CVI and CCSVI similarities?

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.

CVI and CCSVI similarities?

Postby Ernst » Wed Jul 22, 2009 11:17 pm

I have red some texts here about comparing CVI (for example in leg) and CCSVI. Is the veins insufficiency process similar? or what are the similarities? Of course vein dysfunctions can be in different areas of body and this produces different concequences. With my poor english I've notices some common things: (please you can write more about this and "fix" my mistakes..)

- reflux? happens always when vein has obstacles?

- "leaky veins" --> blood leaks through endothelial layer?

- immunesystem reaction? inflammation, white-cells, etc.

- edema? swelling?

- more common in women (CVI / CCSVI)?

- fibrinogen level (I've been quite interested with this. It relates very closely to CVI, and with google you get hits with MS too. And fibrinogen relates also to diseases like alzheimer and dementia)

- Treatment similarities --> operation, something else?

- lesions?

- etc, etc..

I would be happy to read your ideas and main points about this thing. So be free to comment. Thank you..
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Postby mrhodes40 » Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:45 am

Hi Ernst
wow this is a tall order for a post!! :wink:

The Big Idea on the research thread outlines the similarities CVI to CCSVI as far as the microbiologial findings such as the kinds of inflammatory cells involved etc. Table 1 has a comparison.

There are some differences in the dynamics between the veins in the legs known to be involved in this and the neck/chest veins associated with CCSVI. For example, the leg veins have to fight gravity, the head ones have gravity working in their favor which helps ease the situation.

I do know that it is possible to have stenosis and not have it be seen on doppler (checking for reflux) because I have severe stenosis in both jugs and normal doppler, BUT I still have evidence that it is a bad stenosis because my body had collateral circulation that disappeared when the stents were put in, as well as pressure readings that showed higher pressure on the brain side of the lesion before the stents.

I do know that increased pressure and altered shear stress results in increased leakiness of the endothelium.

The fibrinogen thing is very interesting and I am just now looking into it more because I have a coagulation issue related to high thrombin and fibrinogen....and I got a blood clot in my leg while on coumadin. Something is going on there.

A MS lesions and CVI lesion are very similar in terms of microbiological content again see the Big Idea table 1.
I hope that helps
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Re: CVI and CCSVI similarities?

Postby seabea » Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:30 am

I do not have ms but I do have ccsvi. I've had the jugular angioplasty twice on both jugulars and the azygos plus one to my kidney. My left leg tends to swell and no doctors seemed worried until yesterday when it swelled up like a balloon all the way to just above my knee and then my right leg started to swell. It was so bad I went to the er and they diagnosed me with chronic venous insufficiency. I don't do well with medical jargon so I can't understand if there's any connection between the two. I live in Texas but the doctor I see for ccsvi treatment is McGuckin in Philadelphia so it's a long way for an office visit! Are they related? Two seperate conditions? Would another angioplasty be a good option? I'm so confused and my brain is not wanting to function for me today. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated!
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Re: CVI and CCSVI similarities?

Postby Cece » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:11 am

seabea wrote:It was so bad I went to the er and they diagnosed me with chronic venous insufficiency. I don't do well with medical jargon so I can't understand if there's any connection between the two.

My understanding: Chronic Venous Insufficiency of the legs is caused by failure of the valves in the leg veins. The valves work to push blood upwards through the legs. They have to work against gravity to do this. So, when the valves fail, the blood does not easily return up the legs. Muscle contraction and leg compression stockings can try to do this job that the valves are no longer doing.

CCSVI is caused by outflow obstructions from the brain. It is a blockage of the vein.

The connection is that they are both problems with valves within the veins. The difference is that in CCSVI, the valve problem is that the valve is a solid blockage that remains closed, and in CVI, the valve has failed and remains open all the time.

Angioplasty won't help CVI, because angioplasty balloons within the vein to push the valve open, and in CVI, the problem is that the valve is open all the time.
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Re: CVI and CCSVI similarities?

Postby 1eye » Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:29 am

My understanding: you could have chronic venous insufficiency regardless of the state of valves, if for some reason you can't exercise the muscles in your ankle and foot, which are also necessary to overcome gravity. When the blood can't go back up for whatever reason, (back down, in the case of the neck) it will pool, and the lowest areas are the most vulnerable. I suspect blood that has pooled and become stagnant is more likely to have clotting problems than it is normally.

I bet in the case of above-the-heart blood, muscular pumping still works against gravity, and will contribute to insufficiency! In the absence of gravity this could become a problem... Dr. Zamboni's findings in space may clarify this.
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