Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

This is the place to ask questions if you have symptoms that suggest MS, but aren't yet diagnosed.

Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby Jewels70 » Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:59 am

Hi everyone,

I am 41 year old female. I have not been diagnosed, I’m still trying to find out what is going on with me. On May 7th I received 2 vaccines Hep B and Tetanus. Prior to that I was having some Heart palpations for about a month. This was my second bout with them as about 3 years ago I experienced the for a short while.
On May 12, or 13th I woke up at night having chest pain in the center that moved to the left under the breast. My arms were somewhat tingling and numb like they fell asleep, but not really bad pins an needles just slight. It subsided and I went back to sleep. For the next few days I experienced more pins and needles in arms, shoulders , and fingers stronger in the pinky and ring fingers. I also had pain in my arms they just hurt to hold up and type at work. I though carpel tunnel. About 5 days after my first symptoms I went to the ER because I started thinking it was my heart. Besides the arms continuing to ache, i had pain way on the left side where I might think my spleen would be. I also had strange sensations in my throat. Like my esophagus was opening or tightening and a burning sensation deeper down almost like hot gases were coming up. The ER took blood did an x-ray, ekg and gave me some antacids. Said everything looked ok.

My arm pain continued with the pins and needles coming and going. Bee sting sensations shock pains and pain I’m my muscles that ached. Upon waking up my knuckles would feel tight like my hand were swollen but they didn’t look swollen. One day my triceps were burning all day long. I had one night my entire face went numb. Most days in the beginning my neck was stiff and hurt as did my shoulders. Then one night I had awaken to pins and needles in just my thumb and a part of the pad of my hand. I was not lying on that arm at all. Upon shaking my hand it turned into a burning sensation. Then it subsided. My arm pains would typically not be there or be too bad in the mornings and develop over the day. At night sometimes they were pretty uncomfortable.

After about 4 weeks of this on and off always different daily, my legs went to pins and needles from the foot to the knee. This lasted all day and was accompanied by stiffness in the front part of the lower legs. The next morning it was gone. Some days my arms were feeling like I had lead strapped to them they were so heavy to move around. I had been noticing that while doing laundry one flight of stars made my legs burn like the lactic acid burn from exercising. I have a muscle that feels soar and has for the entire time since the shots, but I am not sure if it appeared before them, because at that time I was working out every day. I just noticed that it doesn’t go away.

I also noticed about 4 weeks ago that upon raising my arms to head level from my sides the moment is smooth but upon lowering them it is jerky. I also have throat pain that comes and goes sometimes it feels numb sometimes it feels dry even though its not. Sometimes it hurts like a muscle cramp in the back of my tongue and sometimes I get an ache in my throat. Just this past Sunday I experienced my right eye jerking back and forth so that everything was moving very fast, I couldn’t duplicate it if I tried, it was only a few seconds but it was very scary. I also had a sensation of heat in the back of my thigh today for a few seconds.

Since this started I have not had as much pins and needles but still have it occasionally with occasional pains here and there. I also started having muscle twitching all over not constant but here ant there in any of my muscle including eyelid sometimes. That has been for the past few weeks. The thing that bothers me most now is my throat and my shoulders are achy and shaky. I have some soar muscles that don’t seem to stop being soar and I haven’t done anything strenuous in the last 7 weeks.

I’m really sorry to make this so long. I will just say that I have had Two MRIs cervical and brain without contrast showing nothing except a tiny bulge in my C5. My blood work including two Lyme tests at 2.5 weeks and 4.5 weeks of symptoms have been negative. I have no deficiencies in my vitamins. My neurologist examination said my reflexes are +3 all over and I have Hoffman’s reflex. Those were the only thing I see that were noted as abnormal. I saw my Neurologist on the 7th of June and don’t go back until the 12th of July. I tried to get back for more tests because of all the new symptoms and he was on vacation and the other doctors didn’t want to do anything for me.

One last thing to mention I’m not sure but, about 6 years ago my arms were hurting me with the same aches I had in the beginning of this. I thought I was on the computer too much and it wasn’t ergonomically correct. I don’t recall pins and needles but defiantly the aches. It subsided with rest from the PC. Before that while giving birth to my son my arms hands and face went numb. As soon as he was born it stopped. Also one day I was in the sun all day at a double header baseball game and on the way home I had numbness in my arms and hands. I attributed it to the sun and heat, perhaps dehydration. It went away.

Just threw that in there because I just don’t know I live in CT the Lyme state. I was gardening a lot and going in the woods before this happened. I pulled ticks off of me during the symptoms but not before. I also have been bit by mosquitoes prior to symptoms. My regular doctor put me on amoxicillin pending my Lyme tests but I convinced her to give me the full 30 days for Lyme. I’m about 2.5 weeks into them now.

Does any of this sound like it could be MS to anyone? I’m terrified I will lose my arms and voice functions and be unable to do anything all my means of communicating will be taken away. I want to be able to take care of my 10 year old son. Please tell me what your thoughts are, is this how anyone else started out?
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby jimmylegs » Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:54 pm

hi jewel welcome to the forum. there's no definitive test for ms, so while some of what you're dealing with *could* be ms, you have to get through all the diagnostic hoops for the docs to have a reasonable level of certainty that you fit the profile. part of the process is ruling out other things that it might be, other than ms.

may i ask which vitamin levels you've had done? and, if you have your own copy, would you be comfortable sharing the levels? the 'normal' ranges can be suspect.. also, have you had any mineral levels done? uric acid? lipid profile? all good info from a nutritional perspective.
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby Jewels70 » Mon Jul 02, 2012 4:29 pm

I have all my blood work here and dont mind sharing.

This was done without fasting my fist blood work 5/16/12

Cholesterol total 171 Range 125-200 MG/dL
Triglycerides 75 Range <150 Mg/dL
comprehensive metabolic panel glucose 93 Range 65-99 mg/dL
Urea nitrogen (bun) 12 Range 7-25 mg/dL
Creatine 0.72 Range 0.50-1.10 mg/dL
@GFR Non-AFR. American 104 Range > or = 60 mL/min/1.732m2 Im not african American Not sure i understand this test
@GFR African American 121 Range > or = 60 mL/min/1.732m2
sodium 140 Range 135-146 mmol/L
Potassium 4.3 Range 3.5-5.3 mmol/L
Chloride 105 Range 98-110 mmol/L
Carbon Dioxide 22 Range 21-33 mmol/L
Calcium 9.3 Range 8.6-10.2 mg/dL
Protien, Total 7.9 range 6.2-8.3 g/dL
Albumin 4.7 range 3.6 - 5.1 g/dL
Globulin 3.2 Range 2.2-3.9 g/dL (calc)
Albumin/Globulin Ratio 1.5 Range 1.0-2.1 (calc)
Bilirubin, tatal 0.5 Range 0.2-1.2 mg/dL
Alkaline phosphatase 43 Range 33-115 U/L
AST 16 Range 10-30 U/L
ALT 11 Range 6-40 U/L
Vitamin d, 25 OH total 31 Range 30-100 Ng/ml (this looks borderline to me but they didnt mention it to me)
Vitamin D 25 OH D3 25
Vitamin D 25 OH, D2 6
Phosphate 3.6 Range 2.5-4.5 mg/dL
Uric Acid 3.6 range 2.5-7.0 mg/dL
Bilirubin, Direct 0.1 range <or = .02 mg/dL
LD 157 range 100-200 U/L
GGT 11 Range 3-55 U/L
TSH w/reflex to FT4 1.52 Range > or - 20 years 0.40-4.50
Iron total 76 Range 40-175 mcg/dL

Collected fasting on 6-13-12:

Gluecose 81 range 65-99

Protein total and prtein electrophoresis:
Protien total 7.0 range 6.2-8.3 mg/dL
Albumin 4.0 range 3.5-4.7 g/dL
Alpha-1-globulins .02 range .1-.03 g/dL
Alpha-2-globulins .6 range .5-1.0 g/dL
Beta Globulins 1.0 range .8-1.4 g/dL
Gamma Globulins 1.1 range .06-1.6 g/dL

normal pattern

Random Urine test:
Protein total and protein electrophoresis, random urine protein total w/creat:
Creatine random urine 113 range 20-320 mg/dL
protein / creatine ratio 44 range 21-161 mg/g creat
protien 5 range 5-24 mg/dL
albumin 0
alpha 1 globuins 0
alpha 2 0
beta globulins 0
gama globulins 0
Noraml pattern

Arsenic None detected

creatine random urine 111.2 range 20-320 mg/dL
copper 93 ragne 70-175 mcg/dL
angiotensin converting enzyme 29 range 9-67 U/L

Vitamin B1, plasma pending ----I forgot to check on my peinding tests!

Vitamin e (Tocopherol) Pending
Methylmalonic Acid 120 range 87-318 nmol/L
mercury serum/plasma pending
Vit B-6 pending
Sed rate by modified westergren 6 range < or = 20 mm/h

cbc (includes diff/plt)
white blood cell count 4.8 range 3.8-10.8 thousand u/L
red 4.31 range 3.80-5.10 million /uL
hemoglobin 13.1 11.7-15.5 g/dL
hematocrit 39.0 range 35-45%
MCV 90.4 range 80-100 fl
MCH 30.3 range27-33 pg
mchc 33.5 range 32-36 g/dL
RDW 12.8 range 11.0-15%
platlet ct 226 range 140-400 th / U/L
MPV 9.1 range 7.5-11.5 fL
absolute neutrophils 2294 ragne 1500-7800 cells u/L
absolute lymphocytes 1886 ragne 850-3900
absolute monocytes 427 range 200-950
absolute esoinophils 173 range 155-500
absoulte basophils 19 range 0-200
Neutrophils 47%
lymphocytes 39.3%
monocytes 8.9%
eosinophils 3.6%
basophils .4%

vit b12 706 range 200-1100 pg/mL
folate serum 14.3 range <3.4 low, 3.4-5.4 borderline >5.4 normal

Lyme negative if under 0.90 there is not number on it just says < or =.090

ANA IFA screen w/refl to titer and pattern IFA ANA screen
Ceruloplasmin 26 Negitive range for neg. 18-53 mg/dL
Normal pattern no monoclonal protiens detected.

SM and SM/RNP antibodies <1.0 neg
Sjogren's Antibodies (SSA SSB) <1.0 Neg
Lead blood <3 Range <10 mcg/dL

The ER took some blood as well. I have yet to get a copy. I also will try to remember to get my peding work. I have an appointment with a Rheumatist tomorrow so hopfully he can figure out some other tests I can take while I wait for the neurlogist.
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby jimmylegs » Mon Jul 02, 2012 5:33 pm

now THAT, my new friend, is what i like.

i'm going to zone in on some specifics..

let's start with that 'total vit d3' result of 31. you're certainly right to look more closely at that one.

the number you're most interested in for useful comparison to other research, is the 25(OH)vit d3, the 25 ng/ml result.

in SI units that works out to 62 nmol/L. that's not even good enough to prevent elevated PTH, osteoporosis, etc. for that you want to be at least in the 70s or 80s, and if you buy the three decades of scientific literature on the relevance of vit d3 to the immune system, then you want to aim for more like 125-150 nmol/L, which would be 50-60 ng/ml, or at *least* double your current level.

uric acid 3.6 mg/dL, that works out to 214 umol/L. using the SI units, the average level for a relapsing ms patient is in the 160s, average overall is in the 190s, and in remission ms patients have been found to have uric acid levels in the 230s. healthy controls uric acid levels are up around 290-300 umol/L. in your units, that means you're aiming for more like 4.9 mg/dL if you want to match healthy controls in research.

i'm interested in your iron status, but i'd rather see serum ferritin as a first approximation, and possibly some other associated tests.

copper looks a smidge on the low side, i worked on nailing down a healthy controls number for this and it was close to 18 umol/L. your 93 ug/dL works out to 14.6 umol/L. for you that means aim for 115 ug/dL.

i'll be interested to see your vit B1, vit B6 and vit E results when they come in.

hemoglobin is borderline. klenner protocol for ms (an oldie from the 1970s, but containing very useful tidbits) specifies minimum hemoglobin level of 13.

your b12 number is excellent. folate is not one i have as much experience with, but given the range provided it certainly doesn't look low, by any means.

and so, that's what i have for you at present. i'm very impressed with the amount of nutritional work done, regardless of whether it's been properly interpreted or not, this is fantastic data to have available!

if you can get them to run you a serum zinc test, that will be fundamental. i'm betting it will be on the low side. if it is and you fix it, it will probably fix the uric acid level automatically, and triple your body's capacity to utilize vitamin d3.

i suspect iron status could be part of the picture too, so if you can get a serum ferritin rather than just total iron, that would be great.

if i can add one more test to the wish list, it would be a serum magnesium test.

serum zinc, serum ferritin, serum magnesium, then you will have the info needed to develop the most useful plan for your individual scenario.

if you need to figure out where i'm coming from with this approach, you can check out my 'signature' links below for additional reading.
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby lyndacarol » Mon Jul 02, 2012 6:48 pm

And, Jewels, if I could "add one more test to the wish list, it would be " a fasting serum insulin test:

Factor # 1 : Your Insulin Level
Insulin is absolutely essential to staying alive, but the sad fact is that most of you reading this have too much floating around, and it is pushing you towards chronic degenerative illness and increasing the rate at which you age.
Most adults have about one gallon of blood in their bodies and are quite surprised to learn that in that gallon, there is only one teaspoon of sugar! You only need one teaspoon of sugar at all times -- if that. If your blood sugar level were to rise to one tablespoon of sugar you would quickly go into a hyperglycemic coma and die.
You body works very hard to prevent this by producing insulin to keep your blood sugar at the appropriate level. Any meal or snack high in grain and sugar carbohydrates typically generates a rapid rise in blood glucose. To compensate for this your pancreas secretes insulin into your bloodstream, which lowers your blood sugar to keep you from dying.
However, if you consume a diet consistently high in sugar and grains, over time your body becomes "sensitized" to insulin and requires more and more of it to get the job done. Eventually, you become insulin resistant, and then diabetic.
If you have high cholesterol, high blood pressure, type 2 diabetes, or are overweight, it is highly likely that you are eating too many grains -- yes, even unrefined whole grains -- as this is the most common culprit causing your insulin level to become abnormal.
Compounding the problem, when your insulin levels rise due to an excess of carbohydrates, they send your body a hormonal message telling it to store fat while holding on to the fat that is already there. So not only will excess carbohydrates make you overweight, they will effectively hamper your weight loss efforts too.
Your Fasting Blood Insulin Test
To find out your insulin levels, you need to get tested by your doctor. The test you need to ask for is a fasting blood insulin test, The test is done by just about every commercial laboratory and is relatively inexpensive.
Facts about Your Fasting Insulin Test:
• This test is profoundly useful. It's one of the least expensive tests in traditional medicine, yet it is one of the most powerful. A normal fasting blood insulin level is below 5, but ideally you'll want to be below 3.
• You can safely ignore the reference ranges from the lab as they are based on "normals" of a population that has highly-disturbed insulin levels.
• This is a great test to do BEFORE you start your program as you can use it to assess how well you are progressing in the program.
• If your level is above 5 you will want to consider significantly reducing most sugars and grains, even whole wheat grains, until you lower your level. Once you've normalized your insulin level you can reintroduce grains into your diet at a lower level to optimize your health.
• Exercise is of enormous benefit in improving the sensitivity of your insulin receptors, and help normalize your insulin level far more quickly.

The optimum level is below 3 UU/ML. Mine has never been below 9.
My hypothesis: excess insulin (hyperinsulinemia) plays a major role in MS, as developed in my initial post: "Insulin – Could This Be the Key?"
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby jimmylegs » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:32 am

insulin response is certainly secondary to dietary inputs, and for optimal functionality depends on zinc status

Effect of Zinc Supplementation on Markers of Insulin Resistance, Oxidative Stress, and Inflammation among Prepubescent Children with Metabolic Syndrome
"in both groups, significant decrease was documented for Apo B/ApoA-I ratio, ox-LDL, leptin and malondialdehyde, total and LDL-cholesterol after receiving zinc without significant change after receiving placebo. In groups, hs-CRP and markers of insulin resistance decreased significantly after receiving zinc, but increased after receiving placebo. In both groups, the mean body mass index (BMI) Z-score remained high, after receiving zinc, the mean weight, BMI, BMI Z-score decreased significantly, whereas these values increased after receiving placebo."

LC how were your zinc levels at last test? have you had serum zinc done lately? or magnesium, while i'm asking?
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby Jewels70 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:05 am

Hi again,

I have those others back now:

vit b 1 plasma 18 range 9-44 nmol/L
vit E (Tocopherol)
alpha- tocopherol 8.3 range 5.7-19.9 mg/L
beta -gamma-Tocopherol 1.8 Range <=4.3 mg/L

Mecury none detected

I havent had time to look at anything from your links yet, but I am intrested in do so. I am just having a bad day, some days are better than others.

Thank you for your responses.
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby jimmylegs » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:41 am

hi there! i have to do some reading to come up with some good target numbers for serum thiamine, alpha tocopherol and ..(beta-gamma?) tocopherol. i've heard of beta tocopherol and gamma tocopherol, perhaps that's a combined fraction?? anyway. looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the other info above too, re vit d3 etc. hope you feel better soon!
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby Jewels70 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:41 pm

Hi everyone, Thank you for all of your input.
Jimmylegs, its all very interesting, I am willing to try anything to see if I can start feeling better. Since I started feeling bad, I have been trying to figure out what I might have and I have been talking with people on CIDP, and GBS message boards as well. One person I spoke to advised me to take vitamin supplements, D3. B-12 sublingual, B-100, I also got some Magnesium, Zinc, Calcium supplements. The amounts they recommended I take were a little scary to me so I have only been taking a fraction of what they recommended. I didn’t take anything prior to my blood draw a few weeks ago. I picked them up at CVS, and after reading your blog I see they are not the type you recommend.
I’m not sure if they help or not, as one day I won’t have too much discomfort and others it’s all over the place. I’m defiantly interested in knowing how your diet and supplementation has been making you feel.
As for getting any more blood tests, I will have to try to ask my neurologist. I’m pretty upset with that group because upon my fist and only visit my arms were my main problem with some fatigue in my leg muscles. The neurologist told me to call if my symptoms increase. Well I had a really bad night that freaked my out so I called the next day. He was on vacation and none of the other neurologists wanted to see me or at least orders some tests to see if they could figure out anything. I have called to see if they could get me in to him sooner, but they tell me he’s full. Today I called to see if he could order any other tests and his assistant said he’s not going to do any more test s at this time. I have not had a never conduction test, only a physical with reflexes and that was before I had all these new symptoms! After I got upset, they finally said he will do the never conduction test on the 12th when I come in.
I have an appointment with a neurologist from a teaching hospital in late September but the time is dragging on so slowly when I feel like hell. I’m afraid if I ask for any blood work the neurologist will think I’m crazy, I think they must already think it as to how many times I have called their office for either test results or to get in faster. I don’t understand why they act so heartless. I also see that it’s impossible to find a neurologist that isn’t booked up to a month to a few months out.
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby jimmylegs » Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:19 pm

hi again j :) i know what you mean re having a frustrating time with the docs! but, the good news is you have SO MUCH great info to start with, and a precedent set for testing so that you can follow up with a tiny fraction of the tests you've already had done, hopefully without coming across as too much of a pest. (i know i've done my time on that path, at one point i got asked not to call my doc's office pestering re tests and results - i'm out of the 'doghouse' now and allowed to call again).

anyway. you don't have a dx, but you do have some symptoms, and some bloodwork that is telling, therefore useful.

next steps: what have you been taking each day, ie the supplement forms, doses, and timing? what sort of doses were people recommending on other boards?
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby lyndacarol » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:29 pm

Jewels, if you find resistance from your neurologist and his office, contact your GP or internist (or an endocrinologist) and ask for the fasting blood insulin test (it is one of the least expensive blood tests) and any other blood tests that have been recommended to you.

If you are confident and persistent and calmly ask, I would expect your GP would be willing to work with you and order the test. As a last resort, you can find out what the lab charges for the test and, if you are able, you can offer to pay it out of your own pocket – I think that will make the point that you are serious about wanting the test. All the best to you.
My hypothesis: excess insulin (hyperinsulinemia) plays a major role in MS, as developed in my initial post: "Insulin – Could This Be the Key?"
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby Jewels70 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 12:55 pm

I've been taking 2000 IU. Vitimin D. I got b12 2500 sublingual, but was afraid this was too high so didn't start taking it yet. And a calcium magnisieim zinc supplement Which only contains 33% of daily value. I only take one each. I have also been taking b100. I don't have it in front of me now so I can't say the dosage. Sorry you'll have to bear with me I'm typing on my phone. It's a pain. I was told by a woman whose mother had myasthernia gravis to take 10000.00 iu of vit. D. As well as the B12. I have to look for her email. I don't think she mentioned to take the zink magnesium or calcium. I just grabbed that one on my own. I would love some advice. I'm only about 115lbs so I didn't want to overdose myself on vitimins. Some days I skip the separate pills and take a women's multi from gnc. As I an getting freaked out when those pillls get stuck in my throat.

By the way. I had my first ever migraine that lasted 12 hours before I went to the ER yeaterday morning. My head was pounding the lights hurt my eyes. My face and teeth hurt and my throat hurt, I could hear my heart beat somtimes i my left ear. It was awful! They gave me an IV with a pain killer and that took it away. I'm wondering if this could have to do with taking the vitiman D3 without enough magnesium? I take the vitimins at night after I eat and it seems I have some bad nights. Just wondering if this could be why or would it be that way anyway? I took a multi last night and had a good night. Except I took Benadryl cause I'm having so much trouble falling asleep.
Last edited by Jewels70 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby Jewels70 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:17 pm

Ok the B-100 supplement
contains B1 100 mg
b2 100 mgNiacin 100 mg
b-6 100 mg (as pyridoxine hydrochloride)
Folic acid 400 mcg
B12 100mcg
biotin 100 mcg
pantohenic acid 100 mg

The GNC vitmin I take somtimes is Womens ultra mega active supplement. It takes two tablest for a serving, I only noticed that now so i have only been taking half a serving the days I took that. There are a lot of vitimins in this one so I wont list them.

Ill be checking back.
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby jimmylegs » Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:08 pm

sorry to hear about your migraine, sounds so nasty :S

as for your supps, the b100 is good, same with the d3 - but you have to take adequate amounts of magnesium and zinc for sure. if you have enough calcium and magnesium on board you shouldn't be having trouble trying to get to sleep. and the throat can be affected by poor magnesium status too. i know all about that personally, it's freaking scary.

i used to take higher dose d3, but now i take around 5000 IU a couple times a week. i work outside, and i take zinc so it helps my levels stay high in spite of lower intakes. i used to need to take super high doses before when i was zinc deficient. now i absorb d3 three times better, so i can only take one third as much or i might get too much in my system. too much vit d3 is no good!

for timing, you'd be better off dividing things up through the day. try this:

breakfast: b100 and a cal-mag-zinc (b-vitamins give you energy, not necessarily the best idea for bedtime)
lunch: 2000 IU d3 and a cal-mag-zinc
dinner: a cal-mag-zinc

on the days you just take the GNC multi, make sure you take both of them to get the suggested serving size. the forms are not the best available, but it's a decent product.

can you tell me what form of mag is in that cal-mag-zn product? magnesium oxide i'm guessing (same as in the GNC multi)? if so, it's not the most absorbable form. there are far more beneficial ones out there. while you're finishing up the current product, you could try keeping an eye out for some new forms of magnesium, namely, magnesium glycinate, and magnesium citrate. you could take glycinate with breakfast and lunch, and take magnesium citrate before bed, by itself.

hope that helps!
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Re: Please tell me what you think about my symptoms

Postby Jewels70 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:15 pm

Yes you are correct it is the magnesium oxide in both. I have will look for the ones you suggest. My goal is to start feeling better so I will try anything. What do you think about the B-12 sublingual 2500 mcg? I feel I should have bought a lower dose. Do you think it's too much?
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