BG-12 and LDN?

Discuss Tecfidera (BG-12, dimethyl fumarate) as an oral treatment for multiple sclerosis.

BG-12 and LDN?

Postby thefireorgan » Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:54 am

Thoughts? I know that BG-12 is thought to increase Th2 cells thereby balancing out with Th1 cells and I believe I have read that LDN has a similar effect in increasing Th2 cells (please, correct me if I'm wrong, it's a while since I read it).
To me (my unscientific intuitive speculation of course) it seems that these two drugs would have a complimentary, synergistic effect.
I ask because I am currently taking LDN with what I believe to be very beneficial effects (no relapse or new symptoms for about a year, improvement in existing symptoms) and I have great interest and hope for getting on BG-12 when it comes out. Of course, I want to know if I will have to stop taking LDN if I get on the BG-12.
Last edited by thefireorgan on Fri Dec 28, 2012 11:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: BG-12 and LDN?

Postby NHE » Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:47 pm

thefireorgan wrote:I know that BG-12 is thought to reduce Th2 cells thereby balancing out with Th1 cells and I believe I have read that LDN has a similar effect in increasing Th1 cells


I'm not certain about LDN's effect, but I think that the opposite is true of BG-12. I believe that it increases Th2 and reduces Th1.

Fumarates improve psoriasis and multiple sclerosis by inducing type II dendritic cells.
J Exp Med. 2011 Oct 24;208(11):2291-303. Epub 2011 Oct 10.

    Fumarates improve multiple sclerosis (MS) and psoriasis, two diseases in which both IL-12 and IL-23 promote pathogenic T helper (Th) cell differentiation. However, both diseases show opposing responses to most established therapies. First, we show in humans that fumarate treatment induces IL-4-producing Th2 cells in vivo and generates type II dendritic cells (DCs) that produce IL-10 instead of IL-12 and IL-23. In mice, fumarates also generate type II DCs that induce IL-4-producing Th2 cells in vitro and in vivo and protect mice from experimental autoimmune encephalomyelitis. Type II DCs result from fumarate-induced glutathione (GSH) depletion, followed by increased hemoxygenase-1 (HO-1) expression and impaired STAT1 phosphorylation. Induced HO-1 is cleaved, whereupon the N-terminal fragment of HO-1 translocates into the nucleus and interacts with AP-1 and NF-κB sites of the IL-23p19 promoter. This interaction prevents IL-23p19 transcription without affecting IL-12p35, whereas STAT1 inactivation prevents IL-12p35 transcription without affecting IL-23p19. As a consequence, GSH depletion by small molecules such as fumarates induces type II DCs in mice and in humans that ameliorate inflammatory autoimmune diseases. This therapeutic approach improves Th1- and Th17-mediated autoimmune diseases such as psoriasis and MS by interfering with IL-12 and IL-23 production.

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Re: BG-12 and LDN?

Postby NHE » Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:30 am

Also see...

Fumaric Acid and its Esters: An Emerging Treatment for Multiple Sclerosis
Curr Neuropharmacol. 2009 March; 7(1): 60–64.
Effect of FAE on T-Cells
One of the first observations during the application of Fumaderm® in psoriasis was the effect on T-cells. Initial studies revealed a decrease of T-cells in nearly all treated patients [2]. This finding was well in line with an immunohistochemical study that showed a reduction of CD4+-cells by half [5] in the epidermal inflammatory infiltrate. Subsequent in vitro studies confirmed the capability of DMF to induce apoptosis in human T-cells [26]. Upon analysis of the cytokine production in more detail, de Jong et al. [6] reported that MMF increased the production of the “TH2” cytokines interleukin (IL)-4 and IL-5 in stimulated T-cells without having an effect on the “TH1” cytokine interferon gamma (IFN-γ), the IL-2 production, or the proliferation of T-cells. In another study, stimulated CD4+CD45RO+ memory T-cells again showed an increased secretion of IL-4 and IL-5 after treatment with MMF. Taken together, these findings suggest that FAE shift the cytokine profile from a “TH1” to a “TH2” profile. This effect of FAE on the expression of cytokines may also apply to other cell types than T-cells.
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Re: BG-12 and LDN?

Postby thefireorgan » Fri Dec 28, 2012 11:02 pm

Yes, I see. I knew I was going to mix that one up! Anyways, the original idea and question still stand. I just mixed up Th1 with Th2.
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Re: BG-12 and LDN?

Postby KikiT » Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:02 am

I have been on LDN for 10yrs and have been stable since starting it.(SecPMS). Wish I had started before my legs were affected. I too would like to
know if the Tecfidera can be taken with LDN or should XYMOGEN or Protandim be taken instead as an addition to LDN use?
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