AtlasBalance (jaw misalignment) Dr M Amir - Putney London UK

[Amir]

Amir, what are your thoughts on an "Aqualizer" for those not able to access your treatment at this stage? more damage than good?

I am glad that you are coming round to accepting the fact that teeth may, just may have something to do with MS.

My patients will confirm to you that the treatment is not as straightforward as wearing a 'munchy' and hence I can neither condone nor condemn any treatment. There are many dentists all round the world who have a very good idea and can definitely help many patients.

I cannot supply any names as I do not want to be held responsible for any adverse outcomes no matter how remote the chance. I also do not personally know any particular practitioner who I could recommend.
In general if you enquire from AAFO in the USA people who they recommend may have a better idea at providing TMD treatment but again I take no responsibility for any such recomendations.

[EJC]

I'll expand Amir's comments about his treatment.

I've never before come across a situation where an imperceptible amount of movement can create so much reaction in a human body.

When a new patient starts treatment with Amir it's not a case of slapping in a standard starting brace and off we go.

There have been occasions that Emma has had a new appliance or an adjustment (by little more than the thickness of a sheet of paper) that have lead to us returning to see Amir within 48 hours or so. Fortunately we only live 4 minutes drive away.

This doesn't mean Amir did something wrong, it means he's fine tuning what needs to happen in a particular patient. Often a small adjustments gets us immediately back on track.

From the patients perspective it also reinforces how well they are doing when the improvements are eradicated overnight with the tiniest adjustment, then corrected again with an equally small adjustment.

I can't see how a one size fits all appliance could produce the same results that Amir does.

I also have to say it's nice to see Amir being a little, how can say this? Restrained in his answer?

I can image what he would like to have written about the Aqualizer. It must have taken quite some restraint Amir - well done you!

[CureOrBust]

I can't see how a one size fits all appliance could produce the same results that Amir does.

And no-one suggested it.

[EJC]

I can't see how a one size fits all appliance could produce the same results that Amir does.

And no-one suggested it.

You didn't, but people visiting this thread and looking at some of the links may actually arrive at that conclusion.

It was worth pointing it out for clarity.

[Amir]

dr. admir, i love your way of thinking and explaining.

you are right and i have always felt that each of us are different.

when at war "one"aproach has never been the answer--multi attack from whatever gets the job done to win a war is the key.

ok, now we have you dr. admir, we have dr. flanagan, we have the upright mri and the chiro.'s bringing proof in their field, we have the dr.'s and researchers working on ccsvi, and there are many promoted nutrition experts and we still need a few other fields. but it's getting there.

we the patients need to somehow get out of the "ms trap".

thank you again. this is all getting "really really" interesting.

just look at improvement results from tweeking jaws, straightening spines, untwisting or whatever it takes to correct veins and arteries. as you say, the body is an amazing healing machine if all the routes are cleared and fed the proper fuel.

I detest wars especially those where an elephant is crushing a mouse!

I predict that towards the end of 2012 and to the consternation of big pharma, we shall have a good solution to the MS connumdrum.

Presently, the key as far as I am concerned, is early intervention before any physical incapacity sets in.

The above was posted on: Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:39 am

Keeping my promise "towards the end of 2012"
Please read this thread especially see the graphs and recovery from most symptoms and the restoration of walking ability in a number of patients:

http://themsforum.org/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=6

[blossom]

dr. amir, looking forward to your promise. thanks again for being here.



can't get the link to open-anybody else?

[civickiller]

i cant get to the link either

[1eye]

The "MS" patient suffers from an awful disease that is indeed like an elephant -- the elephant in the room that nobody talks about. I want to talk about it. The elephant is division. From initial diagnosis the doctor has an important decision to make: one that will determine the patient's future indefinitely - what kind of "MS" do we have here?

I was asked at my first neurology appointment, when I asked for a treatment I had read of (I was referring to interferon) the guy said "What makes you think you are relapsing-remitting?"

I didn't know how important my answer was.

Divide and conquer. PP, RR, SP, CP, etc. etc. Gets insurance companies, drug "vendors", and many doctors off the hook. Nobody has to do any more investigating or learning about anatomy, just leave everything to Big Pharma (the sister of Big Brother); a pen and a prescription pad is all you need. After a "case" becomes "SP", medicine stops working, so get them into the warehouse as soon as possible after that. Take away the driving license and the rest is easy, a waiting game, really.

An unfortunate coincidence that this usually happens about the same time people start to get impatient with having to come up with $30K-$50K a year for those "meds". For some reason, they don't like to keep injecting them into themselves, and swallowing them.

If doctors can just stonewall, stay the course, soon unruly troublemakers get passed on to warehousing, and they get all-new patients.

Part of what keeps us "patients" in line is the tendency for saviours to appear who have a single answer for everyone's problems. The thing that all of the saviours, allopaths and otherwise, is each other: there will never, ever, be agreement among them. They are all in agreement on that. Nor will there ever be any solidarity among the afflicted. They have too many cognitive problems.

[EJC]

i cant get to the link either

I've emailed Amir and ask him to get his forum people to check the security settings to see if they are a little too tight.

[EJC]

The "MS" patient suffers from an awful disease that is indeed like an elephant -- the elephant in the room that nobody talks about. I want to talk about it. The elephant is division. From initial diagnosis the doctor has an important decision to make: one that will determine the patient's future indefinitely - what kind of "MS" do we have here?

I was asked at my first neurology appointment, when I asked for a treatment I had read of (I was referring to interferon) the guy said "What makes you think you are relapsing-remitting?"

I didn't know how important my answer was.

Divide and conquer. PP, RR, SP, CP, etc. etc. Gets insurance companies, drug "vendors", and many doctors off the hook. Nobody has to do any more investigating or learning about anatomy, just leave everything to Big Pharma (the sister of Big Brother); a pen and a prescription pad is all you need. After a "case" becomes "SP", medicine stops working, so get them into the warehouse as soon as possible after that. Take away the driving license and the rest is easy, a waiting game, really.

An unfortunate coincidence that this usually happens about the same time people start to get impatient with having to come up with $30K-$50K a year for those "meds". For some reason, they don't like to keep injecting them into themselves, and swallowing them.

If doctors can just stonewall, stay the course, soon unruly troublemakers get passed on to warehousing, and they get all-new patients.

Part of what keeps us "patients" in line is the tendency for saviours to appear who have a single answer for everyone's problems. The thing that all of the saviours, allopaths and otherwise, is each other: there will never, ever, be agreement among them. They are all in agreement on that. Nor will there ever be any solidarity among the afflicted. They have too many cognitive problems.

I hear your frustration, I live with someone eaten up with the same frustration.

On a bad day it can be all consuming. Just feel content you chose not to go the drug route.

[Amir]

The "MS" patient suffers from an awful disease that is indeed like an elephant -- the elephant in the room that nobody talks about. I want to talk about it. The elephant is division. From initial diagnosis the doctor has an important decision to make: one that will determine the patient's future indefinitely - what kind of "MS" do we have here?

I was asked at my first neurology appointment, when I asked for a treatment I had read of (I was referring to interferon) the guy said "What makes you think you are relapsing-remitting?"

I didn't know how important my answer was.

Why just 'MS'?
Could this elephant not be something else which does not need these divisons?

Divide and conquer. PP, RR, SP, CP, etc. etc. Gets insurance companies, drug "vendors", and many doctors off the hook. Nobody has to do any more investigating or learning about anatomy, just leave everything to Big Pharma (the sister of Big Brother); a pen and a prescription pad is all you need. After a "case" becomes "SP", medicine stops working, so get them into the warehouse as soon as possible after that. Take away the driving license and the rest is easy, a waiting game, really.

It need not be so!
Big pharma brain washing is almost total. I cannot even put a different idea past many affected by the so called 'MS'

An unfortunate coincidence that this usually happens about the same time people start to get impatient with having to come up with $30K-$50K a year for those "meds". For some reason, they don't like to keep injecting them into themselves, and swallowing them.

It is a gross underestimate:
$30bn: the combined revenue from the top 12 biological products in the United States in 2010
453%: expected increase in US sales of the above top 12 from 2010 to 2014. It will bring annual revenues to $166bn, comprising about 30% of the branded prescription drug market
$200 000: average cost of treating a patient for a year with one of the top nine biologicals in the US
$409 500: average cost per year for the average patient on the most expensive drug in the world, eculizumab, used to treat paroxysmal nocturnal haemoglobinuria
$2: average raw material cost per gram of product produced

If doctors can just stonewall, stay the course, soon unruly troublemakers get passed on to warehousing, and they get all-new patients.

My contention is:
Should you have been there in the first place?

Part of what keeps us "patients" in line is the tendency for saviours to appear who have a single answer for everyone's problems. The thing that all of the saviours, allopaths and otherwise, is each other: there will never, ever, be agreement among them. They are all in agreement on that. Nor will there ever be any solidarity among the afflicted. They have too many cognitive problems.

An interesting post on the MS Society forum went like this:

"There are three big problems for the constituency that believe to their very core in the scientific method:

A. You don't know what causes MS
B. You haven't found any methods for rolling it back
C. You haven't found a cure."

And in a later post he said:

"I believe the scientific method will 'one day' make a breakthrough.
Until then, I (for one) will be open for listening to maverick outsiders, garden shed boffins and spurious snake oil salesmen.
I mean, why wouldn't you?
Being open to stunning developments is one of life's great joys."

[1eye]

...Being open to stunning developments is one of life's great joys."

A diabetic I know who is somewhere between 70 and 80 years old told me the other day: "Don't do it. Why poke yourself in the finger with a razor one to several times a day? You just get on their treadmill, and it can only have a bad end. So I don't do it. Ever." He looks pretty healthy to me, but my standards are low.

While I agree that sometimes what you don't know can't hurt you so much, for some things there are no good alternatives, and sometimes it can hurt you. Hard to know ahead of time. I tend to disbelieve people who have no good news.

[ProfessorRothbart]

A current published research paper provides compelling evidence that foot pronation is directly linked to divergencies in the frontal plane position of the cranial bones and atlas. Frontal plane divergencies in the maxilla (a cranial bone) are pathognomonic (typical of) malocclusions. Below is an abstract of that paper published in The Journal of Craniomandibular and Sleep Practice (Oct 2013, Rothbart BA):

Abstract (Proprioceptive Insoles and Dental Orthotics Change the Frontal Plane Position of the Atlas, Mastoid, Malar, Temporal and Sphenoid Bones)

The purpose of this Series of Case Studies was to determine if the frontal plane position of the cranial bones and atlas could be altered using dental orthotics, prescriptive insoles, or both concurrently.
Methods: The cranial radiographs of four patients were reviewed in this study. Three of the patients were diagnosed as having a TMJ dysfunction and a PreClinical Clubfoot Deformity. The fourth patient was diagnosed as having a TMJ dysfunction, a PreClinical Clubfoot Deformity and a Class II Sacral Occipital Subluxation.

Each patient had a series of 4 cranial radiographs taken using a modified orthogonal protocol. The first cranial radiograph was taken with the patient using neither the dental orthotic nor proprioceptive insoles were used (baseline measurement). The second cranial radiograph was taken with the patient using only the dental orthotic. The third cranial radiograph was taken with the patient only using the proprioceptive insoles. The final cranial radiograph was taken with the patient using both the dental orthotic and proprioceptive insoles concurrently.

The degree of change in angle between the various specified cranial landmarks and atlas were measured directly off of these radiographs and compared to one another.


Results: In two patients, improvement towards orthogonal was achieved when using both prescriptive dental orthotics and prescriptive insole concurrently. Improvement towards orthogonal was less apparent when using only the prescriptive dental orthotic. And no improvement or a negative frontal plane shift was noted when using only the prescriptive proprioceptive insoles.

In the third patient, the frontal plane position of the cranial bones and atlas increased (away from orthogonal) when using the generic proprioceptive insoles alone or in combination with a prescriptive dental orthotic.

In the fourth patient, the frontal plane position of the cranial bones improved using the dental orthotic. However, the proprioceptive insoles when used alone, or in combination with the dental orthotic, increased the frontal plane position of the cranial bones and atlas.


Conclusion: This study demonstrates that changes in the frontal plane position of the cranial and atlas bones can occur when using proprioceptive insoles and/or dental orthotics.

[ProfessorRothbart]

A paper just published in the Journal of Craniomandibular and Sleep Therapy (Oct 2013) demonstrates that abnormal foot (pronation) motion changes the position of the cranial bones and atlas (C1). More specifically, divergency of the maxilla (e.g., malocclusion) can be the result of how the foot moves. This is an important breakthrough in the understanding of the etiology of malocclusions.

Rothbart BA 2013. Prescriptive Insoles and Dental Orthotics Change the Frontal Plane Position of the Atlas (C1), Mastoid, Malar, Temporal and Sphenoid Bones: A Preliminary Study. Journal of Cranio Manidibular and Sleep Practice, Vol 31(4):300-308.

[juefaz]

Hi dr amir
I came for a consultation with you around two years ago and was and still am very interested in the work you do, I have relapse and remitting ms and had had ccsvi treatment about 8 months before I came to see you, I didn't think I had much improvement from the ccsvi so was a bit dubious at the time to spend even more money on having my jaw realigned, I had started chiropractor treatment around the same time I came to see you as I definitely think the connection with ms is more to do with alignment of the jaw, spine etc. as I had just started chiropractic treatment I wanted to do one thing at a time so have continued with that for the last two years, I've had lots of relief from initial problems I had with my neck, shoulders and arm. The only thing it has never helped with is my walking which to be fair to the chiropractor she never said it would, in fact in the beginning she didnt think she would be able to help me very much at all which she told me from the start but we decided to try, she xrayed my whole spine and c spine and I have a lot of problems, I have fusions in my c spine,I also have 2 curvatures and a narrowing at L5 I think, the fusions in the c spine seem to be confusing to the chiropractor and my neuro they both asked if I had a bad accident ever which I haven't, so they've come to the conclusion they are probably congenital, (we also have scoliosis in the family) another thing I have on my c spine which showed up on MRI is a syrinx which is a kind of bubble of Csf. My neuro found the syrinx which he also thinks may have been there for years but I don't think he really know. Now considering I have all these problems I can still walk and I still work in a physical job, Up until 6 months ago I wasn't even using a stick but the last few months I seemed to have progressed a bit and I now use a stick mainly for balance really. I do not and have never taken DMD's all I take is LDN which I have been taking for 3 years and I think has helped me, my neuro offers me DMD's each time I go but I refuse as I don't think they will help as I said at the beginning I think MS is more to do with alignment, veins, circulation etc and the dMD's can't help that. Because my walking has determinate s over the last few months I have been researching again and have been reading about a drug called ampyra which actually seems to make more sense to me for my walking problem as it is a potassium channel blocker which can give better nerve conduction, I'm considering trying it as apparently if its going to work it works within a month. This is the stage I'm at at the moment but after just reading everything that's been said on here a light suddenly went on in my head, around 6 months ago I stated having some dental treatment I've had a back tooth extracted I think it was a wisdom tooth, I've also had two root canal one quite large now I can't remember exactly if all this coincided with my walking deteriorating but I think it was all around the same time, so my question is do you think this dental work could have interfered with my walking? You did say when I saw you my jaw was misaligned and would need a brace so could this extra work I've had done made things worse? I'm in to minds now wether to give the ampyra a try or maybe come back to you, would you please give me some advice as I don't want my walking to deteriorate anymore. Thank you