nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

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nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:43 am

OK folks. some questions. if you have the time to answer, please provide your answers numbered to match the sequence below. I have tried to keep it to yes or no questions.

1. did you receive basic nutrition info growing up?
2. would you have said that your nutrition status was fine prior to dx?
3. did you consider your diet to be basically healthy prior to dx?
4. i) had you had nutrient testing before dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that answer?

5. have you experienced a learning curve related to nutrition since dx?
6. have you changed your nutrition (dietary, testing, supplement) habits since dx?
7. if yes, would you say that decision to change was connected to a post-dx learning curve?
8. i) have you had nutrient testing since dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that answer?

thx :)
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby Anonymoose » Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:52 am

jimmylegs wrote:OK folks. some questions. if you have the time to answer, please provide your answers numbered to match the sequence below. I have tried to keep it to yes or no questions.

1. did you receive basic nutrition info growing up? Yes
2. would you have said that your nutrition status was fine prior to dx? Yes
3. did you consider your diet to be basically healthy prior to dx? Yes
4. i) had you had nutrient testing before dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that answer? No

5. have you experienced a learning curve related to nutrition since dx? YES
6. have you changed your nutrition (dietary, testing, supplement) habits since dx? Yes, many times. Lol
7. if yes, would you say that decision to change was connected to a post-dx learning curve? Yes
8. i) have you had nutrient testing since dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that answer? Yes. Some normal, some not. Satisfaction depended on whether supplementing normal low nutrient resulted in improvement.

thx :)
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:25 am

thx anon - i'll have to reword question 8 to keep it backed up to the level I'm aiming for .. you appear to have answered based on a more nuanced interpretation of normal (which I love!), but I'm trying to ask a more basic question. tell me if this works better as a yes or no question?:

8 iii) for any that came back normal, were you satisfied with that answer? (ie had you changed your opinion on the value of normal results?)
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby Anonymoose » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:11 am

Jimmy, you know the answer to number 8 is too complicated!! It's all wonked up with co factors and bozos like me usually don't do things in the right order so we can't tell what is doing what. Everything has to be good except that one low nutrient in order for the layman to say "oh, that magnesium really helped! I think those normal ranges are bogus!"...and we don't test everything so we leave huge co factors out like b complex...and after we supplement the co factors and the low normal, how do we tell if it was the co factor that we just assumed to be deficient or the known low normal supplementation that has helped? Maybe the low normal is okay with adequate, typically ignored co factors.

Face it. You've gotten yourself all tied up in a huge mess. :P I'm hoping you figure it all out cuz I can't! Lol

Maybe it could be a yes, no, or I don't have a clue answer. I would answer I don't have a clue.

Edit: if you are asking if your nutritional info is of value, I would loudly proclaim "hell yeah!" or "DUH!" depending on my mood. :D
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby THX1138 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:45 am

Edit: if you are asking if your nutritional info is of value, I would loudly proclaim "hell yeah!" or "DUH!" depending on my mood. :D

Nobody would ask such a silly question. :smile:
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:59 am

still too far ahead of the game! I want ppl to go back one step - yes, we know it is more complicated (eg as a near-vegan prior to all this, you'd have a particularly rough go), but the simple question I am trying to address *should* be one that we can still answer yes or no. how about this:

8. iii) if you had a test done now and your doctor told you 'your level is normal', would you be satisfied with that finding?

where it's all coming from is this..
hypothesis: nutrition information (particularly nutrition 'education') changes behavior
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:09 pm

because I have a prof who says the null hypothesis is borne out by the evidence.
which is fine. but I would attack the methodology, not throw my hands up at the whole idea based on the findings to date.
but that's just me.
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby THX1138 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:10 pm

1. did you receive basic nutrition info growing up? ------ YES (very basic, as I now see it)

2. would you have said that your nutrition status was fine prior to dx? ------ YES, but I was ignorant.

3. did you consider your diet to be basically healthy prior to dx? ----- YES, but I was ignorant.

4. i) had you had nutrient testing before dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that answer? ----- YES / YES / YES, but I was ignorant.


5. have you experienced a learning curve related to nutrition since dx? ----- YES

6. have you changed your nutrition (dietary, testing, supplement) habits since dx? ----- YES

7. if yes, would you say that decision to change was connected to a post-dx learning curve? ----- YES

8. i) have you had nutrient testing since dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that ----- YES / YES / NO I was satisfied until I learned about the issues with the "Normal range" and had experience of being told my lab results for a particular nutrient were "Normal" despite having many obvious symptoms of a deficiency in that nutrient. Magnesium comes to mind.
The underestimated problem of using serum magnesium measurements to exclude magnesium deficiency in adults; a health warning is needed for "normal" results.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20170394
Last edited by THX1138 on Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:41 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby Anonymoose » Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:24 pm

8. No. (And I'm not going to tell you that it's just because I wouldn't let a doctor tell me my labs were normal. I'd insist upon having a copy for myself. Lol. Ooo. But I'd want a copy because I'd want to know if it was on the high end or the low end of normal...and because I know doctors sometimes fudge the truth)

Does that work?

THX1138...teacher's pet!! ;)
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:53 pm

thank you!!! (details appreciated, you just can't help yourselves can you - lol!!) (update: still laughing heheheh)
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby cheerleader » Thu Feb 06, 2014 2:10 pm

Hey JL--Jeff's on the couch next to me, in front of the fireplace. Captive respondent...here are his answers. Pretty funny :)

jimmylegs wrote:OK folks. some questions. if you have the time to answer, please provide your answers numbered to match the sequence below. I have tried to keep it to yes or no questions.

1. did you receive basic nutrition info growing up? Yes--the basic food pyramid in school.
2. would you have said that your nutrition status was fine prior to dx? Yes-- I thought it was.
3. did you consider your diet to be basically healthy prior to dx? I thought it was healthy, yes... but now I know it was terrible.
4. i) had you had nutrient testing before dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that answer? Never had nutrient testing until Joan started bothering me after dx.
5. have you experienced a learning curve related to nutrition since dx? Yes, in a big way.
6. have you changed your nutrition (dietary, testing, supplement) habits since dx? Yes, completely. Much more vegetables, less meat. Way less sugar or gluten. No more "white foods" A bunch of supplements.
7. if yes, would you say that decision to change was connected to a post-dx learning curve? Yes. That and Joan making me change.
8. i) have you had nutrient testing since dx? ii) if yes, were the results normal? iii) if yes, were you satisfied with that answer?
Yes, I've had some tested...vitamin D3, B12, zinc, mg and complete blood panel are all in normal or high normal range. Also, cholesterol and inflammation are normal now. I'm satisfied with answer, but I go more by how I feel. Joan keeps track of the numbers.
thx :)
You are welcome! Thanks to you, Jimmy.
Husband dx RRMS 3/07
dx dual jugular vein stenosis (CCSVI) 4/09
http://ccsviinms.blogspot.com
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Feb 06, 2014 4:19 pm

hahaha! thanks for those you guys! I have a big smile on :)

re question 8 - I can tell it is pretty hard to imagine hearing just the bare word 'normal' as a test result, now that we have all 'drunk the kool-aid'!!
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby Anonymoose » Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:03 pm

You've ruined us all for the purpose of your study. You will have to poll those without kool-aid smiles...are there any left???
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Re: nutrition info. any value? please post your input!

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:10 pm

yea my methodology is pretty iffy huh! I just want to say neener neener to my prof tomorrow :)
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Postby NHE » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:42 pm

jimmylegs wrote:because I have a prof who says the null hypothesis is borne out by the evidence.

Can you expand upon this idea? It doesn't compute with what I remember from my biostatistics course.
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