This Is MS Multiple Sclerosis Knowledge & Support Community

Lyon wrote:

North52 wrote: but the IR did not want to attempt to balloon the brachiocephalic as this was all very new. I am booked Albany to attempt the ballooning of the brachiocephalic but the chances of success are not likely very good.

The differences between veins and arteries aren't lost on me but it's hard to forget that, back in the 1970's my grandpa had his corotid arteries replaced with veins(?) from his legs with amazing results and no further problems.

Even if things don't turn out favorable in Albany, if stenosis does come to be accepted as having a direct and obvious effect "they" would probably reconsider your situation with it in mind that it would be worth going a little more invasive and replace that stretch of brachiocephalic vein.

Considering shootings and car accident victims, Dr Sclafani has probably already done similar things.

North52 wrote:...
1) MS is a disease of hypercoagulability that is manifest predominantly at the micro-vascular level (capillaries and post capillary venules) of central nervous system tissue.
2) This local hypercoagulability in the MS population can be a result of numerous factors. The predominant factor is likely venous outflow obstruction from the larger veins that drain the central nervous system.
3) This outflow obstruction of the larger veins results in reduced blood flow and stasis at the microvascular level.
...

Malden wrote:There is a long trip from large veins to microvascular level. But this trip can be described in detail using the laws of physics and hemodynamic.

Malden wrote:

North52 wrote:...
1) MS is a disease of hypercoagulability that is manifest predominantly at the micro-vascular level (capillaries and post capillary venules) of central nervous system tissue.
2) This local hypercoagulability in the MS population can be a result of numerous factors. The predominant factor is likely venous outflow obstruction from the larger veins that drain the central nervous system.
3) This outflow obstruction of the larger veins results in reduced blood flow and stasis at the microvascular level.
...

You start with "micro-vascular level (capillaries and post capillary venules) of central nervous system tissue" and then you skip a lot of unknown and unexplained steps just to make a conclusion: "outflow obstruction of the larger veins results in reduced blood flow and stasis at the microvascular level"

But you are not alone with that approach. All CCSVI-MS theories start like that: Narowing in large veins...reflux...hypoxia, ischemia...iron deposits...autoimune attack...deth cells...MS.

There is a long trip from large veins to microvascular level. But this trip can be described in detail using the laws of physics and hemodynamic. But no one does. Reflux is the magic word... like absolute truth... it is incontrovertible!

So why is this so? Because the whole CCSVI-MS theory is built on shaky foundations and if you dig some more this house of cards will collapse to the ground.

But I found the rest of your points very interesting and acceptable to my way of thinking about this problem.

Best regards, M.

North52 wrote:I am glad to see that you scrutinizing my ideas. I can see why it is a big jump to state that if blood flow is reduced in the large veins, it will be reduced in the samll veins. I will try to explain this to you. First I want try and simplify the venous system. Imagine the venous system as an upside down tree, where blood flows from very small veins to much larger veins. Now block the flow of one of the branches in the tree so that there is no flow. What will happen upstream of this blockage? There will be no flow in the small veins that feed that larger vein. In reality our venous system is much more complex with many other types of connections between veins, so that if a vein is blocked then blood will somehow find a way around it through collaterals or other alternative routes. Flow, however will still likely be decreased upstream of the blockage.

As for reflux, it does definitely exist and it fits in very well with the theory I am proposing. If an outflow route is blocked, blood will try to find a way past this obstruction. Sometimes this may mean backtracking and going in the reverse direction. I do not think that reflux is the cause of ms symptoms. I think is just a manifestation of CCSVI and perhaps more severe CCSVI. Thank you for this comment as I had not previously thought about how reflux fits into the picture.
North

North52 wrote:Thank you for your responses.

Regarding heparin, I came across an old article. Because it was scanned it is very difficult to cut and past. Here is a portion of it. Part of it talks about ms and heparin. Look at the bottom as well. There are 3 articles/studies about heparin treatment in ms. There is no text, though. It would be very interesting to track these down. I will see what I can do. I may not be able to respond for a day or 2, as I will likely be admitted to the hospital tomorrow

patients with autoimmune hemolytic anemia.
Donzelot and Kaufmann34 found that heparin
ameliorated bad cases of rheumatism, supposedly
by an antiexudative action. But Burkls5
suggested that it acts by the inhibition of hyaluronidase
activity. The action of heparin
in rheumatism is an example of its antiinflammatory
influence on connective tissue. Other
such examples are its ameliorating effect in
thrombophlebitis36 and its action in interstitial
cystitis.37
Heparin has been used with some success
in multiple sclerosis,3840 and the authors suggest
that this may be due to its action on lipid
metabolism.
Heparin was also...

References:

COURVILLE, C. B. The effects of heparin in acute
exacerbations of multiple sclerosis. Observations
and deductions. Bull. Los Angeles Neural. Sod., 24:
187,1959.

MASCHMEYER, J., SHEARER, R., LONSER, E. and
SPINDLE, D. K. Heparin potassium in the treatment
of chronic multiple sclerosis. Bull. Los
Angeles Neural. Sot., 26: 165, 1961.

28. PARROT, J. L., NICOT, G. and LABORDE, C. Capta- 42. SIKORSKI, H. Hyaluronidase und Heparinoide bei
tion de l’histamine par I’heparine. Influence du der Behandlung entzuendlicher Stauungen.
PH., Compt. rend Sot. biol., 154: 1426, 1960. Ztschr. bout. Geschlechtskr., 31 : 225, 1961.

Jimmy