on supplements to give that first kick? Have digestion issues so in every way trying to avoid any aggravation...

Thank you in advance.
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby jimmylegs » Wed Apr 22, 2015 9:13 pm

hi there :)

it's best to look at dietary measures as a first step. if you are concerned about ms, adding just iron can potentially cause problems for nutrients like zinc, which are another common trouble nutrient for ms patients.

cofactors also come into play here. a multivitamin and a diet rich in natural (not fortified) iron plus vitamin C might be something to consider. this makes especially good sense if your current diet is low in iron-dense foods and/or vit C.

can you tell us anything more about your symptoms in general and digestion issues in particular, and if you are on any associated meds? that could be useful info also.
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby Health7 » Sun Apr 26, 2015 12:09 pm

Thank you for fast reply, Jimmylegs:)

Symptoms ever experienced and related to my digestion issues include: bloating, fatigue, feeling of indigestion - as if food/air is trapped inside stomach, that makes me wanna burp artificially and that causes heart palpitations, skipped beats, ache around heart area, that spreads to the left arm. In the end of 2013 had a major attack... more indigestion, more palpitations, super high sensitivity in the body (moving toes would make already fast heartbeat even faster! That happened only once, though...). After couple of days on the onset of the attack began to experience spasms in my upper tummy area (no ache, more like a rising up waves?), followed by fast heartbeat and sudden confusion in my head. I could not consume any food whatsoever: a teaspoon of soup or cooked vegetables would bring about these or those sensations... Not eating food would still cause symptoms to appear, kind of unpredictable. Most of the time had to avoid standing or even sitting positions due to aggravation of the symptoms. Doctors said that's anxiety, nothing was found except minor gastritis and insignificant hernia. I was puzzled...

Other symptoms, that I myself relate to MS are: brain fog, vertigo, dizziness, derealisation, nervousness, aberrant perception of things, panic attack, obsessive thoughts, blurred vision, sensitivity to light, flashes (white or black) in the sight, tinnitus, pressure inside the head, ears; spasticity, lhermitte's sign, pressure/ache in the neck, along the spine, head moving forward in accordance to heartbeat; cold and hot, crippling, tingling sensations on the skin, twitching of the muscles, numbness, heavy muscles, limbs becoming light, diminished breathing capacity, spasms in the uterus, frequent urgent call to urinate. Spasms in the jaw, that makes restrictions to move it. Tremble (rare). Heat waves to the limbs. Pulsing sensations in the tummy, or back, or neck, or arm.

On February got results of vitB12 - 293ng/ml (140-699) More results are on the way (Mg, Zn, VitD).

My stomach became extremely fussy. I have to be always conscious when putting food in my mouth. Poor digestion. Homeopath found my pancreas dysfunction. Prescribed Momordica compositum and Pomander Gold Aurosoma for solar plexus. Helps a great deal, but does not uproot the problem with the digestion.
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby lyndacarol » Sun Apr 26, 2015 2:34 pm

Health7 wrote:Symptoms ever experienced and related to my digestion issues include: bloating, fatigue, feeling of indigestion - as if food/air is trapped inside stomach, that makes me wanna burp artificially and that causes heart palpitations, skipped beats, ache around heart area, that spreads to the left arm. In the end of 2013 had a major attack... more indigestion, more palpitations, super high sensitivity in the body (moving toes would make already fast heartbeat even faster! That happened only once, though...). After couple of days on the onset of the attack began to experience spasms in my upper tummy area (no ache, more like a rising up waves?), followed by fast heartbeat and sudden confusion in my head. I could not consume any food whatsoever: a teaspoon of soup or cooked vegetables would bring about these or those sensations... Not eating food would still cause symptoms to appear, kind of unpredictable. Most of the time had to avoid standing or even sitting positions due to aggravation of the symptoms. Doctors said that's anxiety, nothing was found except minor gastritis and insignificant hernia. I was puzzled...

Other symptoms, that I myself relate to MS are: brain fog, vertigo, dizziness, derealisation, nervousness, aberrant perception of things, panic attack, obsessive thoughts, blurred vision, sensitivity to light, flashes (white or black) in the sight, tinnitus, pressure inside the head, ears; spasticity, lhermitte's sign, pressure/ache in the neck, along the spine, head moving forward in accordance to heartbeat; cold and hot, crippling, tingling sensations on the skin, twitching of the muscles, numbness, heavy muscles, limbs becoming light, diminished breathing capacity, spasms in the uterus, frequent urgent call to urinate. Spasms in the jaw, that makes restrictions to move it. Tremble (rare). Heat waves to the limbs. Pulsing sensations in the tummy, or back, or neck, or arm.

On February got results of vitB12 - 293ng/ml (140-699) More results are on the way (Mg, Zn, VitD).

My stomach became extremely fussy. I have to be always conscious when putting food in my mouth. Poor digestion. Homeopath found my pancreas dysfunction. Prescribed Momordica compositum and Pomander Gold Aurosoma for solar plexus. Helps a great deal, but does not uproot the problem with the digestion.
I urge you to read the book, Could It Be B12? An Epidemic of Misdiagnoses by Sally M. Pacholok, RN, BSN, and Jeffrey J. Stuart, D.O. (This may be available at your library.): http://b12awareness.org/could-it-be-b12 ... diagnoses/

On page 11:
"There is much controversy as to what constitutes a normal result for this test [serum vitamin B12 test]. Because of this controversy, this test is often used in conjunction with other markers of B12 deficiency (MMA, Hcy, and more recently the HoloTc).

… We believe that the "normal" serum B12 threshold needs to be raised from 200 pg/mL to at least 450 pg/mL because deficiencies begin to appear in the cerebral spinal fluid (CSF) below 550 pg/mL.

At this time, we believe normal serum B12 levels should be greater than 550 pg/mL.…

We commonly see patients with clinical signs of B12 deficiency who are not being tested. Others who are being tested are not being treated because their serum B12 falls in the gray zone [between 200 pg/mL and 450 pg/mL]. This error results in delayed diagnosis and an increased incidence of injury."

Your symptoms are consistent with many conditions, including MS, and also including vitamin B12 deficiency.

Compare your B12 test results to those recommended by the authors. On page 205 of the Pacholok book: ng/L = pg/ml = 200 ng/L -> 200 pg/ml
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby jimmylegs » Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:33 pm

heya h7! re the b12, while 293 does qualify as 'normal', it is on the low side if you're going for 'optimal'. assuming you meant pg/mL and not ng/mL, that is!

i've always aimed for a serum b12 level upwards of '500' which is meant to be in pg/mL. that converts to about 370 in pmol/L, the units used at my local labs, but i aim for serum levels of 500 pmol/L or higher anyway, just to be on the safe side.

all that said, when i use my standard approach for trying to dial in a good serum level for a nutrient, i can't make it work for serum b12. the 500 just comes from older research that i've found difficult to back up to the same standard i've applied elsewhere

eg: http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=11011162
it's a huge headache to get one's hands on this study, and it turns out to be a letter to the editor about a case report or something similarly low on the authoritative scale

glad to hear you have results for vit d3, magnesium, and zinc on the way! do you know exactly which tests were requisitioned? looking forward to the next batch of info.

based on your symptoms i hope we can find something you can use to good effect!
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Re: of iron and MS

Postby Health7 » Mon Apr 27, 2015 10:11 am

I am so grateful for your input!

I can see clearly black on white written ng/ml (concerning VitB12), might be a mistake of units used? Am confused, as I am not familiar with these matters... Am looking to clearer head in order to study these with more depth.

The rest of results should arrive in couple weeks time, will post them then.

do you know exactly which tests were requisitioned?


Nope. What exactly should I look for?
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