Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Apuman » Wed Sep 21, 2011 7:49 am

HelminthicTherapy wrote:This is why you need t get yourself a microscope, learn to do McMaster egg count http://opensourcehelminththerapy.org/mediawiki2/index.php?title=McMaster_Egg_Count and once a month make sure you still have hookworm eggs in the stool. It's the best way to tell.


That would be ideal... unfortunetly it's not a practical option for me at the moment, time or money wise. Getting tested at the public clinic however, only costs me $3 here :wink:
AIT in in the process of preparing my dose right now, I'll update again when it arrives.
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby mrbarlow » Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:13 pm

Apuman wrote:
HelminthicTherapy wrote:This is why you need t get yourself a microscope, learn to do McMaster egg count http://opensourcehelminththerapy.org/mediawiki2/index.php?title=McMaster_Egg_Count and once a month make sure you still have hookworm eggs in the stool. It's the best way to tell.


That would be ideal... unfortunetly it's not a practical option for me at the moment, time or money wise. Getting tested at the public clinic however, only costs me $3 here :wink:
AIT in in the process of preparing my dose right now, I'll update again when it arrives.



Whilst I'd prefer to let someone else do the work I'm seriously concerned about the prospect of Autoimmune Therapies going belly up. I do wonder if a good insurance policy would be learning how to identify and separate the larvae for future self inoculations?
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Lyon » Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:25 pm

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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby mrbarlow » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:02 pm

Lyon wrote:Regarding the hookworms alone, if you read Jasper's earlier history I'm almost sure he mentioned keeping a covered fish tank as a "reservoir" and when he needed to boost his numbers he laid his forearm on the screen on the top of the fish tank, because the larvae are able to climb that distance http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2006/4/30/91945/8971


Interesting - thanks for that.

In theory it should be relatively easy to harvest the larvae. All one needs is an incubator, a container that will go inside the incubator and a quantity of sand.

In goes the No.2 into the container. Cover with moist sand and leave for several days in the incubator ensuring sand is kept moist. My understanding of hookworms is that they typically thrive in regions with 1000mm or more of rainfall so the addition of 3mm equiv a day of water makes sense. After several days apply rake top inch of sand off and apply to skin or stand on it.

The larvae live in the soil for about 30 days so the reservoir needs to be regularly recharged.
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Lyon » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:15 pm

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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby mrbarlow » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:39 pm

Lyon wrote:I admit that I don't know with any certainty but before my interest in helminthic therapy we (the general population) were led to believe that helminths were survival specialists and that their ova could live many years in the soil. Where did you get the 30 day figure?


It was from a parasitology book of 1960's vintage. Unfortunately it is 3500 miles away at present. Perhaps the OVA live for a long time if they don't hatch due to unfavourable conditions but once they form into larvae I believe (but stand to be corrected) they live about 30 days unless they find a host.

Edit: Not the most reliable source but the Wiki entry for Hookworm suggests a few weeks
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Lyon » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:49 pm

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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby mrbarlow » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:55 pm

Lyon wrote:Thanks for the quick reply. You've got me curious now. On one hand, through evolution the ova were constantly being replenished and so the ability to remain viable in the soil for years wouldn't normally be a necessity. Then again being a master of survival requires overdoing and being prepared for all possible options. I'll try to find some other sources and let know you what I find.

mrbarlow wrote:
Lyon wrote:I admit that I don't know with any certainty but before my interest in helminthic therapy we (the general population) were led to believe that helminths were survival specialists and that their ova could live many years in the soil. Where did you get the 30 day figure?


It was from a parasitology book of 1960's vintage. Unfortunately it is 3500 miles away at present. Perhaps the OVA live for a long time if they don't hatch due to unfavourable conditions but once they form into larvae I believe (but stand to be corrected) they live about 30 days unless they find a host.

Edit: Not the most reliable source but the Wiki entry for Hookworm suggests a few weeks



I would imagine the Ova are a bit like spore forming bacteria - remain viable in a vegetative state until favourable conditions occur. This no doubt allows them to survive dry seasons in sub tropical zones.


On the subject of larvae farming it would appear very low cost. On ebay I can pick up a small second hand aquarium for a £1. 25kg of sand at the builders merchants is about £4.50. I would bury the source material to a depth of about 6 inches. Keep moist and above 18 degrees C.

Not quite sure how to explain the sand filled aquarium to friends and relatives but hey ho! :mrgreen:
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Apuman » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:27 pm

mrbarlow wrote:Whilst I'd prefer to let someone else do the work I'm seriously concerned about the prospect of Autoimmune Therapies going belly up. I do wonder if a good insurance policy would be learning how to identify and separate the larvae for future self inoculations?


Seems I'm not the only one concerned :-| You may or may not have come across this Yahoo group:

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/In ... gHookworm/

Even though the Yahoo Group's format tends to make my head spin when I try to follow the discussions, there's a good deal of info on incubating hookworm larve there. Just in case it ever does come down to DYI...
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby mrbarlow » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:34 pm

Apuman wrote:
mrbarlow wrote:Whilst I'd prefer to let someone else do the work I'm seriously concerned about the prospect of Autoimmune Therapies going belly up. I do wonder if a good insurance policy would be learning how to identify and separate the larvae for future self inoculations?


Seems I'm not the only one concerned :-| You may or may not have come across this Yahoo group:

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/In ... gHookworm/

Even though the Yahoo Group's format tends to make my head spin when I try to follow the discussions, there's a good deal of info on incubating hookworm larve there. Just in case it ever does come down to DYI...


Its many years since I looked down a microscope but I think I might try and score a cheap second hand one. Hell I got nothing to do in Saudi anyway :lol:
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Apuman » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:54 pm

mrbarlow wrote:It's many years since I looked down a microscope but I think I might try and score a cheap second hand one. Hell I got nothing to do in Saudi anyway :lol:


I wish you the best. I've got my hands pretty full between Internet Marketing and my entertainment career... I even had to tell the girls to take a back seat, and that ain't easy in South America :lol:
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Lyon » Wed Sep 28, 2011 5:06 pm

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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby mrbarlow » Fri Sep 30, 2011 6:12 am

Lyon wrote:
mrbarlow wrote: Not quite sure how to explain the sand filled aquarium to friends and relatives but hey ho! :mrgreen:
I'm sure ant farms were considered a little weird in the beginning too. Just think, you might be starting the next fad! Someone made a ton of money by calling brine shrimp "sea monkeys" with the aid of a cute cartoon and good salesmanship.


Perhaps I could get a childs swimming pool, fill it with sand, bury the 'treasure' and invite people round to have a trample - for a small fee :lol:
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby Vikingquest » Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:33 am

Can I ask, why are the hookworms so expensive? £3000 for a single treatment?!
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Re: Helminthic therapy(treatment using hookworms)

Postby mrbarlow » Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:57 am

Vikingquest wrote:Can I ask, why are the hookworms so expensive? £3000 for a single treatment?!


Its not £3000 for a single treatment. I paid £2600 for combined hookworm and whipworm and this includes periodic top ups over 3 years if symptoms continue. As a member of Autoimmune therapy's private forum the issue of cost has been discussed. Key cost factors include:

The 'reservoirs' have to be tested frequently for transmissible diseases even though there is no evidence of HW / WW transmitting infectious diseases

Whilst not particularly high tech the process of separating the hookworm larvae and collecting controlled doses is a time consuming process.

Various antibiotic procedures need to be applied

Other costs include premises, equipment, liability insurance, relevant taxes

Those involved need to make a living too. Marc Dellerba who is a Director is a Clinical Biochemist (ex NHS) and would no doubt command a reasonable salary / dividend to make it worthwhile.


Even if the effect is modest I think £2600 for at least 3 years treatment is reasonable. Think about the cost of interferon which is marginal in effectiveness to say the least. Overall I would say Auto immune Therapy's staff were very helpful. Prior to treatment I had a 90 minute over the phone consultation with Marc Dellerba. I have also had conversations with Jasper. Both have shown an ongoing interest in my progress. Sometimes they are a bit slow to respond but I put this down to increasing interest in the Therapy for a whole range of auto immune diseases.
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