Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treatment

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Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treatment

Postby CindyCB » Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:30 am

I have started this thread to detail my treatment with Dr Amir over the coming months.

Some may already know my story but to recap I do not have an MS diagnosis.

I was initially diagnosed with ME/CFS in 2007 due to increasing fatigue, IBS and brain fog. Through 2008 my health deteriorated rapidly with dizziness, balance issues, crushing migraines and headaches, tinnitus, ear fullness, stiff neck and shoulders and a feeling of being 'spaced out'. This culminated in an episode some neurologists have since considered to be a TIA leaving me with numbness, pain and weakness down my right side that I find debilitating. I have not been able to lead a normal life since then.

I have been reviewed by several different neuros. All my MRIs are clean, no lesions, no Chiari Malformation, lumbar puncture also normal, CFS pressure normal. It was discovered I have what appears to be a hypoplastic RIJV but was told this is simply normal variation. Ophthamology tests are also normal, my vision has got slightly worse compared to six years ago but not enough to require glasses though I suffer with blurriness and bad depth perception issues.

I've had every variety of blood test, all autoimmiune (I have Hashimoto's hypothyroidism), all vitamins and minerals (severe vitamin D deficiency), MRIs all over, gastro tests, done all the CBT, pacing, heparin, steroids (which I couldn't tolerate at all), treated for apparent allergies with vaccines and various diets. Thyroxine helped with my hypothyroidism but I never really felt a lot better as I had hoped. I have tried all varieties of thyroid hormone and vit/mineral supplements without any success – nothing really seemed to fit my specific symptoms.

Neurologists I've seen think it's 'all in my head', 'CFS/ME' or want to apply the 'watch and wait' technique as they feel I may be in the early stages of developing MS before lesions present.

In January this year I was scanned for CCSVI with The EHC in Guildford and found to be positive, matching enough of the criteria for a diagnosis but they later declined to treat me as I do not have MS. I had further scans in April in Frankfurt which also confirmed CCSVI in my jugulars; my azygos looks clear on MRV but obviously I have not had an MRA so cannot be sure. It's worth noting I do not have signs of reflux in the IJVs but stenosis on both sides, each with malformed valves, which are not stuck together but are asymetric.

After much soul-searching, reviewing this forum and reading stories of others I decided I would wait for treatment and doctors' knowledge to progress before angioplasty. I am worried if I restenose or develop a blood clot in the veins I will end up in a worse position than currently. I also wonder why if I have CCSVI in both IJVs my symptoms are pretty much restricted to the right side of my body.

On Thursday I saw Dr Amir in Putney – I provided him with detailed answers to his online questionnaire beforehand and after examining my jaw, teeth and the muscles around my body, my posture and my cervical spine, he firmly diagnosed me with TMJ disorder and completely dismissed my ME/CFS diagnosis.

I have had TMJ problems for years, with jaw and teeth out of line. During 2008 when I fell ill I was having lots of dental work but also seeing an osteopath to help with my 'ME/CFS' and stiffness in my shoulders and neck. She didn't do much to alleviate my symptoms but snapped my neck around in a series of manoeuvres every session. Unfortunately I did not connect my worsening symptoms to her treatment as I was continually told it was ME/CFS, but now wonder if this is relevant, having discussed this with Dr Amir.

I performed a series of small exercises and movements with my jaw in the current incorrect position and then in the correct position and found lots of strange things happened like an increased range of movement and much easier breathing.

Dr Amir explained my symptoms link to the TMJ dysfunction and confirmed that my atlas is out of line and would address this. I already knew my C1 was displaced because I have had regular chiropractic sessions for three years. In every session my atlas was readjusted but never held for long. I think I know why now!

Dr Amir sent me and my husband away to think about everything we discussed before accepting his treatment. I thought long and hard (as we've already spent a lot of money on my health) and to me this makes a lot of sense given the number of years I've had a 'clicky jaw' and that my symptoms are focussed on the same side.

To 'back this up' I also had an appointment with a local oral surgeon who gave me a cortisone shot into the coronoid process that has greatly eased the awful nagging pain in my head, neck and shoulders on my right side, but I do not see this as a longer term solution and would prefer to have my jaw realigned for a permanent fix.

I return to Dr Amir next week to be fitted with the first dental appliance and will update once a month or so. He has estimated two years of treatment but that I should be cured of the 'ME/CFS' in three to six months. I can hardly believe this could be true because I've been ill for so long. Could it all really be down to TMJ disorder?

Dr Amir told me at the start of my appointment he was waiting to meet his first true ME/CFS patient after seeing hundreds. I wondered if it could be me but it looks like I'm just another 'fake'! ;-)

It would be interesting to have a further CCSVI scan once my treatment is complete to see how it compares. Initially when I found I had CCSVI I was extremely worried I was going on to develop MS in the near future. Dr Amir feels that early TMJ treatment (in all patients, not just in my case) could prevent this from happening.
Last edited by CindyCB on Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Thyroid disease, Vitamin D deficiency, hypermobility, 'ME/CFS', CCSVI (stenosis both sides and assymetric malformed valves), TMJ - No MS but many neuro symptoms.
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby Amir » Sat Dec 17, 2011 7:04 am

CindyCB wrote:
I return to Dr Amir next week to be fitted with the first dental appliance and will update once a month or so. He has estimated two years of treatment but that I should be cured of the 'ME/CFS' in three to six months. I can hardly believe this could be true because I've been ill for so long. Could it all really be down to TMJ disorder?

Dr Amir told me at the start of my appointment he was waiting [with baited breath] to meet his first true ME/CFS patient after seeing hundreds. I wondered if it could be me but [Alas!] it looks like I'm just another 'fake'! ;-)


I should be cured of the 'ME/CFS' in three to six months.

OR I SHALL HANG!
Last edited by Amir on Sat Dec 17, 2011 10:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby THEGREEKFROMTHED » Sat Dec 17, 2011 7:30 am

Do your thing dr amir! I pray you solve this riddle of eight million different theories
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby EJC » Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:11 am

Good to have two of us on the forum reporting treatement and effects Cindy.

It will provide a good comparison.
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby Sharon » Mon Jan 09, 2012 12:22 pm

Dr. Chuck Woodfield and David Williams will be talking about Cranial and Atlas instability at the ISNVD Patient Day - Feb 18th. Be sure to register for the live webinar at http://www.isnvd.org/index.php?site=patientday#content.

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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby TheCatsWhiskers » Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:49 am

@CindyCB

How did/ are you getting on with Dr Amir's treatment? I have a near identical symptom/ health profile to you and have an appointment with Dr Amir in a couple of weeks.

Would be good to hear your progress - good/ bad or indifferent! ;)

Also would you be able to outline treatment costs in your case?

Kind regards,
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby davidstephenson » Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:37 pm

Is the ATLAS everything or is it just TMJ dysfunction?

and of course, there are going to be consequences of moving your Atlas, especially because it was jammed for a long time.
If the joint was " dry ". Atrophied and probably inflamed cartilage and poor synovial fluid production.
And then , highly hypertonic strap muscles will be leading to internal vertebral muscle weakness.
To move the joint properly , the hypertonic muscles have to be treated. Therefore, needling or cold laser treatment
of major dysfunctional motor end plates / trigger points / " knots " producing muscle release and reconfiguration is necessary, but with muscle bruising
in the case of dry needling. Once we have cold lasers that can penetrate deep enough, this whole therapy will be much easier and better for the patient.

and so bruising and haemotoma, " bleeding within the muscle " will make the recovery slower, but now the joint and muscles will heal.

I have been talking a lot with several different musculoskeletal and chiropractic therapists, and natural therapy doctors about
issues of old Atlas and TMJ injury.

I have written this advice below because I know that people with old injuries will have
received therapy over many years
and are entitled to respect with regards to their full understanding of the complex problem of chronic pain/ dysfunction of Atlas /TMJ injury.

I apologise for it sounding like a mission, but to me it is.

To make very clear, in Europe, ATLANTOtec is gold standard of Atlas alignment therapy
It is not a medical procedure. It is a palpation and alignment technique.
No assessment other than palpation of the Atlas, and no "diagnosis" or " therapy".
and no promises about outcome or symptom relief.

250 euro , alignment , expect that the body will sort itself out.

yet the technique has been readily adopted by many many chiropractors, physios and musculoskeletal therapists in Europe
BECAUSE it is a necessary and profound technique enabling them to complete amazing whole body structural, postural and musculoskeletal outcomes
for patients who used to be on continual " maintenance " therapy. ie palliative therapy , not curative.


And as a health practitioner, I know my anatomy and physiology and biochemistry
and I also know that that Atlas alignment on its own is not going to give anyone a " miracle".
I can do my part and do it well with education and professional restraint, but the Atlas isnt everything.

Yet it is usually the ONLY thing that has been ignored , with long term chronic problems, so ATLANTOtec provides the person with immediate and profound relief, of headaches and re-establishes range of motion.

I have had many people come back or report back and say " that was life changing !"

Many many dentists trained in TMD therapy have had astounding patient outcomes as well
just from just 24/7 alignment of the TMJs using removable orthotics or
or full mouth rehabilitation of the occlusion using good modern orthodontics or reconstructive ceramic dentistry.
Proper neuro muscular occlusion affects upper cervical spine health profoundly.

and sometimes all a person needs is a pelvic alignment after a fall or foot or ankle or knee or hip injury.

or a podiatry orthotic

or a new bed and a good pillow.

I have taken some amazing before and after images of postural correction after ONLY an Atlas alignment
and some that seem to make very little difference in posture.

That important thing is that no-one can be neuro-musculo-skeletally well,
unless one is " aligned ". and that alignment is within their range of adaptation.

Spinal health is ( almost ) everything, as our chiropractors especially have been trying to teach us.

The sooner a joint injury is adequately reversed the better.

Once a joint injury becomes chronic, the joint muscles/ligaments/capsule becomes dysfunctional and inflamed and
becomes harder and harder to correct.
This is true even in hyperflexible, supple people, and maybe even more so, because their ligaments are so loose.

Once an injury starts to become chronic, it sets up compensations within the entire system of the body.
An acute injury can lead to weakness, imbalance, compensation and further low grade injury throughout the system.
A long term low grade chronic injury on the physical, neural, biochemical and emotional stress points in the body
will obviously lead to dysfunction, dystrophy, breakdown, ageing and incapacitation.

Therefore, I believe that the older the structural injury,
the more support must FIRST be given to nutritional support of the physiology and biochemistry.
then provide the structural alignment within a mapped out treatment plan, whole body, craniosacral therapy phase, including the dental occlusion and TMJs.
not just a few adjustments of what ever seems to be playing up at the time,
The patient should be supported then,
by hydration and minerals
therapeutic nutrition, and low stress diet.
anti-oxidants and cartilage repair,
calming of the chronic pain and muscle inflammation condition,
isotonic and range of motion exercise of the whole body,
therapeutic breathing to promote oxygenation, lymph and immune and good sleep.
and the right attitude and willingness to take responsibility for self-health.

As

Every therapists first agenda is to educate a patient in self-health.
Secondly, we provide diagnosis, so that the condition can be adequately addressed.

Thirdly, the therapist provides maximum therapeutic outcome within their regime of competancy
and their form of therapy. Ideally within a collaborative therapy model.

Hopefully, one day, we will either have collaborative integrated therapy practitioners with skill and gift,
or whole body health practitioners with knowledge, skill, and gifts.

I live and hope..

“The doctor of the future will be oneself.”
― Albert Schweitzer

Dr David Stephenson B D Sc ( Hons ) American Academy of Cranio Facial Pain, Australiasian Sleep Association, Australasian Association of Dental Sleep Medicine, ATLANTOtec Practitioner.
I am a general dentist in Brisbane Australia, with training in occlusal reconstruction, TMD, sleep apnoea, bruxism, postural assessment, trigger point therapy, Buteyko breathing, food intolerances, growth orthodontics and pre-orthodontic therapy in children.
and Atlas alignment.
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby ANothingNobody » Fri Dec 04, 2015 7:53 pm

This thread is definitely on the right track to the root causes of MS. While TMD and misalignment of the atlas are contributors in many cases of MS, I believe that bone density as it relates to the cranial sutures is even more important. By also leveraging the insights of Schelling and Williams, I think an even more comprehensive understanding of MS is achievable.

To put it simply and succinctly: For those of you suffering from the relapse-remitting pattern, your cranial sutures have lost their structural integrity (become overly compliant), allowing for excessive cranial bone movement. Most of this movement is powered by your jaw muscles, particularly during bruxing (teeth clenching). In this way, your cranial cavity can expand during a sustained bruxing episode. When the bruxing episode ends,your cranial bones deflect inwardly compressing your brain resulting in global brain damage. Have you ever wondered why so many MS patients wake up in the morning with new symptoms? This is why. For most MS patients, their disease is most active during the night while they sleep.

You can read more here:

http://www.anothingnobody.com/Content/u ... ing_ms.pdf
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby aliki » Thu Jun 02, 2016 7:54 am

Hello everyone in this forum,
I suffer from MS 13 years now. One month ago I visited Dr Amir in London who told me that I have a tmj disorder and I could treat it if we start a therapy for at least 2 years .
I live in Greece so the fact that he told me that I should visit him every month in London dissapointed me . I do not have the strenght and the money to travel every month to London .So I did a research here in my country for a doctor who could know about tmj disorders .Finally I found one dentist in Athens and I visited him . Although he is a yound doctor he has an experience and an education to these type of problems .For start he made me a denture in order to use it for 4 days and after if I feel any difference we could discuss about the coices that I could have .
Wearing the denture I felt that I could breath better and maybe ( I am not sure for that ) I have I little bit more strenght .
Although this denture made me a little bit nervous .It is not very comfortable wearig it .
Tomorrow I am going to visit the dentist again.
I have some questions to you that have already followed the tmj therapy:
1) Do you feel better after the fix of tmj disorder?
2) The improvements that you had still exist ?
3) Does it worth the time and the money to follow this type of treatment?



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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby CureOrBust » Thu Jun 02, 2016 6:49 pm

aliki wrote:I have some questions to you that have already followed the tmj therapy:
1) Do you feel better after the fix of tmj disorder?
2) The improvements that you had still exist ?
3) Does it worth the time and the money to follow this type of treatment?

1. I saw a dentist who was recommended by a dentists that was recommended by Amir. They found no TMJ disorder. My regular dentist is also a TMJ specialist (holistic dentistry) and she has not found any TMJ issues in me. Placebo will often count for around 30%. Also, if you read this thread, you will see claims of MS symptoms gone and in the same post references to ongoing MS symptoms. Very questionable as to the accuracy of any claims. Also if you read his personal posts in this thread, there are some very non scientific basis / beliefs to his claims.
2. As no issues were found. I had no treatment for TMJ
3. As an MS treatment, there is no scientific evidence. However, if you have TMJ issues, then the treatment will benefit those TMJ issues.

Amir and his followers disappeared very quickly. His website content has also changed. I heard a rumor that his claims were brought to the attention of the UK dental association around the same time. My personal opinion is that you would be much better off searching different avenues for MS treatment, and only spend money on TMJ for specific TMJ issues.
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby Rosegirl » Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:48 am

Aliki,

You did not describe your symptoms, but here is a brief recap of my story.

Like you, I am being treated by a holistic dentist and have already noticed some remarkable effects from treatment.

For an overview of how a holistic dentist (not a general dentist) looks at treatment of so-called MS symptoms, see the link below. This video is almost an hour long. I suggest you skip the intro by the guy in the bowling shirt as it has no connection to the value of the rest of the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa6Pdw6bFLo

There are many ways that problems can occur. Perhaps the cause is congenital. Trauma from a fall, whiplash or concussion might be to blame. Sometimes wearing braces -- that did not account for the impact of the body’s proprioception -- created a problem.

In my case, there are two misalignment issues that require treatment.

First, my upper dental arch was actually more of a V shape instead of the normal U shape. That certainly skewed the TM joint. When that happens, it can impact the trigeminal nerve which controls, among other things, gait and proprioception. When last I looked at the statistics, CCSVI treatment was much less successful with walking related issues than with other symptoms. In my case, three CCSVI treatments were all unsuccessful, and walking has always been my only issue.

The first part of my treatment plan was to expand the width of the dental arch. That would help properly reposition the TM joint.

Second, the roof of my mouth was like a dome, higher in the middle, when it should be flat. My dentist explained that, among other things, it pressed up against the pituitary gland. He said that reducing pressure on the pituitary as the shape of the dental arch changed would release more human growth hormone (HGH), and I should expect to start looking a little younger.

After a few months, to my surprise, that sort of did happen. I am over 60 and at the start of my treatment, my hair was short and a very light gray. I happened to decide to return to the long hair style that I had most of my life. First, my hair began growing at a noticeably faster pace. Had I tried to maintain a short hair style, I would have needed a haircut every three weeks. It also grew in thicker, and the hair clips I used years ago no longer could hold all my hair. While that might be hard to document, about 30 percent of that same fast growing hair grew in dark like when I was young. That was a very obvious marker of change.

CureOrBust, we should all be skeptical of any treatment because, unfortunately, our symptoms and their root causes vary so widely. I urge you to temper that skepticism as we also remember our collective outrage when CCSVI is denounced.

That bad news is that we are all still searching for a cure. But the possibility of a dental cure – without any drugs or any kind of invasive surgery – offers a relatively inexpensive potential treatment. Like CCSVI, it gives new hope to many.
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby CureOrBust » Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:17 am

Rosegirl wrote:CureOrBust, we should all be skeptical of any treatment because, unfortunately, our symptoms and their root causes vary so widely. I urge you to temper that skepticism as we also remember our collective outrage when CCSVI is denounced.
My skepticism I think is already more than "tempered". I got a recommendation for a dentist outside of the UK from Amir (which was like ...err... pulling teeth) of someone who I think actually trained him in TMJ, who provided me a recommendation in Australia, who I saw. As I explained above. ie it is not simply a blanket doubt with no founding.

On the topic for CCSVI, I have had three treatments. If you actually look at the original/1st posts on CCSVI, I was one of the first to jump on board, and was one of the first here to have Ultra Sound tests performed outside of Italy (as well as MRV and SWI). My 1st treatment was very early on, the second was by the group in Melbourne who recently completed a very scientific placebo controlled with "crossover" study recently, and the third was by Dr Scafarni in NY with IVUS. None of these appear to have helped me personally. I place myself in harms way in the hope something "crazy" may just work.
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Re: Atlas/TMJ treatment with Dr M Amir to negate CCSVI treat

Postby aliki » Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:42 pm

Thanks everyone for your answers . I think that I should give to this disorder of jaw the chance to be treated. Until now with my dentist we have not speak about the money . I do not believe that the treatment would be very expensive .
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