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Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:27 am
by francisco
Vitamin D is a fat-soluble it helps your body absorb calcium, which your bones need to grow. If lack of vitamin D can lead to bone diseases .

Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:00 am
by mrbarlow
vivavie wrote:Jimmy, I take vitamin D 1000 UI morning and night. I never saw any difference, I take it as a "precaution". Maybe you can explain me the difference between D and D3, should I switch?

Paulmur mentionned 20 000mg/day, isn't that very high???
Thank you
This is purely anecdotal but when I feel my symptoms coming on (blurry eye, twitchy nerves and itching) I take a megadose of Vit D (10,000 iu), 1 gram of fish oil, and 500mg of inosine and this seems to help. Maybe placebo but we know those 3 compounds help at a cellular level.

Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:58 am
by jimmylegs
i take d3 10,000IU at a time too. fish oil is great, i take a gram a day. i bought some flax oil for omega 3s too, but haven't really started using it yet.

Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:45 am
by mrbarlow
jimmylegs wrote:i take d3 10,000IU at a time too. fish oil is great, i take a gram a day. i bought some flax oil for omega 3s too, but haven't really started using it yet.
I read that plant based omega 3's are pretty pointless as we convert less than 5% to long chain Omega 3 which we (humans) can actually utilise.

Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:27 am
by jimmylegs
yea i definitely rely more on the fish oil for omega 3... but i don't want to use it when i make salad dressing LOL

Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:09 pm
by CVfactor
So, to tie this all together, here is an article relating vitamin D, viral influences and regulatory T cells in one hypothesis for the cause of multiple sclerosis:

For me, I have been taking 40,000 IU/day since october. My 25-hydroxyvitamin blood level is 250 nmol/L. This level would be considered toxic by most doctors, which means that your calcium level would be too high.

However, my blood serium calcium level is 9 mg/dL which is on the low end of the normal scale.

Since I have been taking this level of Vitamin D, I have not had any significant relapses. I should note that I first started out at 15,000IU/day last summer and continued to have relapses (hand tremmors, optic neuritis, double vision, difficulty saying what I was thinking). I kept increasing the dosage until I reached 25,000.

In October of last year, I had a bad instance of optic neuritis and I increased my dosage to the Lowest Observed Adverse Effect Level (LOAEL) which is estimated to be 40,000IU/day.

This is working for me.

At this point, I do not have anything else that I can to this thread.

I hope whoever reads this finds useful information.

I think this is my last post, and I wish you all the best of luck.

Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:13 pm
by jimmylegs
hey there do you also take zinc?

by the way 250 is the top end of the safe range, above which the *risk* of hypercalcemia is increased.

it's not like there's a hypercalcemia on/off switch between 249 and 250..

Re: Tr1 Regulatory Cells and Vitamin D

Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 5:39 am
by sou
CVfactor wrote:
sou wrote:If MS ever proved to be autoimmune.
"ThisIsMS an unbiased multiple sclerosis community" Not so much.
Why not so much? Unbiased does not really mean that everybody have to agree with everything posted. I strongly disagree with the immunomodulatory approach to treatment and the autoimmune nature of the disease. I may be right, I may be wrong. What's the problem with that?

The forum would be biased if the moderators removed posts which disagree with the forum policies or financial interests. What we all like about this forum is that it is open to any opinion. Everyone may express their opinion freely, respecting the common sense rules. We are free to express ourselves. It does not necessarily mean that we have to agree, too.

Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:36 pm
by CVfactor
O.K., I guess I am going to keep this thread up to date with information I find that supports the hypothesis that MS is a due to a regulatory T-cell defect.

This theory could be wrong, but I believe there is a lot of information to support this and it seems like this forum is the best place I have found to share ideas.

So, to answer Jimmylegs question, I do not monitor my magnesium levels, but I do eat a lot of nuts which are supposed to contain a lot of magnesium.

Now back to the subject at hand.

Here is another recent study that evaluates Regulatory T-cells in the Theiler's virus mouse model of MS. For those not familiar with this model it is not EAE, but is induced by a virus instead of an auto-antigen:

And the conclusions:

"In summary, our findings strongly indicate that differences in
the numbers and the ratio of CNS T effector:Treg cells during acute
TMEV infection control the efficiency of the anti-viral immune
response resulting in virus persistence and resulting long-lasting
effects leading to the eventual development and progression of the
autoimmune demyelinating disease. The preferential expansion of
Tregs in TMEV-infected SJL/J mice, as compared to disease-resistant
C57BL/6 mice, suggests the possibility that genetic susceptibility to
certain autoimmune diseases may be in some instances due to
‘regulatory mimicry’. This would encompass a situation wherein
a clonotype of nTregs expressing a self antigen-specific T cell
receptor selected on particular MHC backgrounds could be activated
to expand in response to a cross-reactive epitope expressed
on an infectious agent. This expanded population of Tregs would
then ameliorate or delay the clearance of the infectious agent in the
target organ of the autoimmune disease setting the stage for
promotion of the development of autoimmunity via mechanisms
such as molecular mimicry or epitope spreading. These findings
thus have important implications to our thinking about the
potential mechanisms underlying induction of human autoimmune
disease secondary to virus infection."

My takeaway is that this is further evidence that MS may be initiated by a viral infection which causes an inappropriate immune response that is not halted by self-tolerance due to a defect in the natural regulatory T-cell (nTreg) function.

Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 5:41 pm
by jimmylegs
actually i asked about zinc. it affects how your body absorbs supplementary d3.

on the magnesium topic though, if you don't measure, you might at least be interested in this WONDERFUL resource with lots of detail on which seeds and nuts are best (raw is the best of all).

Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 5:06 am
by CVfactor
Oh, yeah sorry you were talking about Zinc. So no I do not take any other supplements beside vitamin D. I know there could be other factors that influence how vitamin D functions but for now I have just decided to focus on vitamin D and eat a healthier diet (more fruits, vegetables and nuts).

Thanks for the information on the nuts and seeds. Right now I eat a lot of mixed nuts (almonds, wallnuts, pecans, hazel, brazils) all in shells.

Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 5:40 pm
by CVfactor
Here is a recent paper that describes how vitamin D seems to induce Tregs in mice: ... 30/12/2495

This study was conducted by people working on atherosclerosis, but it does support the theory that vitamin D promotes development of regulatory T-cells.

Anyone have a link for this article about Vitamin D?

Posted: Mon May 02, 2011 5:30 pm
by zanne10000
I just saw my naturopath today and she said she went to an infectious disease conference recently and someone presented a study about Vitamin D, MS and a triggering infection (often EBV). I think the following info from the April 19th issue of Neurology is the article to which she's referring, but it costs $20 to access it. Does anyone have a free link to it? BTW, she has increased my Vit D to 40,000 IUs for 28 weeks based on what she heard at the conference. It's a high dose, I realize, but she said it was shown to be as effective as immune modulators. Thanks!

In Focus Robert A. Gross
Spotlight on the April 19 Issue Neurology April 19, 2011 76:1367 for diagnoses of multiple sclerosis (MS) and infectious mononucleosis were analyzed...provides support for interactions between vitamin D and Epstein-Barr virus in determining the prevalence of MS, which should be taken into account for...

Posted: Mon May 02, 2011 7:13 pm
by jimmylegs
i'll look and let you know if i can get it.

Posted: Mon May 02, 2011 7:53 pm
by zanne10000
Thanks, jimmylegs! I'm wondering if this might be the study to which she was referring: ... s-relapses

It's several years old, though... but it does mention the 40,000 IUs for six months and then tapering, which is what she wants me to do.