names
Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2010 8:07 pm
offer removed by author.
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I really don't care what problems you have, and I don't propose to do anything. Consider it done.oreo wrote:I have a couple of problems with what you propose to do 1eye.
Firstly, can you (or anyone) prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the 'Liberation' treatment would have saved their lives.
I have no intention of demonstrating anything, reasonably or otherwise, to you especially on this matter. I don't much care what funeral directors do in these cases. If anyone who knows the name of someone who may not have died from CCSVI, or their doubt is more reasonable than their certainty, they are welcome, in fact encouraged, not to submit any names. I say that for your benefit only, so as not to insult anyone else's intelligence.Secondly, can you reasonably demonstrate that these people actually died of MS. Just because a person who dies has MS does not automatically mean they died from it. I have asked a couple of funeral directors I know rather well how often they see MS listed as the cause of death on the death certificate. The response varied bewteen rarely to never.
I take great objection to this. It is the worst kind of attention-seeking, inconsiderate trolling. It makes me more angry than I believe I have a right to show publicly, in this context, and I suppose that is what was intended. Please take your "fears" elsewhere. This topic is not there for people to despoil as desired. People in this forum are not easily scared by fear-mongers, and if I were you, I would remove the whole thing. If you will, (PM me,even) I will remove my response, which I think is very conservative.One of my biggest fears with this as yet unproven 'Liberation' treatment is that a couple of years down the road we may start seeing 'liberated' MS'ers dying and their death certificates will list cause of death : Intracranial venous hemorrhage (stroke). This as a direct result of applying arterial treatments (angiplasty & stents) to veins for which neither treatment was designed. I sincerely hope I am wrong but I still am concerned with the safety question.
Yes, what 1eye has said and if I may add.. the point is not proof...the point is to exhaust all possibilites..!oreo wrote:Firstly, can you (or anyone) prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the 'Liberation' treatment would have saved their lives.
I can only speak for myself but I could care less about getting a response related to my posts. The only thing I can hope for is that the one of the many lurkers who read this board will read my opinion and get something out of it. As far as Oreo's comment what did he say that is so upsetting? I do not know of ANY researcher involved with CCSVI that has EVER said the liberation procedure will save anyone's life. In fact most people have said it seems to work best for people newly diagnosed with MS and maybe not at all for people who have serious axonal damage. I hope when people read these names they do not let emotion cloud logical thinking.jimmylegs wrote:exactly, sbr.
No it's not what I want. If you know anybody who knows of this topic and want's their name on my list, please dissuade them. Tell them to start their own list. I am beginning to think this list was a bad idea. It just brings the squirrels out of the woodwork. I take it all back. There is probably no way to do this, on this forum, anyway,CureOrBust wrote:1eye, I don't think its exactly what you want, but Dr Kevorkian had a HIGH percentage of MS patients (much more than half I think And Digitas in Europe also "help" MS patients).
I am guessing from what I have previously seen on TV, that Digitas do not take "patients" that have a treatment option, so MS patients may no longer be afforded that option if CCSVI becomes a treatment option, and hence, lives saved.
Also, see this study. Suicide and multiple sclerosis: an epidemiological investigation.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC489162/
Have you no sense of decency?scorpion wrote:I can only speak for myself but I could care less about getting a response related to my posts. The only thing I can hope for is that the one of the many lurkers who read this board will read my opinion and get something out of it. As far as Oreo's comment what did he say that is so upsetting? I do not know of ANY researcher involved with CCSVI that has EVER said the liberation procedure will save anyone's life. In fact most people have said it seems to work best for people newly diagnosed with MS and maybe not at all for people who have serious axonal damage. I hope when people read these names they do not let emotion cloud logical thinking.jimmylegs wrote:exactly, sbr.
Of course do what you want 1eye but I do not think you are helping the CCSVI cause. People have argued, quite persuasively, that the liberation procedure may relieve some symptoms of MS and possibly stop it in its tracks. With all the anecdotol evidence out there I understand people making this claim although I may not buy it. Nevertheless there is a part of me that hopes these anecdotol claims are true and that there may be something to CCSVI and the venuous system theory. However to go from claims of an operation that relieves some MS symptoms to claiming the liberation procedure will save lives when people are in the final stages of MS is misleading. Time will only tell if you or I are correct in our beliefs about CCSVI(I hope you are) but I just do not feel appealing to people's emotions(which is what a list such as you propose will do) will help the CCSVI agenda.1eye wrote:Have you no sense of decency?scorpion wrote:I can only speak for myself but I could care less about getting a response related to my posts. The only thing I can hope for is that the one of the many lurkers who read this board will read my opinion and get something out of it. As far as Oreo's comment what did he say that is so upsetting? I do not know of ANY researcher involved with CCSVI that has EVER said the liberation procedure will save anyone's life. In fact most people have said it seems to work best for people newly diagnosed with MS and maybe not at all for people who have serious axonal damage. I hope when people read these names they do not let emotion cloud logical thinking.jimmylegs wrote:exactly, sbr.
At long last, have you no sense of decency?