Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my doc

This is the place to ask questions if you have symptoms that suggest MS, but aren't yet diagnosed.

Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my doc

Postby centallica » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:16 pm

First time poster here.

I just want to say thank you for everyone who has posted and for the many people who respond to these people.

It is very emotionally traumatic going through trying to be diagnosed and your words are what we need to hear especially when it seems everyone thinks I'm over reacting, jumping to conclusions etc.

It started with skin burning sensations mostly on my legs, sometimes on my torso and arms (Mid July).

By 3 week of August I had developed a tight and bulging inner thigh much on my right leg. Ultrasound came back normal they did on it.

By the 3rd week of September I was getting a vibrating/buzzing feeling in my legs with occasional tremors and twitching.

End of September to present the other inner thigh muscle, front of thigh and hamstrings on both legs have gotten tight and enlarged.

October I've been having sharp jabbing pains that happen once or twice in feet then stop, hands, arms and legs. Spasticity has moved to the right arm, under arm and upper right back; along with left forearm but seems to come and go.

Mid October I saw the Neurologist who did from my research a partial cranial nerve exam, motor system exam, deep tendon exam, sensory exam and cerebellum exam. He then proceeded to say "you have nothing neurologically wrong with you and I'll send my report to your family doctor." I asked him "why am I having these neurological symptoms?" He just stared at me and said he'll send the report to my Doctor.

I went to my family doctor afterwards and she told me to take some magnesium. I get the impression that she may think it's anxiety or psychosomatic causing my problems as she was trying to get me on antidepressants at that visit.

So I'm feeling discouraged and not being taken serious. I bought the magnesium and on day 4 now and maybe it is a mineral deficiency thing.

I have a 2nd Neurologist appointment on Nov 19th, looking for another family doctor for 2nd opinion and exploring getting a neurological naturopath doctor.

Being a 51 year old male the ALS thing scares me like many of you also. Even having debilitating MS as late on-setters are more likely to experience would be tough having a 12 year old son to be active with.

Any words of experience or knowledge would be grateful.

Toronto, Canada
centallica
Newbie
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:25 pm

Advertisement

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby jimmylegs » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:28 pm

hi and welcome c

i'm pretty impressed that your doc put magnesium in front of you. a regular doctor too! i'm curious how much was recommended daily, what chemical form the doc suggested you buy if any in particular, and whether the product you've brought home is powder, powder cap, tablet, or something else again.

if it's any consolation, magnesium tackles all kinds of problems. some of these include mood related stuff so there could be some overlap into the antidepressant's domain. that by no means indicates that all the other tasks magnesium will take on represent anything other than actual physical deficit symptoms.

i'm also wondering what your overall day to day routine is like for food, fluids, other supplements you may have in your regimen, any meds (other than the aforementioned antidepressants which i assume you did not go for), and typical activity level.

keep in mind that you can have all kinds of symptoms related to real deficits, that aren't picked up by standard neuro tests. or bloodwork, for that matter - unless you yourself know how to interpret results and dont rely on the lab's assessment of your status. if you're into learning curves, there's a lot you can accomplish :)
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!
User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
 
Posts: 11759
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby centallica » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:38 pm

Thanks Jimmy for your feedback here.

She didn't recommend any kind nor amount, but I did some research and went with a liquid 300mg per tablespoon Glycinate.

I'm taking one in the morning with my smoothie veggie/protein/hemp shake with banana and sugar free almond milk in the morning, one at dinner with (2) 200mg malate glycinate calcium and 2000mg of D3 liquid and another alone before bedtime = 900mg/day

I also take a B100 complex, vitamin c, and a veggie based digestive enzyme at dinner.

I have bought but haven't started yet to add ALA 300mg caps, N-Acetyl-L-Carnitine 500mg, GLA 24% via Borage oil caps, Vit E gel caps to my regime eventually.

I'm caffeine and gluten free. Prior to all of this I would walk/hike 4-9km per day but have been trying to do 2-3km per day when I can now. I have been doing stretching exercises daily and sometime twice for my legs. I try to drink more water also. I avoid all fast foods and processed foods and watch my carbs for glucose levels. My weight is under control, non smoker and non drinker. Med free. Potassium levels were within the range back in June from blood work, no mag or cal tests done then.

I think I'm going to ask for a Lyme Disease test as I do a lot of hiking/camping this past summer, but didn't have the bullseye of flue like symptoms to trigger the test...healthcare in Canada is free to use for us citizens, so just have to convince the doc to order it...

I hope this helps. Is there a list of blood work you'd recommend getting done for my symptoms to rule out or possible causes besides MS/ALS?

Thanks again..willing to do what it takes here...
centallica
Newbie
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:25 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby Scott1 » Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:22 pm

Hi,

Your doctor may not think your problems are psychosomatic. Sometimes a low dose of an antidepressant is used to modulate how your neurotransmitters fire and influence muscle tightening. I really don't like approach, but, when they don't know it is that's what they sometimes do. It is, unfortunately, too easy to turn into a slippery slope.

I'd try your doctor for a referral to another neurologist. All those tests don't necessarily prove anything. An MRI of both the brain and the spine would be more conclusive. It would be better to be sure than not know.

The motor tests are looking for upper or lower motor neuron lesions. Take it as good news but not conclusive proof that nothing is happening.

There are a lot of reasons that could explain what is happening. Find a good masseur and get an expert pair of hands on you. Some one who does physical manipulation will soon find the tightness and may be able to name the muscles involved. Then you have something more specific to address.

Regards
User avatar
Scott1
Volunteer Moderator
 
Posts: 1420
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:00 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby jimmylegs » Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:54 am

hi again,

fun fact, in research magnesium deficiency has been used as a murine model for depression, to test antidepressant drugs.
on 900mg of mag glycinate liquid per day, plus more with your d3, i don't think magnesium is likely to be your problem!
good choice zeroing in on glycinate. out of curiosity, which liquid? and in the tmi dept, do you find 900mg+ results in loose stools? i emphasize mag in diet, and can't even really get away with adding 400mg of mag glycinate via supplements.

i don't see a general multivit/min in your supplement regimen. would you consider an active men's version, like progressive? i ask about this because loading singles can throw other nutrients and cofactors out of balance.

i'm curious about your b100 complex. is that a 3 a day product? if so, are you taking all three on a daily basis? if not, how many are taken daily?

re ala and gla, what are your main dietary sources of omega 3s and 6s?

which vit e gelcap product will you add?

how closely would you say your daily routine, food-wise, adheres to harvard's 'healthy eating plate' and/or health canada's latest version?

re relevant tests, given what we've heard from you so far re supplements and diet overall, it might be worth considering serum zinc, copper, and ferritin. you may already have ferritin on record.

last question, are you hooked into online test results?

other than that i agree w scott re pt. in more than one instance in my xp, physical work has dramatically helped problems that nutrients would never have touched.
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!
User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
 
Posts: 11759
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby centallica » Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:51 pm

Thank you Scott and Jimmylegs,

Scott, I like the idea of getting my Physiotherapist to look and give a report to my family doctor. Kinda makes it more real to her oppose to in my mind and having well toned legs which they should be :-)

Jimmy- My smoothies have a long list of vitamins in the powder not sure if from the fruit and veggies in it or added, but I am considering a multi too. The B100 only taking 1 a day right now. My omega 3 and 6's are limited to again what I put in my smoothie (hemp powder plus the veggie mix) and the almond milk. I do like snaking on nuts so some there too. The Vit E would be Total E from AOR with a Coenzyme 10 in it. I definitely need more fruits and veggies in my diet to the Canadian health guide. Iron levels are strong in my blood work and prior multi that had iron in it raised my levels too high so now it's good without supplementation. I get my results emailed or photocopied from my doctor, but will get linked online to them someday.

Thank you to you both, I really appreciate the time you took to answer my questions and the feedback. Hope things aren't serious for me...
centallica
Newbie
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:25 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:12 am

hi again,
okay what product is the smoothie powder? is there a link online for it? maybe the label info will give more clarity. eg for potassium.
sounds like you want a multi with no iron. fwiw, AOR has that. i had to switch to progressive for the latest batch, because of fatigue. needed to get some iron back in the mix.
re the b100, i'm trying to understand if you are getting 1/3rd of the product's intended daily input, or the full shot. link to online info could again be helpful.
i like the sound of vit E total. dunno if i've seen AOR's version. i am working thru a jar of new roots E8 complex at the moment, and i do try to emphasize decent dietary inputs too.
sounds like more fruits and veggies would be a good plan - emphasis on veggies mind you (health canada doesn't hit that point hard enough imho)
what are your main inputs for zinc on a daily basis?
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!
User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
 
Posts: 11759
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby centallica » Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:50 am

Hi Jimmylegs,

Just came back from 2nd family physician opinion. Really nice doctor who took the time to read my 2 page synopsis of events, symptoms and supplements. He ordered blood work for lyme disease, S. calcium, s. magnesium, esr, crp, sodium, potassium, chloride and ck. Only thing he could think of was anxiety causing my symptoms at this time but further observation and time is required to see how things develop.

I'm sure my nutrient balance isn't balanced as you suggested, guess been focusing on feeding the possible deficiencies of the problems oppose to finding balance at this time. I'm sure the Naturopath will help me on this when I meet him.

The smoothie powder is the purely inspired all in one:
https://www.purelyinspiredsupplements.c ... dients.png

My potassium in June was 4.5 (3.7-5.4 mmol/L range).

The B100 just taking one a day at this time (I know I need 3 to get to these levels):
Serving Size: 3 Capsules Amount
B1 (Benfotiamine ) 100 mg
B2 (Riboflavin-5-phosphate sodium) 7.5 mg
B3 (Niacin – from 388 mg inositol hexanicotinate) 353 mg
B5 (Pantethine, calcium D-pantothenate) 300 mg
B6 (Pyridoxal-5’-phosphate) 100 mg
B12 (Methylcobalamin) 1000 mcg
Folic acid (calcium L-5-MTHF) 1000 mcg
Biotin 500 mcg
Choline bitartrate (provides 240 mg of choline) 600 mg
Inositol (from inositol hexanicotinate, inositol) 393 mg†

Zinc would be mainly from meats (mostly chicken with odd ground beef).

Can anxiety cause bulging adductor muscles, buzzing and tremors, sharp pains and such that I listed? I don't think I'm much more than any human experiencing these symptoms with no answers would get...
centallica
Newbie
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:25 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:36 pm

glad you had a good appointment, and awesome to hear about your lab requisition news. sad that serum zinc is not on there.

i hope you have good luck with the naturopath. last one i visited (with a friend who is looking to beat cancer) turned me right off. you have to watch them, they'll do anything to get you in their office taking shots. my friend had booked a 20 min free initial consultation and the guy tried to charge $150 for a full price appointment at the end. i wonder how often he gets away with that little stunt.

re the link to the smoothie powder, that is news we can use. 0.853 mg of zinc per day. there are links to health canada's intake tables in i believe the natural approach forum, if you want to look up what you should be getting. you'll also see there that the upper limit for daily intake from supplements is 40mg. more is okay via diet. personally, i just finished up with a chicken and am moving into a batch of chili w ground beef. beef is decent, but i don't have chicken on the radar as a potent zinc source. oysters are tops, but are best used no more than once a week. if memory serves after that it goes to venison, then beef, then lamb. i've just restocked on zinc pills, because i've been circling the normal range's drain at the last couple tests. there are a bunch of veg sources, but as with iron, the animal sources are more readily bioavailable, you don't need to eat as high volume to get the dose you're after. i've never figured out what if anything helps with zinc absorption, the way vit C works for iron.

june potassium levels look good. related:
"The rate of postoperative AF in patients with serum potassium levels of 3.9 mmol/l or less, compared with those with serum potassium levels of 4.4 mmol/l or greater were 50.7% and 32.9%, respectively (p 0.05)".
"The risk relationship between potassium levels and adverse outcomes was U-shaped, with the lowest risk at serum potassium of 4–4.5 mmol/L. Compared with a reference of 4.2 mmol/L, the adjusted hazard ratio for all-cause mortality was 1.22 [95% confidence interval (CI) 1.15–1.29] at 5.5 mmol/L and 1.49 (95% CI 1.26–1.76) at 3.0 mmol/L. "

weird question anyway: do your toes ever do that weird cramp, where they feel like they're trying to cross themselves?

re the anxiety question, there are a couple of things going on. first if nutrients are out of whack there can be a range of physical mental and emotional impacts, including anxiety.
also stress of any kind, be it mental emotional or physical, can increase nutrient excretion leading to eventual depletion, unless intake is increased to suit.
i know 4-9km of daily walking is not a ton, but it might be possible that your physical activity level was a bit much in relation to nutrient intake.
if you have a chronic tissue nutrient depletion situation on your hands, it can take quite a long time to restore levels.

revisiting magnesium, when my level was at its worst i had been taking it every day but overdoing vitamin d3, and messing up the timing. i'd had chronic anxiety for decades, but the d3 sucked up all i had left, my muscles weren't working properly, and i thought i was going to die. then i finally learned about the magnesium side of things. i would feel each day's dose kick in, and for ages, i would say year, i would know about it promptly if i missed a day. then i proceeded to overdo it and caused myself a year of grief with excess mag, taken improperly. back to the hospital. nobody knows what's going on. finally the penny drops, i rejig, and sanity is restored. and absolutely, the lifelong anxiety issue that i had before i figured the magnesium out, is a thing of the past.

that is not to say your issue is magnesium. only that something seemingly so minor and simple can have profound effects. it's a matter of finding out whether something like that exists in your case.
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!
User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
 
Posts: 11759
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby centallica » Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:06 am

Thanks JimmyL…

Toes haven't gone wonky yet on me :-)

Hoping this is all anxiety related with low nutrients...

Thank you for all your help!
centallica
Newbie
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:25 pm

Re: Cold Neurologist Exam with a dash of Magnesium from my d

Postby jimmylegs » Fri Nov 02, 2018 4:08 pm

ok i interpret wonky toes as a red flag re potassium, potentially secondary to low mag. so not having them corresponds to your good potassium status. looking forward to seeing your s. mag and other results :)
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!
User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
 
Posts: 11759
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm


Return to Undiagnosed

 


  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users


Contact us | Terms of Service