all things magnesium

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jimmylegs
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Re: 2017 study: desalinated water = lower serum mag

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

RO, and they also have to remove mag from standard tap water too, so that it doesn't clog up the pipes with deposits. i remember WAY back talking that over with cheer, and she commented at the time that she'd been brought up on well water and jeff on city water. also, recall thx's improvements after switching up a years-long RO water routine. http://bit.ly/2jyBRDh in reviewing old pm chats from 2014 i found a note i sent to thx from the mgwater site, to the effect that fluoride in water also ties up magnesium. i had forgotten about that little twist. i haven't been viewing my mag intake as in part a compensation for ubiquitous water *additives*. had been thinking primarily of mag as a way to address a *gap*.
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Re: 2017 study: desalinated water = lower serum mag

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

don't have time to process this tidbit. will need full text and more free time. for now, just throwing it in the mix

Effects of drinking desalinated seawater on cell viability and proliferation
http://jwh.iwaponline.com/content/early ... h.2017.252
Desalination of seawater is becoming an important means to address the increasing scarcity of freshwater resources in the world. Seawater has been used as drinking water in the health, food, and medical fields and various beneficial effects have been suggested, although not confirmed. Given the presence of 63 minerals and trace elements in drinking desalinated seawater (63 DSW), we evaluated their effects on the behavior of tumorigenic and nontumorigenic cells through the 3-(4,5-dimethylthiazol-2-yl)-2,5-diphenyl tetrazolium bromide assay and annexin-V-fluorescein isothiocyanate/propidium iodide staining. Our results showed that cell viability and proliferation in the presence of 63 DSW were significantly greater than in mineral water and in the presence of fetal bovine serum in a dose-dependent manner. Furthermore, 63 DSW showed no toxic effect on murine embryonic fibroblast (NIH-3T3) and murine melanoma (B16-F10) cells. In another assay, we also showed that pre-treatment of non-adherent THP-1 cells with 63 DSW reduces apoptosis incidence, suggesting a protective effect against cell death. We conclude that cell viability and proliferation were improved by the mineral components of 63 DSW and this effect can guide further studies on health effects associated with DSW consumption.
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Re: 2017 study: desalinated water = lower serum mag

Post by ElliotB » 1 year ago

"Reverse osmosis water has such low ion concentration that it can leach minerals"

This is true of most RO systems but there is (at least) one that adds mineral back in through a filter (remineralization filter) that connects between the filtered water storage tank and the faucet - I have had the system for about 6 months and am very happy with it..


http://www.aquasana.com/drinking-water- ... is-claryum

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Re: 2017 study: desalinated water = lower serum mag

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

my tap water filter (not RO) has a 'remineralization' feature but i think it is likely snake oil since there's no data provided on typical change to mineral content in the water pre and post filtration. probably just as well off with plain old filtered water and a multimineral pill. would have been nice to have more confidence in the post-filter product, since the filters themselves aren't exactly cheap.
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2003 study Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

a relative oldie with some interesting (not all morbid) tidbits scattered throughout :)

Magnesium Metabolism and its Disorders
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1855626/

"Severe hypermagnesaemia in fact seems to be a feature in patients who drown in the Dead Sea"

sooooo relaxing :S yikes
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2017 study Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

Effect of transdermal magnesium cream on serum and urinary magnesium levels in humans: A pilot study
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/articl ... ne.0174817

Background
Oral magnesium supplementation is commonly used to support a low magnesium diet. This investigation set out to determine whether magnesium in a cream could be absorbed transdermally in humans to improve magnesium status.

Methods and findings
In this single blind, parallel designed pilot study, n = 25 participants (aged 34.3+/-14.8y, height 171.5+/-11cm, weight 75.9 +/-14 Kg) were randomly assigned to either a 56 mg/day magnesium cream or placebo cream group for two weeks. Magnesium serum and 24 hour urinary excretion were measured at baseline and at 14 days intervention. Food diaries were recorded for 8 days during this period. Mg test and placebo groups’ serum and urinary Mg did not differ at baseline. After the Mg2+ cream intervention there was a clinically relevant increase in serum magnesium (0.82 to 0.89 mmol/l,p = 0.29) that was not seen in the placebo group (0.77 to 0.79 mmol/L), but was only statistically significant (p = 0.02)) in a subgroup of non-athletes. Magnesium urinary excretion increased from baseline slightly in the Mg2+ group but with no statistical significance (p = 0.48). The Mg2+ group showed an 8.54% increase in serum Mg2+ and a 9.1% increase in urinary Mg2+ while these figures for the placebo group were smaller, i.e. +2.6% for serum Mg2+ and -32% for urinary Mg2+. In the placebo group, both serum and urine concentrations showed no statistically significant change after the application of the placebo cream.

Conclusion
No previous studies have looked at transdermal absorbency of Mg2+ in human subjects. In this pilot study, transdermal delivery of 56 mg Mg/day (a low dose compared with commercial transdermal Mg2+ products available) showed a larger percentage rise in both serum and urinary markers from pre to post intervention compared with subjects using the placebo cream, but statistical significance was achieved only for serum Mg2+ in a subgroup of non-athletes. Future studies should look at higher dosage of magnesium cream for longer durations.
i love that they ran this study, even if more work is (as usual) needed. without having dug into full text, just from the abstract it makes sense that significant serum increase was achieved only in a non athletic subgroup, who would have been less likely to sweat it out. esp given such a small daily addition to joe average's daily needs, let alone those of an athlete. i'll be interested to get into full text and have a look at those diet diaries to see what daily intake levels were like relative to recommended dailies, before adding the topical supplement.
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Re: all things magnesium

Post by THX1138 » 1 year ago

I've done magnesium oil treatments and magnesium chloride foot soaks and there is absolutely no doubt in my mind, based on my dozens and dozens of experiences, that magnesium is well absorbed through the skin.

In fact, my experiences repeatedly tell me that transdermal magnesium is far more effective than oral magnesium.

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Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

Concentration of magnesium in the serum and the ability status of patients with relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis.
https://www.cabdirect.org/cabdirect/abs ... 0173157407
Abstract : Multiple sclerosis (MS) is the most common autoimmune disease affecting the central nervous system, characterized by the presence of scattered foci of demyelination in the brain and spinal cord. Magnesium (Mg) has a significant influence on the nervous system and the immune system. The aim of this study was to evaluate the influence of the concentration of Mg in the serum on the ability status of patients with MS. The study group consisted of 101 adults with diagnosed relapsing remitting MS. All participants were investigated on the Expanded Disability Status Scale. The control group included 41 people. The concentration of Mg in the serum was determined by the flame atomic absorption spectrometry method. The patients completed a survey and a 24-hour dietary interview. In patients with MS, the percentage of respondents with normal magnesium content was significantly lower than in the control group (p<0.05). The study proved that patients with normal Mg serum concentration levels were in better clinical condition, particularly with respect to the function of the pyramidal tract (p=0.007) and sphincters (p=0.002), than patients with inadequate levels of Mg in the serum. External factors such as gender, smoking, immunomodulating medications or dietary supplements of Mg were found to have no effect on the concentration of Mg in the serum of MS patients. The results of our study suggest that an abnormal concentration of Mg in the serum of MS patients should be recognized and corrected, as this may improve the health status of people with MS.

can't get into the full text yet apparently. so, will just have to wait a bit and see if eventually we can get a look at some more detailed numbers :)

update: full text available at http://jsite.uwm.edu.pl/index/getfile/1156/

interesting: "The Mg content in the serum should range from 0.700 to 1.000 mmol L-1
(Neumeister et al. 2013)." range goes to 1.05 or 1.1 depending which lab you visit locally

study indicates that patients with technically elevated as well as suboptimal levels also were worse off, and -oddly to my mind- it appears the researchers have not excluded ppl taking magnesium supplements.
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Re: all things magnesium

Post by NHE » 1 year ago

jimmylegs wrote:External factors such as gender, smoking, immunomodulating medications or dietary supplements of Mg were found to have no effect on the concentration of Mg in the serum of MS patients.
So Mg supplements made no difference? That's surprising.

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Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

yeah. will need full text to see if we can get more detail on things like:

-the details on the patients vs controls at baseline
-what background *dietary* mag intake was vs that from any supplements
-what counted as mag supps (how many mgs? what forms used?)
-what's being used as cutoff for normal vs below normal
-whether or not d3 intake or other possible confounders were accounted for,
-whether daily total mag intake met/exceeded daily requirements or not,
-can we actually see mean serum levels for subjects with and without mg supplements,

etc.

fwiw, i have the lab tested differences my dietary x supplemental mag regimen has made to my serum levels during recovery from d3 toxicity. and i know i feel much better. i'll need to read up on pyramidal tract and sphincter dtls however - haven't seen those specifically mentioned before. i've speculated here that high and/or low mag could be affecting things like the LES, so will be interesting to have a closer look if this article ever shows up in my library.

while we're having a go at the abstract, they should not have said this study 'proved' anything. probably an ELL thing. the journal web site looks pretty low capacity. my go to library doesn't appear to subscribe. i can get at full text for a cu/zn ratio in ms study which these researchers have had published in j. nutrition, but not for this mag study in j. elementology.
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Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

good read: whqlibdoc.who.int/publications/2009/9789241563550_eng.pdf

excerpt: "Lowenstein and Stanton (1986) established the reference interval (central 95th percentile) for the serum magnesium concentration of 0.75–0.955 mmol/l. ... we do not know what percentage of this population had an inadequate intake of magnesium and may have been magnesium deficient. Thus, the lower limit of the reference interval may have been flawed by having subjects in the “normal” population that were deficient in magnesium."

yeah, and/or the upper limit...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12486495
"The mean serum magnesium level among subjects with metabolic syndrome was 1.8±0.3 mg/dl, and among control subjects 2.2±0.2 mg/dl, p<0.00001."

so upper end of that control group (without reading the fine print i would interpret this group not as optimally healthy necessarily, but free of met syndrome) is sitting at se mg 2.4 mg/dl or 0.99 mmol/l

http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/12693452
"Mean serum magnesium at baseline in the diabetic patients was significantly lower than that in controls (1.44 +/- 0.48 mg/dl Vs 2.29 +/- 0.33 mg/dl; p < 0.001)."
upper end of control group 2.6 or 1.1 - again have not looked at the details but suspect that controls will need only to be free of diabetes.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3827422
"the mean level (2.5±0.4 mg/dL [1.03 ± 0.16 mmol/L]) in a reference population of healthy volunteers was unexpectedly high"
and again, upper end of healthy vol gp 2.9 or 1.2

interesting, levels highest where researchers actually specified 'healthy' controls - will be worth a closer look at how that group was selected.

ppl need to stop saying that serum mag is a bad test. as researchers have stated, it's the reference range and results interp that need work.
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Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

SO. MUCH. YES. *tear *snif

Interpreting magnesium status to enhance clinical care: key indicators (Nov 2017)
http://bit.ly/2hqsna1

"Purpose of review: To update advances in identifying factors affecting magnesium (Mg) status that assist in providing improved evidence-based clinical decision-making for assessing Mg status.

Recent findings: Findings from recent cohort studies, small randomized control trials, and multiple meta-analyses reinforce earlier work that serum Mg concentrations, urinary Mg excretion, and Mg dietary intakes are inversely associated with cardiovascular disease, chronic kidney disease, and diabetes. These studies indicate that the reference range for serum Mg needs updating, and that individuals with serum Mg in the range of 0.75–0.85 mmol/l and displaying changes in other factors associated with a low Mg status may be Mg deficient. Individuals with serum Mg concentrations below this range most likely are Mg deficient and, above this range, are most likely Mg sufficient.

Summary: The combined determination of serum Mg concentration, 24-h urinary Mg excretion, and dietary Mg intake is currently the most practical method to obtain a sound assessment of Mg status. The strong correlations of Mg deficiency with increased risk of several chronic diseases, some of which exist as comorbidities, indicate that Mg status should be ascertained in patients presenting such disorder."


always keeping in mind, however: http://bit.ly/2h067Xz

"at a cut off of 0.90 mmol/L, only 1% of the individuals had clinical magnesium deficiency"
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Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

this here is why 'normal' serum mag needs to change. wtf.

Extensive Intracranial Calcification in a Case of Hypoparathyroidism: Case Report (2017)
http://irjns.org/browse.php?a_id=80&sid ... =en&html=1
Abstract
Background and Importance: Hypoparathyroidism is due to parathyroid hormone deficiency and categorized as an endocrine disorder. Acute clinical presentations of hypoparathyroidism are muscle cramps and spasms, tetany, weakness, paresthesia and seizure. Hypoparathyroidism may be accompanied with psychosis, depressio n, seizures and extrapyramidal manifestations in chronic condit ion.
Case Presentation: The present case reported about a 37-year-old man who presented with the history of several episodes of seizures, slurred speech, progressive limbs and trunk stiffness and increased muscle tone and rigidity.
Conclusion: Paraclinical investigations revealed hypocalcemia and very low parathyroid hormone levels with extensive intracranial calcification involving bilateral basal ganglia, cerebellum and subcortical white matters on brain CT scan.
...
"There was no abnormality in serum electrolytes. His serum albumin was 4.4 g/dl. Serum electrolyte analysis showed sodium 139 mEq/l (Nl range: 135-145 mEq/l), potassium 3 mEq/l (Nl range: 3.5-5.3 mEq/l), calcium 6.6 mg/dl (Nl range: 8.0-10.4 mg/dl), serum phosphate 4.2 mg/dl (Nl range: 2.5-4.5 mg/dl), and serum magnesium was 1.8 mg/dl (Nl range: 1.3-2.5 mg/dl).

that's 0.74 mmol/l by the way. <font=sarcastica>mm hmm yeah sure buddy that's 'normal'. oh and 0.53 mmol/l is a great lower cutoff for your local 'normal' range. nothing to see here in your electrolyte results. such mysterious calcification issues what to do, what to do! </sarcastica>
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Re: all things magnesium

Post by jimmylegs » 1 year ago

aw yisss public health meet clinical care:

The Importance of Magnesium in Clinical Healthcare
https://www.hindawi.com/journals/scient ... 79326/abs/

Abstract
The scientific literature provides extensive evidence of widespread magnesium deficiency and the potential need for magnesium repletion in diverse medical conditions. Magnesium is an essential element required as a cofactor for over 300 enzymatic reactions and is thus necessary for the biochemical functioning of numerous metabolic pathways. Inadequate magnesium status may impair biochemical processes dependent on sufficiency of this element. Emerging evidence confirms that nearly two-thirds of the population in the western world is not achieving the recommended daily allowance for magnesium, a deficiency problem contributing to various health conditions. This review assesses available medical and scientific literature on health issues related to magnesium. A traditional integrated review format was utilized for this study.
Level I evidence supports the use of magnesium in the prevention and treatment of many common health conditions including
migraine headache,
metabolic syndrome,
diabetes,
hyperlipidemia,
asthma,
premenstrual syndrome,
preeclampsia, and
various cardiac arrhythmias.

Magnesium may also be considered for prevention of
renal calculi and cataract formation,
as an adjunct or treatment for depression, and
as a therapeutic intervention for many other health-related disorders
.

In clinical practice, optimizing magnesium status through diet and supplementation appears to be a safe, useful, and well-documented therapy for several medical conditions.

:-D :-D :-D :-D :-D
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Re: all things magnesium

Post by THX1138 » 1 year ago

jimmylegs wrote:aw yisss public health meet clinical care:

The Importance of Magnesium in Clinical Healthcare
https://www.hindawi.com/journals/scient ... 79326/abs/

Abstract
The scientific literature provides extensive evidence of widespread magnesium deficiency and the potential need for magnesium repletion in diverse medical conditions. Magnesium is an essential element required as a cofactor for over 300 enzymatic reactions and is thus necessary for the biochemical functioning of numerous metabolic pathways. Inadequate magnesium status may impair biochemical processes dependent on sufficiency of this element. Emerging evidence confirms that nearly two-thirds of the population in the western world is not achieving the recommended daily allowance for magnesium, a deficiency problem contributing to various health conditions. This review assesses available medical and scientific literature on health issues related to magnesium. A traditional integrated review format was utilized for this study.
Level I evidence supports the use of magnesium in the prevention and treatment of many common health conditions including
migraine headache,
metabolic syndrome,
diabetes,
hyperlipidemia,
asthma,
premenstrual syndrome,
preeclampsia, and
various cardiac arrhythmias.

Magnesium may also be considered for prevention of
renal calculi and cataract formation,
as an adjunct or treatment for depression, and
as a therapeutic intervention for many other health-related disorders
.

In clinical practice, optimizing magnesium status through diet and supplementation appears to be a safe, useful, and well-documented therapy for several medical conditions.

:-D :-D :-D :-D :-D
Magnesium Excels Against Constipation
https://www.peoplespharmacy.com/2013/03 ... stipation/

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