CCSVI and CCVBP

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.

Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby euphoniaa » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:19 am

uprightdoc wrote:While you can't make the spinal problems go away with diet and exercise you can manage them.

Taking care of the musculoskeletal system is very helpful in manage most types of spinal and other health problems no matter what. Diet is also important to the health of all tissue including the nervous and musculoskeletal systems.


I'm positive that many of the things I've done to optimize my health have worked to improve most every one of my physical maladies. And I had a lot of them – even before the MS diagnosis. Since then, I've even managed to get some control over the finger tremor that got me diagnosed with MS (totally by accident) in the first place, by using a hand exercise ball. (I report on that a lot, too.)

Here's my RLS/massage update: When I went to my massage yesterday, I asked for a lower pillow, and we came up with a buckwheat hull version that allowed me to squiggle my head into the most comfortable position and hold it there. I also turned my head the opposite way than I usually do (that seemed to make the RLS milder last time). Result: This was the first massage in months where I didn't have a single twitch, jerk, or kick in my left leg. Cool! Am anxious to see if I've found the answer or if it was a fluke.

And a note about neck noises: My neck gives me snaps, crackles & pops with virtually every movement these days. I can't remember when it didn't make some noise, but it seems to be getting worse. And I recently found that it's loud enough to project to a crowd, too. I work at a university where I volunteer to be the subject of the day in PT classes now and then when I have a new problem. A couple of months ago they had me doing the usual movement evaluation, asking me questions, checking my posture, gait, doing toe touches, and then the PT prof said, "Is that sound coming from your neck?!!"

This time they think it's Piriformis Syndrome, an entrapped sciatic nerve thing, and gave me exercises. Last time I volunteered at PT class, my GP had diagnosed hip bursitis and recommended shots. Instead, the PT class gave me specific exercises that completely got rid of the pain so I could walk again! Both of these have been painful conditions in my non-MS leg, maybe due to a bad knee that causes me to overcompensate for it.

(It's not always MS, it's not always MS, it's not always MS...)

My latest plan: I'm going to try to get an updated MRI of my C-spine and see if I can figure out what type of professional can help me with it. Do I need Upper Cervical treatment or only a round of PT for now? I was irritated when my neuro ordered only a brain MRI last April, even when my original C-spine MRI showed issues.

Wishing everyone a relaxing, pain free day today!
Dx'd with MS & HNPP (hereditary peripheral neuropathy) 7/03 but must have had MS for 30 yrs before that. I've never taken meds for MS except 1 yr experiment on LDN. (I found diet, exercise, sleep, humor, music help me the most.)
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:43 am

Euphoniaa,

What you did to accomodate massage was a simple and smart solution.

As far as your leg symptoms are concerned I have an Tensor Fascia Lata or Illiotibial Band Syndrome myself. The snapping and popping is due to the degenerated dry fascia and connective tissues rubbing and snapping over the ischial tuberosity (sitting bone), illiac crest (top of pelvis) and Gerdy's tubercle (tibial tubercle) in the lower leg. It causes fibromyofascitis. Exercise is the best way to deal with IT problems as well as piraformis problems. I also worked on the lower spine in patients with problems and its a good idea to check the arches in the feet and the "Q" angle in the legs. Pronated arches in the feet and excess Valgus stress in the knees (knock knee position), as well as tibial torsion (inward twisting of the lower leg (tibia) against the upper leg (femur) predisposes people to IT band problems.

Specific upper cervical is the best way to deal with the most critical area of the spine. When it comes to advanced spondylosis, stenosis, scoliosis and everything else below C2, I am a big advocate for flexion distraction spinal decompression tables. These tables allow the doctor to correct and rehabilitate degenearted segements as well as to move joint, blood and CSF fluids.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby civickiller » Mon Oct 31, 2011 5:05 am

i had cracking in my neck at least 5 times a day i felt pressure in my neck that got relieved with cracking,now with upper cervical care i think my neck has cracked 3 times in 10 months and it happened when i was out of alignment.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Mon Oct 31, 2011 6:26 am

Civickiller,

There is a good possibility that due to the nature of your injuries you damaged the upper cervical ligaments, which is why you may be more unstable than ususal. You cracked your head hard in the back when you fell out of tree and you landed on top of your head when you fell doing handstands. There was an earlier injury as well which left a scar on your forehead. That's why you have MS and your twin brother doesn't.

In additon to tying Chiari malformations to trauma, Drs. Harshfield, Rosa and Freeman are showing that whiplash damage the upper cervical ligaments and cause instability. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if you have upper cervical instability and a Chiari 1 type malformation.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby coach » Mon Oct 31, 2011 9:52 am

Been a while since I posted. MRI of my thoracic and lumbar spinenal areas sho that I have a stenosis in the lumbar spine due to a bulging disc at the L4L5 level. My question is this something that would need to be repaired surghically? If so I would preefer to go the endoscopic route. I don't know if there is anyone at the Houston Clinic in Colombus, Ga. that does this. Atlanta is also a possibility. Will do some checking. Also something that seemed to resolve after I had a stent placed in my azygous vein was my hypertension. I don't seem to have any of the risk factors that would predispose me to this. Seems like it fell into the idiopathic category. Now I seem to have this odd thing going on with my voice in that I'm having a hard time talking without sounding hoarse. Will see an ENT doctor to rule out a problem with vocal cords. Doesn't appear to be allergy or URI related. Sometimes my throat seems a little sore but not always. The CINE MRI and cerical spine mri were of course done in the supine position. Maybe the doctors will get onboard with the upright mri.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby NZer1 » Mon Oct 31, 2011 11:17 am

Hi all, Dr F I am slowing getting my head around the last reply about the cord and bone structures.
If I have understood, the cord is stretched when bending forward and compressed when arching backward because the cord goes around the outside (at the rear) of the radius of the curve of the spine.

In my mind that in itself would be a reason for many of us to have problems if there is cord lesions or blood flow issues. As well as the problems of nerve exits from the cord to the peripheral nerves.

The next question is that Graham Dobson made comment about where the spine is most often damaged from whiplash injuries, which I cannot remember. It seemed to me to be opposite to my issue because of forced flexing from my sports injuries.
If there is an inherent problem with the brain sitting low in the forum magnum then the cord being drawn into the space from forward bending would exacerbate this more? Therefore likely to increase conduction issues of the nerves?

Regards Nigel
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Mon Oct 31, 2011 1:07 pm

coach wrote:Been a while since I posted. MRI of my thoracic and lumbar spinenal areas sho that I have a stenosis in the lumbar spine due to a bulging disc at the L4L5 level. My question is this something that would need to be repaired surghically? If so I would preefer to go the endoscopic route. I don't know if there is anyone at the Houston Clinic in Colombus, Ga. that does this. Atlanta is also a possibility. Will do some checking. Also something that seemed to resolve after I had a stent placed in my azygous vein was my hypertension. I don't seem to have any of the risk factors that would predispose me to this. Seems like it fell into the idiopathic category. Now I seem to have this odd thing going on with my voice in that I'm having a hard time talking without sounding hoarse. Will see an ENT doctor to rule out a problem with vocal cords. Doesn't appear to be allergy or URI related. Sometimes my throat seems a little sore but not always. The CINE MRI and cerical spine mri were of course done in the supine position. Maybe the doctors will get onboard with the upright mri.


Hello Coach,

You only have to repair discs if they are causing mechanical or neurological problems. Endoscopic or microscopic surgery is the best way to go when possible. They sometimes do percutaneous discectomies in the low back in which they go in with a tube a suction out the center of the bad disc, which sucks in the protruded outside walls.

The cranial nerves to the tongue, the hypoglossal nerves (cranial nerve number 12) passes through the hypoglossal canal in the foramen magum and is subject to compression due to cerebellar tonisllar ectopia (Chiari malformations). Aside from other diseases, it is a common sign and symptom of Chiari malformations.

Upright MRI makes a lot of sense in your case if only to check for Chiari. It would also be good for checking blood and CSF flow.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Mon Oct 31, 2011 1:19 pm

Nigel,
You hit the nail on the head. In addition to dynamics inside the canal during head and neck movement, many of you most likely have some tethering of the cord, which can cause Lehermitte's sign.

I just published a page you might find interesting.

http://www.upright-health.com/foramen-magnum.html

The last two discs in the lower neck are the most likely to herniate and affect nerves or the cord. Recent research by Dr. Harshfield however shows that the upper cervical ligaments are often injured and can caused far more problems such as tonsillar ectopia or Chiari malformations.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby NZer1 » Tue Nov 01, 2011 1:34 am

May be of interest;
http://medicalxpress.com/news/2011-10-s ... sease.html
Ccsvi Transverse Myelitis, https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001258029163
New research finds a key predictor of cardiovascular risk among those with spinal cord injury. Damage to the autonomic nervous system, which runs along the spinal cord, affects the control of functions such as activities of the bladder, bowel, gastrointestinal tract, liver, heart and blood vessels. This means that people with autonomic dysfunction due to spinal cord injury, may remain at high risk of cardiovascular disease, even if they maintain a healthy lifestyle and exercise regularly.

Regards Nigel
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby whyRwehere » Tue Nov 01, 2011 1:07 pm

Thanks Dr Flanagan, for your reply. I've had to wait for my turn on the old computer to get back to you.
We will continue with the chiro, although not an upper cervical expert...don't seem to have those here, but better than just getting worse, I guess. c'est la vie....
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby Sunnee » Tue Nov 01, 2011 7:02 pm

uprightdoc,

Cervical spine problems can be caused at birth yeah! and probably do not cause any significant or noticeable problems as a child, but can problems become apparent in young adult life or even in your late teens.

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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:30 am

Whyrwehere,

The only thing I recall you telling me about your husband is that in addition to MS he has throacic outlet syndrome (TOS) and curvature problems in his back. I don't know what his MS signs and symptoms are but TOS has been associated with venous drainage problems in the lower neck causing Parkinson's. The TOS problem should be manageable with full spine chiropractic. I treated many TOS cases.
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby civickiller » Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:51 am

Hi Dr F

i have a friend who has a 1 year old son with VACTERL association

i wonder if UCC can help in anyway

Thanks
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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby Sunnee » Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:44 am

Civickiller,

If it was suspected or common knowledge you would find some info on it.

But Civickiller you and I know anything is possible. and certainly would be an avenue that I would go down.

On a different site there were some who mentioned swallowing problems.


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Re: CCSVI and CCVBP

Postby uprightdoc » Wed Nov 02, 2011 4:14 am

Hi Civickiller,
VACTERAL is sometimes associated with Klippel-Feil (fused segments in the cervical spine), scoliosis and other abnormalities of the spine such as irregularly shaped segments that might benefit from UCC or other chiropractic care to help manage the problem. These cases, however, are usually due to a multitude of genetic issues and have many musculoskeletal and internal organ problems.
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