L-Arginine

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L-Arginine

Postby Algis » Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:01 am

I have read some on it; both here and few other places (Google it).

It is supposed to help muscle tonus.

I am starting Monday Dec.13 with 5g every 3 days. I wanted to have Pycnogenol in the same time (as they are also supposed to be a man boost) but the latest is not available right now.

Anyone tried and have comments?

Cheers and be well all :)
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Postby jackD » Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:54 am

You might want to add some VINPOCETINE to your mix and CURE your MS.

Vintocetine is the same family of "thingies" as VIAGRA. It is a phosphodiesterase type 1 (PDE1) inhibitor. VIAGRA is a phosphodiesterase type 5 (PDE5) inhibitor.

My research has revealed that ALL PDES phosphodiesterase INHIBITORS HELP ms FOLKS.

The problem is that the most effective ones PDE3s & PDE4s have terrible side effects!!!

One study in Japan showed that a combination of 3 PDEs which included Vinpocetine reduced the MS relapse rate by 58%.


Mult Scler. 2003 Dec;9(6):574-8.

Phosphodiesterase inhibitors suppress IL-12 production with microglia and T helper 1 development.

Suzumura A, Ito A, Mizuno T.

Department of Neuroimmunology, Institute of Environmental Medicine, Nagoya University, Furo-cho, Chikusa, Nagoya 464-8601, Japan. suzumura@riem.nagoya-u.ac.jp

Abstract
The effects of phosphodiesterase inhibitors (PDEIs) on interleukin (IL)-12 production by microglia, antigen-presenting cells in the central nervous system (CNS), were examined to learn how they affect T cell differentiation in the CNS.

PDEIs significantly suppressed the microglial IL-12 production, as determined by reverse transcriptase-polymerase chain reaction for IL-12 p35 and p40 mRNA expression and by an ELISA specific for IL-12 functional heterodimer, p70.

In addition, the PDEI ibudilast also suppressed interferon-gamma, but not IL-4 or IL-10, production by myelin oligodendrocyte glycoprotein (MOG)-specific T cells reactivated with MOG in the presence of microglia.

Thus, PDEIs may also suppress differentiation of T helper 1 (Th1) in the CNS. PDEIs can be of use for future therapeutic strategy to treat Th1-mediated diseases, such as multiple sclerosis.

PMID: 14664469 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Mult Scler. 1999 Apr;5(2):126-33.

Effects of phosphodiesterase inhibitors on cytokine production by microglia.
Yoshikawa M, Suzumura A, Tamaru T, Takayanagi T, Sawada M.

Department of Neurology, Nara Medical University, Kashihara, Japan.

Abstract
Type III and IV phosphodiesterase inhibitors (PDEIs) have recently been shown to suppress the production of TNF-alpha in several types of cells. In the present study, we have shown that all the types of PDEIs, from type I- to V-specific and non-specific, suppress the production of TNF-alpha by mouse microglia stimulated with lipopolysaccharide (LPS) in a dose-dependent manner.

Certain combinations of three different types of PDEIs synergistically suppressed TNF-alpha production by microglia at a very low concentration (1 microM).

Since some PDEIs reportedly pass through the blood-brain barrier (BBB), the combination of three PDEIs may be worth trying in neurological diseases, such as multiple sclerosis and HIV-related neurological diseases in which TNF-alpha may play a critical role. Some PDEIs also suppressed interleukin-I (IL-I) and IL-6 production by mouse microglia stimulated with LPS. In contrast, the production of IL-10, which is known to be an inhibitory cytokine, was upregulated by certain PDEIs.

The suppression of TNF-alpha and induction of IL-10 were confirmed at the mRNA level by RT-PCR. PDEIs may be useful anti-inflammatory agents by downregulating inflammatory cytokines and upregulating inhibitory cytokines in the central nervous system. (CNS).

PMID: 10335522 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]




Mult Scler. 2000 Feb;6(1):56-8.

Drop in relapse rate of MS by combination therapy of three different phosphodiesterase inhibitors.

Suzumura A, Nakamuro T, Tamaru T, Takayanagi T.

Department of Neurology, Nara Medical University, 840 Shijo-cho, Kashihara, Nara 634-0813, Japan.

Abstract
Phosphodiesterase inhibitors (PDEIs), when used in combination, synergistically suppress TNFalpha production by various cells and also suppress experimental demyelination at very low concentrations.

We conducted a pilot study to determine whether the combination of three PDEIs suppresses the relapse of MS at the usual therapeutic doses.

Of the 12 relapsing remitting MS, the mean relapse rate/year dropped remarkably (from 3.08+/-3.32 to 0.92+/-1.86) after PDEI treatment.

Seven out of 12 (58.3%) were relapse-free in the follow up period (499+/-142 days). The combination of three PDEIs can be safe and useful strategy for the future treatment of MS. - 58


PMID: 10694847 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Adding some Forskolin might enhance the PDE activity.

jackD

P.S. A timed release version of VIAGRA would seem to be highy desirable for MS folks as a treatment for their MS. Side effects would seem be tolerable if not desirable by many.
Last edited by jackD on Wed Dec 15, 2010 1:02 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby Algis » Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:55 am

Sounds great Jack; I will talk with the Doc when I'll see him.

I love the Viagra suggestion ( 8) ) but it might turn to be very expensive (unfortunately) hahahahahaha :lol:
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Postby Algis » Tue Dec 28, 2010 12:22 am

I (finally) got the Pycnogenol today. Started with 100mg/day caps.

L-Arginine seems to help the tonus (dixit my wife) - As she need to help me for the transfer wheelchair <=> bed she probably knows better than I.

Now; I am only taking 5,000mg (5g) divided in 3 days ~1,666mg daily at noon; but what I read is that it shall be taken 5,000 mg per day (3 times more?).

I am waiting for a cheaper version as the one I could get was pretty expensive :P

More as it come.

(*) Vinpocetine not found yet.
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CAUTION!!!! on taking L-Arginine

Postby jackD » Tue Dec 28, 2010 6:32 pm

Algis wrote:I (finally) got the Pycnogenol today. Started with 100mg/day caps.

L-Arginine seems to help the tonus (dixit my wife) - As she need to help me for the transfer wheelchair <=> bed she probably knows better than I.

Now; I am only taking 5,000mg (5g) divided in 3 days ~1,666mg daily at noon; but what I read is that it shall be taken 5,000 mg per day (3 times more?).

I am waiting for a cheaper version as the one I could get was pretty expensive

More as it come.

(*) Vinpocetine not found yet.


I would caution you AGAINST taking L-Arginine supplements.

The reason is that the amino acid Arginine can activate dormant Herpes Virusus.

You also should decrease eating those foods high in L-Arginine (an amino acid that supports the herpes virus).

I have found numerous reports like this...

I started taking L-Arginine @ 1g/day, planning to go to 3g/day.

But I got a breakout on my lips something awful, what appears to be a
dormant herpes-simplex virus that first surfaced four years ago -
normally it comes out with too much sun exposure - tends to dampen the
potential for romance... :-(

I presume the L-Arginine is the cause.


Below is a summary of the Herpes family of viruses. I think they ALL can set us up for MS or cause a "flair". This is my summary and I hope it is correct.

Herpes simplex virus HSV-1 Oral herpes(fever
blisters)

Herpes simplex virus HSV-2 Genital herpes

Varicella-zoster virus(VZV) Chickenpox, shingles

Epstein-Barr virus(EBV) Infectious
mononucleosis

Cytomegalovirus(CMV) "Mono-like" illness,
Infections in Immune-compromised patients

Human herpesvirus-6 HHV-6 Roseola, "mono-like"
illness ----Possible MS and chronic fatigue syndrome

Human herpesvirus-7 HHV-7 "Mono-like" illness,
pityriasis rosea

Human herpesvirus-8 HHV-8 Kaposi's sarcoma

I hope it helps clarify this subject.

I took VALTREX 500 mg for over 10 years. Pycnogenol has a strong antiviral effect when taken at 200 mg per day. I believe Quercetin also helps greatly.


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Postby Algis » Tue Dec 28, 2010 8:22 pm

Thank you :) I will investigate but so far have no side effects to report.
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arginine improves endothelial function

Postby hwebb » Thu Dec 30, 2010 12:28 am

arginine is known to improve endothelial health:

http://www.healthtechmall.com/physician-reference/dr-john-p-cooke-cardiovascular-expert/

I say go for it!
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Postby Algis » Thu Dec 30, 2010 1:02 am

Thank you hwebb - I have to report that I feel ok. I have no (yet?) flashing advantages but I think I have a bit more tonus (of course nothing enough yet for me to say it is noticeable - It also might be 'in my mind')

I like the 'endothelial' theory.

More as it come, be well :)
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endothelial health

Postby hwebb » Thu Dec 30, 2010 1:25 am

the guy earned a Nobel prize for his research on endothelial health, and discovery that it can make its own medicine if it's fed right:

In 1998, the Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine was awarded for the discovery of EDRF (endothelium-derived relaxing factor), a chemical produced in the lining of the blood vessels, which keeps them free of plaque. Dr. Cooke and other investigators have found that specific nutrients can enhance EDRF production and improve blood flow in people with high cholesterol, high blood pressure, diabetes, or other risk factors for heart disease.

Here's some food sources of the nutrient, if supplements are proving too expensive:

http://www.dietaryfiberfood.com/larginine-high.php
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Postby suze » Thu Dec 30, 2010 11:28 pm

I have considered taking it because of its potential to increase endothelial health but my reservation is that it also stimulates the production of T cells.

http://www.anyvitamins.com/arginine-info.htm
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Postby Algis » Sat Jan 08, 2011 3:54 am

So far so good :?: It does not make me run; but I think it help staying alert (or kind of...)

Arginine + Pycnogenol
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Postby Algis » Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:19 am

I am feeling ok - So I'll start my 5,000mg/daily of L-Arginine tomorrow (3X more) and will report.
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Postby lyndacarol » Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:20 pm

There are several entries dealing with L-arginine from The Dr. Oz Show website:

Dr. Joseph Mercola mentioned it 1/18/11:

http://www.droz.com/videos/alternative- ... versy-pt-3

2/20/11-- I just tried to use the link above and got the message that it could not be found; this puzzles me. I went back to the show website and found this one: http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/alternat ... versy-pt-3 it seems to work.


But I found the following information especially interesting in answer to the question, "How does L-arginine work?" (The emphasis in bold lettering is mine.):

http://www.sharecare.com/question/how-d ... rtner=droz

Discovery Health Answered: Usually, the human body produces enough of the amino acid L-arginine.

But not always. Sometimes, because of a traumatic injury or liver disease, the body cannot make enough.

But it needs L-arginine. So it is considered a semi-essential amino acid.

This is what L-arginine can do for you. It helps the body produce urea, the end result of when your body breaks down proteins and what you eliminate when you urinate. The body needs urea because it helps eliminate the excess nitrogen produced when proteins are broken down. L-arginine also assists in the body's production of creatine, which is a protein that helps build muscle mass. L-arginine also helps the body eliminate creatinine, which is the waste product of building muscle mass. These are the reasons, by the way, that the bodybuilding industry trumpets creatine and L-arginine supplements.

You can obtain additional L-arginine as a natural supplement, by inhaling it or injecting it.

As a medicine, L-arginine is considered a vasodilator, which means that it dilates blood vessels. That means more blood flows, which lowers blood pressure and can, in certain instances, help the body cope with arterial blockages from conditions like atherosclerosis.


1. The mention of the liver makes me wonder again about the involvement of metabolic syndrome.

2. Could the mention of urea tie in to jimmylegs' suspicions? On another page is the information, "Sometimes the body has trouble eliminating waste due to problems with the production of a substance called urea. Enter L-arginine. It can restore ureic harmony."

3. And of course, "vasodilator" is often found on the CCSVI forum.

As in the Hindu fable, I think we are each examining different parts of the "elephant."
Last edited by lyndacarol on Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby jimmylegs » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:21 pm

i wondered if there could be a connection between the healthy liver's ability to produce l-arginine, and zinc status. went searching. found this..

http://jn.nutrition.org/content/105/1/26.short
"The amount of urea excretion of zinc deficient rats was approximately 42 and 87% more than that of zinc-supplemented pairfed and ad lihitum-fed rats, respectively. Zinc-deficient rats also showed significantly higher excretion of uric acid. ... Further studies demonstrated that zinc deficient
rats had increased activities of liver tryptophan pyrrolase and arginase."

to me that starts to look like zinc deficiency increases the (rat's) body's l-arginine requirement due to increased action of arginase and then you get the associated clearance of urea and uric acid. interesting facet, LC!

ps i monitor my zinc status at the lab sometimes. in between, i use my libido as an indicator. if i'm indifferent, i probably need to take some zinc!

also i guess like most other things, you can have too little or too much of a good thing. but just FYI, zinc is antiviral too :D
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Postby LR1234 » Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:20 am

Jack, quick question....How did the valtrex work for you? you were on it for 10 years so you must have felt it was doing something???
I am interested in antivirals and would consider taking them.

I used to eat a lot of L'arginine in nuts and I think its in chocolate??? but I def don't react well to it. (or it could be something else in nuts and chocolate)

I was actually taking L-Lysine for a long time and I think this lowers L'arginine but I can't say I felt any better for it.

L
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