This Is MS Multiple Sclerosis Community: Knowledge & Support

I'd like to just clarify a bit on this thread...

Many of the vein treatments discussed on here are used on the legs, for chronic venous insufficiency in the lower limbs. Having spoken with the doctors about this, the mechanism of venous insufficiency is VERY different in the legs as opposed to the neck, due to gravity.

Butchers broom, horse chestnut are vasoconstrictors, and this is important to note. They make veins tighter by affecting the endothelial lining. Vein problems in the legs are due to stretched out, hyperextended veins and faulty valves. They are not strong enough to pump blood back up, against gravity, to the heart. These supplements you're discussing are known to tighten veins, make them stronger via constriction. This is not the problem in CCSVI.

In CCSVI, there is a truncular venous malformation (a web or inverted valve or missing vein) that is creating slowed drainage with gravity. The veins don't need to be constricted any more than they are.

P rimary chronic venous disease is a widespread disorder.
Its manifestations include symptoms in the form of pain
and heaviness, and signs in the form of telangiectasia,
varicose veins, skin changes, and chronic leg ulcers. Recent advances
in the understanding of its pathophysiology have shown
that molecular mechanisms in the inflammatory cascade underlie
these diverse manifestations. Venous hypertension and alteration
of hemodynamic forces, such as blood pressure changes in
the wall and sheer stress, induce activation of leukocytes and
endothelial cells. This may initiate the cascade of inflammation
that results in adverse changes in the venous valve, venous wall,
and skin and leads to the many clinical manifestations of the disease.
The disease symptoms and the telangiectasia, varicose veins,
and eventual venous leg ulcers appear to be a consequence of the
changes induced by venous hypertension and shear stress. Treatment
to inhibit inflammation may offer the greatest opportunity
to prevent progression of the disease and its related complications.
Daflon 500 mg, an oral phlebotropic medication, attenuates
various elements of the inflammatory cascade, particularly the
leukocyte-endothelium interactions that are important in many
aspects of the disease. Such medication deserves more detailed
study to confirm its protective effect on venous structures.

It seems like it might be useful. But I'm no doctor.

Intravital microscopy demonstrated that although in vivo bromelain treatment transiently decreased leukocyte rolling, its primary long-term effect was abrogation of firm adhesion of leukocytes to blood vessels at the site of inflammation. These changes in adhesion were correlated with rapid re-expression of the bromelain-sensitive CD62L/L-selectin molecules that mediate rolling following in vivo bromelain treatment and minimal re-expression of CD128 over the time period studied. Taken together, these studies demonstrate that bromelain can effectively decrease neutrophil migration to sites of acute inflammation and support the specific removal of the CD128 chemokine receptor as a potential mechanism of action.

Daflon is based on a natural compound---diosmin, which is a flavanoid.
It is for use in lower limbs, and it increases vasoconstriction to help veins overcome gravity and get blood back to the heart. We've had discussions on here before regarding medications used for chronic venous insufficiency in the legs in a CCSVI application. It may not be a good thing, and people have reported good and bad results.

Here are earlier threads on diosmin and CCSVI---
http://www.thisisms.com/ftopicp-67890-d ... html#67890
http://www.thisisms.com/ftopicp-93270-d ... html#93270

This is a comment I made on a horse chestnut supplement thread

http://www.thisisms.com/ftopicp-148484- ... oom#148484

Hope Dr. Sclafani chimes in....he may have a different view.
cheer

I wanted to say that our jugulars are like gutters and our leg veins are like upspouts, but I couldn't think of a good example of an upspout.

I wanted to say that our jugulars are like gutters and our leg veins are like upspouts, but I couldn't think of a good example of an upspout.

I will have to get Dr. Cooke's book.

The pipes going up and the pipes going down both rely on valves to do their handiwork. In the leg variant of CSVI the valves are stuck open and in the neck variant they are stuck closed. Relieve the inflammation, unstick the valves, open the stenosis and Bob's your uncle.