This Is MS Multiple Sclerosis Community: Knowledge & Support

i was trying again just now, scouting for something about venospasm, venous stenosis etc and magnesium. no specific dice yet, but this was interesting:

Low Serum Magnesium Predicts Neurological Events in Patients With Advanced Atherosclerosis
http://old.spread.it/Volume/chapt07/add ... _07114.pdf (full text, niiice)

Magnesium, a natural calcium antagonist,1,2 modulates vasomotor tone, blood pressure, and peripheral blood flow.3 Serum contains a small proportion of total body Mg, partially bound to proteins, in complex with small anion ligands and as free ionized Mg.3 The small proportion of ionized Mg in the circulation is thought to exert several beneficial effects on vascular endothelium and function.4 Mg deficiency was shown to trigger vasoconstriction and enhance vascular endothelial injury, thus promoting the development and progression of atherosclerosis.5 In this context, numerous studies elucidated a significant depression of Mg serum levels in patients with vascular diseases.3,6–10
The largest of these trials, the Atherosclerosis Risk in Communities Study (ARIC),6,7 demonstrated an inverse relation of serum and dietary Mg and the development of carotid atherosclerosis in healthy middle-aged adults. However, it is indeterminate whether low serum Mg also promotes the occurrence of cerebrovascular adverse events in patients with preexisting, advanced atherosclerosis.
Patients with symptomatic peripheral artery disease (PAD) are at high risk for complications of atherosclerotic disease. 11,12 In particular, a high incidence of concomitant
cerebrovascular lesions predisposes these patients to neurological adverse events. We hypothesized that low Mg serum levels are associated with an increased incidence of neurological adverse events in patients with symptomatic PAD.
Therefore, the aim of the study was to investigate the association of Mg and a combined neurological end point consisting of ischemic stroke and carotid endarterectomy or
stenting in patients with intermittent claudication.
...
Patients with Mg values <0.76 mmol/L exhibited a 3.29-fold increased adjusted risk (95% CI, 1.34 to 7.90; P0.009) for neurological events compared with patients with higher Mg serum levels (Table 3).

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

Wow some very inspirational reading here! I need to work out a nutrition/physio regime, I'm not such a great reader, do you recommend seeing a naturopath or just GP for supplement info? My Neuro only recomends 5000 D3 a day. From other reading I established that I need magnesium and omega 3-6-9 so am taking those and also calcium. Phew! All very overwhelming between all the ms research, physio, work, OT, drs appts, ms meetings and courses plus keeping old life in order! Don't know how you do it

xx

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Love is all you need.... xx

your GP to get the tests done and jl for advice.

doug's pretty much spot on (thanks!)

here's how i've found it goes with docs by and large:

when i went for bloodwork in australia i filled out my vit d3 lab requisition for the doctor. it was faster than spelling out 25-hydroxyvitamind3, for her to write. then the lab tech questioned me about the requisition and said maybe she should call and double check with the doc. i said no, don't bother she doesn't know either, that's my handwriting just trust me. the lab tech said she hadn't run into many patients that write their own requisitions. here in canada when i very first started testing, i didn't realize just writing vitamin d3 wouldn't automatically get the right metabolite tested at the lab. to fix it, i then had to convince both my doctor and my naturopath, who ganged up on me, which was actually the right metabolite to test, before i was able to get a correct requisition. so, that was 6 yrs ago, things are different now. at least, d3 made it far enough onto the radar that our provincial health care took it off the schedule of lab benefits :S awesome... 7:P

you would probably be okay with just an omega 3 supplement - modern diets tend to be okay on the 6 (meat, eggs, cheese) but not good enough on the 3 (flax, walnuts, salmon, sardines, romaine, spinach, kale, etc). i personally took O3-6-9 in the early days because i had not been eating any meat , eggs, cheese, nuts or even that much in the way of grains, for O6.

FYI, you can do lots for your serum omega 3s by eating a serving of cooked salmon a week:
Enhanced incorporation of n-3 fatty acids from fish compared with fish oils.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17269556
"The serum content of EPA and DHA before and after intervention revealed a higher rise in EPA and DHA in the cooked salmon group (129% rise in EPA and 45% rise in DHA) as compared with CLO (106 and 25%, respectively) despite an intake of EPA and DHA in the CLO group of 3.0 g/d compared with 1.2 g/d in the cooked salmon group."

as for that 5000IU of d3 a day, don't do it without balancing your calcium magnesium and zinc intake.

will you get some baseline bloodwork before you start supplementing? if so i can fire you a list of tests to ask for. think the doc will be receptive?

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

here are my notes related to the klenner protocol, which for me involved b1 300mg, b3 (niacin, not niacinamide - for the flush) 100mg, and the rest of the complex (B2, B5, B6) 100mg as specified, B12 1000mcg, plus tons of Vit C (i think 2g), and 800IU alpha tocopherol, ALL of that 4x/day @ breakfast, lunch, dinner and bed time. i also ate lots of lecithin. i didn't bother with the rest of the klenner stuff. didn't really understand the minerals yet.

on to the details (fyi i placed an early emphasis on b vitamins since i knew i had been b12 deficient. that's why i keep saying b-vits instead of everything listed above. i learned later that the vitamin e probably had a lot to do with the improvement too)

april 17 2006. took b-complex. hands resensitized.
april 18 2006. megadosed b-vits. crappy handwriting this day (field sheets) left CH after morning only
april 19 2006. megadosed b-vits. feel it in hands. typed w all fingers. no peeking. handwriting improved
april 20 2006. call [naturopath] re vit D - 72 nmol/L

then the notes switch to things like appointments and errands, until

may 7 2006. walked around the block.

may 12 2006. sick. stayed home.

may 13 2006.
diet diary
coffee, sm bowl veg bean soup, sm bowl quinoa w veg, med bowl black bean soup, veggie plate w/ 1/2 egg, tuna, cheese, med bowl chilli w quinoa, 4 segments home canned peach, 1 chocolate wafer, 2 digestive biscuits

supplements
1000mcg b12, 3 acidophilus capsules, 1 antioxidant A-C-E chewable, B50 complex, 3xvit B3, B5, B6, E, lecithin, cod liver oil, selenium, liver blend, 4 tbsp cal-mag-D3
4x 1/2c. H2O w 25 drops echinacea

that's interesting, zinc is glaringly missing from the regimen, and there's not really any appreciable zinc in the diet diary either (the fact i ate quinoa with the chili means it was vegetarian chili), even though i had previously taken some and it is specified in klenner too. and yet it's gone, and i got sick. glad i eventually figured out the connection. zinc and selenium both important. i know a couple people who take zinc but are still dealing with lingering colds. not sure how much they're taking daily. and neither are taking selenium, so that's something to look into.

may 15 2006. hike (at a local park)
may 17, 2006. played 'no rain' okay.
may 20, 2006. played blackbird! and better 'no rain'.
may 24, 2006. hike (local conservation area)
may 29, 2006. hike (local ravine)

that's all for now. i just deciphered something interesting in my notes but that can be for next time

_________________
my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

having a productive day off.

so far today i have blanched about 3c of fiddleheads, harvested on a hike the other day. also washed up and trimmed about 8 wild leeks collected at the same time. my friend has morels growing in her very own back yard. i'm envisioning a morel-wild leek-fiddlehead quiche. with old cheddar. and local free range eggs. and whole grain sprouted grain pastry (if i can get my hands on sprouted grain whole grain flour, that is). perhaps with a nice unoaked chardonnay maybe that will be dinner tomorrow night.

i had this locally raised tamworth pork shoulder in the fridge that had been roasted the other evening, but not long and slow enough - it was just too stuck on the bone so i boiled it off and sliced it up. now i have some stock too

i just did the 3-minute boil on an entire bunch of green swiss chard, will have that with pork and sweet potato later.

and as of this minute, i am in the process of par-cooking some of the fat off a packet of local tamworth bacon. it smells and tastes AMAZING. i picked it up yesterday on the way home from work. also a tenderloin that's in the freezer. didn't have enough $$ on me for sausage - next time!
http://www.cbc.ca/ideas/meat-tamworth-piglets.jpg

will be picking up some goat for the deep freeze (same farm as the pork and eggs) this coming week too.

oh and i met the pretty little beef cattle yesterday too. they have arrived fairly recently and were in the barn settling in.. once they're adjusted, they'll spend the summer grazing the meadow. i don't remember the breed...

last of all, really enjoying today's day off fair trade coffee with organic sugar, organic milk and a splash of unfortunately non-organic 18% coffee cream.

oh and ps - bad idea: cooking up an entire package of bacon when actually a little hungry. ahem.

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

more notes from 2006.

on may 31 i started the first vit d3 megadose, 50,000 IU/d x 10 days. i was done by jun 9 2006.

i had done the math to know how long it was going to take me to get from 72 to 150 taking a few thousand IU per day, and decided i wasn't prepared to wait.

i would have to go back through my other files to find out just when i had the follow-up test done. can't find a note in this planner but i know it went up to 149 nmol/L. actually by that time i was posting on here so it's probably just tracked early on in this topic.

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

having some fun in the kitchen.

pan fried 4 salmon filets with dill and butter.

made cock-a-leekie soup, super easy, just 2 c and i already ate it all. sauteed one sliced up leek, boiled the kettle and made an organic chicken bouillon cube into broth, poured it on the leeks, added a pat of butter, brought it to the boil, took it off the heat and added a splash of cream, so tasty.

i just put together the quiche. it used the 9 grain pastry mentioned above, plus 2 rashers of my local farm's heritage bacon, 10 sauteed wild leeks, 4 sauteed crimini mushrooms (i didn't go morel hunting yet), 24 blanched baby wild fiddleheads, 1/2c diced old cheddar, and topped it all with 2c scalded milk, which had 3 beaten and seasoned eggs mixed in. right now it's in a 375 oven counting down from 40 minutes.

have some romaine in the spinner and some veg (carrot, ruta, potato, yam) i wanted to cook up into a side mash, and i was pondering making some hummous, but i'm starting to feel a bit kitchened out. we'll see how much longer my energy holds out

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

oh, my, gosh. this quiche is beautiful!!

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

had salmon on a bed of romaine last night, my last slice of quiche for lunch today.

having another little cookup. 3-veg mash, chicken breast baking as i type, romaine/greek salad on the go.

hummous and veggie stick prep, we'll see if i get to that.

i need to go buy fresh spinach, kale and chard again. when this romaine is done i'll be down to frozen spinach for greens.

my local farm's goat meat will be back from the butcher's this weekend. i'm getting loin chops, ground meat and stewing meat. maybe something else, i'll see what they have. i am DEFINITELY going to make roti. it's been a loong time since i bought or made roti, and it's fun and weird (for an english heritage gal) to make flatbread stuffed with split peas.

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

so i have been slacking on my supplement regimen, and i haven't been taking my vit D3 properly.

i noticed that my fingernails are showing the signs of trouble. so, i will smarten up starting today.

interestingly, i noticed something i haven't noticed before.. my lunulas are all but gone, except for on my thumbnails. wonder if i can make them come back... we shall see.

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

Your the first person I've ever heard that has mentioned what I noticed about myself, low vitamin D definitely shows itself in my fingernails. Went for years putting protein nail polish on, which helped, but I saw that when I was working in the yard through the summer that my nails returned to the strength of my younger days.
I'm working on doing the Klenner regime, enjoy following your journey.
Amy

weird isn't it amy! i used to have all these little issues that i thought were just life. but when i started working on nutrition it was like night and day.

what's your version of the klenner protocol? or are you following the specs exactly?

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

i've done a lot of teaching health care workers over the last few years, sometimes my own health care team, sometimes indirectly via a member, eg i've heard of a doc taking on a nutritional program for patients at his ms clinic after receiving information gathered here, and i know my doctor has commented that she might be able to apply something i told her to others, but this is a new one on me.. just straight up helping a health care professional do their work.

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com

just wanted to say this has been an excellent weekend of creating music, covers on saturday and originals today. fun fun fun!

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my approach: no meds so far - just balanced whole foods (partial 'paleo', much less outright elimination), science, supplements, & bloodwork
my regimen - www.thisisms.com/ftopict-2489.html
www.whfoods.com, www.nutritiondata.com