Bloodwork - Zinc & Magnesium

[pushingForward]

Just got some blood work done to check my hormone levels and I asked to also include Zinc and Magnesium (based on many posts here). Here are the results; I would love to hear any feedback (I'm looking at you Jimmylegs ). BTW, I am a 40 year old male.

Magnesium - 2.0 MG/DL
Zinc - 76 MCG/DL
Hormonal Profile
Testosterone, Bioavailable - 36.62 NG/DL (5.41%)
Testosterone, Free - 15.63 PG/ML (0.23%)
Testosterone, Total - 677 NG/DL
Estradiol - <11.8 PG/ML


PS - Here are results of blood work from a couple of months ago that has the tests my neuro usually orders. The low WBC is likely related to the Avonex I am taking (for over 10 years now) and we are keeping an eye on it:

Name Value
BASOPHILS 0.8
TSH 0.86
MONOCYTES 11.2
EOSINOPHILS 1.6
NEUTROPHILS 45.3
LYMPHOCYTES 41.1
ABSOLUTE BASOPHILS 30 cells/uL
ABSOLUTE EOSINOPHILS 59 cells/uL
ABSOLUTE LYMPHOCYTES 1521 cells/uL
ABSOLUTE MONOCYTES 414 cells/uL
MPV 9.8 fL
ABSOLUTE NEUTROPHILS 1676 cells/uL
PLATELET COUNT 190 Thousand/uL
RDW 12.7 %
MCHC 34.1 g/dL
MCV 97.6 fL
MCH 33.3 pg
HEMATOCRIT 42.7 %
HEMOGLOBIN 14.6 g/dL
RED BLOOD CELL COUNT 4.37 Million/uL
WHITE BLOOD CELL COUNT 3.7 Thousand/uL
ALT 25 U/L
AST 17 U/L
ALKALINE PHOSPHATASE 54 U/L
BILIRUBIN, TOTAL 0.4 mg/dL
GLOBULIN 2.2 g/dL (calc)
ALBUMIN/GLOBULIN RATIO 2.1 (calc)
ALBUMIN 4.6 g/dL
PROTEIN, TOTAL 6.8 g/dL
CARBON DIOXIDE 27 mmol/L
CALCIUM 9.7 mg/dL
CHLORIDE 104 mmol/L
SODIUM 141 mmol/L
POTASSIUM 4.3 mmol/L
BUN/CREATININE RATIO NOT APPLICABLE
eGFR AFRICAN AMERICAN 119 mL/min/1.73m2
eGFR NON-AFR. AMERICAN 102 mL/min/1.73m2
CREATININE 0.93 mg/dL
UREA NITROGEN (BUN) 15 mg/dL
GLUCOSE 82 mg/dL
VITAMIN D, 25-OH, D3 54 ng/mL
VITAMIN D, 25-OH, TOTAL 54 ng/mL
VITAMIN D, 25-OH, D2 <4 ng/mL

[jimmylegs]

hey there, nice job getting these results!

aim for 2.7 with the magnesium, and go for 120 with the zinc.

your d3 is fine at 54 (doesn't look like there's any trouble with the calcium either) - but you'd be in better shape overall if you could get those other minerals caught up to match.

re next steps. . can I have a refresher on your typical daily food and fluid intake? also any supplements and meds you might currently be taking?

[pushingForward]

Thanks for the quick reply!

I am on a (mostly) paleo diet. I completely avoid gluten and try to eat as many unprocessed, natural foods as possible. I try to minimize sugar and dairy. I do a lot of shopping at Trader Joe's and try to stay with grass fed beef, wild fish, and organic products. Other than morning coffee, I typically drink water, although I probably need more of it. I probably have about 32 oz. a day. Also have 2-4 glasses of red wine a week, usually on Fri and/or Sat night.

A typical day might look like this:
-A smoothie in the morning made with coconut water, frozen mangoes, frozen blueberries, ground flax and some kale (all from TJ's), also a cup of coffee with organic honey, coconut oil and kerrygold butter
-A salad at lunch with mixed greens, spinach, various veggies, chicken and oil & vinegar
-Dinner varies, but typically it is some type of meat (fish, buffalo, chicken) with fresh veggies and an occasional sweet potato

As far as supplements, I take 5,000 IU of D3 and 2,400 mg of fish oil every morning, and 250 mg of Magnesium about 3 times a week (just started this about a month ago).

Currently on Avonex - 1x a week, but considering a switch to Tecfidera based on what I am hearing.

thanks again!

[THX1138]

Absorbing Mg through the skin is a far superior way to get Mg. The GI tract is not involved this way.

THX1138

[jimmylegs]

and thank YOU for the prompt details ;D

GOOD PLAN re unprocessed natural foods. organic is even better. love the grass fed beef, game, wild fish, and chicken. can't hurt to avoid gluten, especially since your zinc and mag are low.

re dietary magnesium..
see if you can inject some more variety in the way of nuts and seeds. say 1/4c per day total.
how would you feel about a weekly batch of brown/wild rice?
also, could be a good idea to intensify the dark leafy greens - I try to go through three bunches of greens a week - one kale (steamed 5min), one chard (boiled 3 min), one spinach (boiled 1 min). the cooking lets you drain off the oxalic acid that would otherwise be trouble with such a high volume of dark leafies.. I am overdue for a big spinach feta pie think I just came up with a plan for tomorrow's dinner!

re dietary zinc
think you can increase zinc-rich foods, like shellfish, liver, venison, pumpkin/squash seeds and so on?
I am terrible when it comes to shellfish, but I did just have two nice little venison sausages for lunch, with a side of quinoa tabbouleh salad om nom nom!

re supplements
-what form of mag are you taking? I'd say take a magnesium every time you take d3, and then another one besides (at a different time). it depends if it's mag oxide though. 500mg could be a bit much for that form.
-if you end up looking at a zinc supplement to get a short term boost, choose something like solaray copper zinc (it's 50mg zinc and 2mg copper - good ratio)
-fish oil sounds good! what's the epa to dha breakdown?

[pushingForward]

Thanks jimmylegs, great advice as always,

I like the idea of some wild rice once a week or so - I already do quinoa on occasion and am probably more primal than paleo.
I am taking supplements that I buy from local stores - usually Costco or TJs. Although, I am starting to think that a higher quality supplement may be worth the price?

Here is what I am currently taking (mostly because it is what I have on hand)

Magnesium: I am taking a tablet that contains 500 IU d3, 500 mg calcium, 250 mg Mag - My wife bought these from TJs on accident instead of the d3 I wanted
The label on this does say Magnesium (oxide, aspartate) 250mg

Fish Oil: Nature Made Fish Oil 1200 mg Softgels
Looks like 360 mg EPA and 120 mg DHA

I am almost out of the Mag, so I am planning on restocking soon - any recommendations? Also, when adding a supplement, how do you figure out how much to initially take?

[jimmylegs]

hey there!

when you go shopping for magnesium supplements, choose magnesium glycinate. WAY better than mag oxide.

aim for 600mg total mag daily. get as much of that as you can from food.
1c cooked spinach or chard will deliver approx. 150mg. a cup of brown rice gets you about 85mg.
mag foods and amounts per serving: http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tnam ... #foodchart

beyond dietary, you can add 200mg mag glycinate at the same time as the d3, and then experiment with adding a second 200mg of mag glycinate in any given day to see if your system will tolerate it.

with mag glycinate, I personally max out at one 200mg capsule per day. I make a point of getting lots of mag from diet. I have found that if I take a second mag glycinate in a day, it starts to affect muscle strength (outcompetes calcium which is needed for muscle contraction - I start to notice a slight weakness in the quads when climbing stairs).
with mag oxide, the tolerance issue is that it's not the most soluble or absorbable form, and just goes right through you. sometimes without the warning you'd appreciate :S

I definitely look away from the price tags when choosing supplement forms - esp. with magnesium.. what's the point of saving money to end up with a product that you can't absorb anyway?

as thx has mentioned, Epsom salts (magnesium sulfate) or mag chloride flake baths (or more concentrated topical solutions aka 'oils') are another option that takes the GI tract out of the equation.

food should still be providing most of your daily intake, for the benefit of interactions and synergies with cofactors. when you choose organic, you'll get a better magnesium density from the dark leafy greens (conventional ag loads phosphorus content at the expense of magnesium).

question about your water - are you city water or on a well? hard groundwater is a way better source of essential minerals than city tap water.

as for the fish oil - as I understand it, higher EPA blends are good for cardiovascular health, and higher DHA blends are better for nervous system issues. might be best to find a high DHA blend and alternate back and forth.

I think in a roundabout way I hit all your questions there hope it all makes sense!

[THX1138]

As a differing (but not counter) perspective regarding magnesium, I eventually ended up taking 2,000 mg per day of TRS magnesium for about 4 months and still had hard stools... until very recently. Now I can only take 200 mg - 400 mg per day or I run the distinct risk of becoming a close friend of the toilet.

During the last 1.5 years or so I have been using transdermal Mg, also. Weakness was not an issue either.

Mg deficiency is the norm and can be difficult to get over.

A doctor told me that people with ms are magnesium wasters.

My recommendations for oral Mg:
Swanson TRS Magnesium
Jigsaw Magnesium

THX1138

[jimmylegs]

I still don't know how you managed to take 2000 mg per day of mag glycinate! you must have been an absolute black hole for the stuff

[THX1138]

Ya, jimmylegs I was a Mg black hole that scored well within the normal range on the serum Mg test.
Here is how and what I did during the 4 months or so that I took the 2,000 mg of Mg daily:

Things that increase the need for Mg that largely or totally avoided:
1) meds
2) caffeine
3) sugar
4) alcohol
5) processed foods
6) sweating
7) calcium
8 --- "vitamin" D

To help avoid overly soft stools :

1) Took a highly absorbable form of Mg - Swanson TRS Mg glycinate
2) I took it multiple times a day.
3) I took it on an empty stomach

I also took

1) Thiamine (in the TRS Mg)
2) B6 (in the TRS Mg)
3) selenium

I didn't move much and still don't

One day I took 3,000 mg, but I sensed that if I continued to do so, my diarrhea-free state would soon come to a displeasurable end.

The doctor did say people with ms are magnesium wasters and I believe him.

[jimmylegs]

it's very odd that your magnesium level has steadily dropped over the time you've been measuring.
zinc has gone from bad to worse as well (with the exception of this recent bounce back from 66 a year ago to 76 recently).
I'd like to see what would happen to your magnesium retention if you got your zinc level up to 120.
refresh my memory - how long have you been doing the zinc picolinate exactly?
lastly, do I have a recent diet diary from you?

[THX1138]

zinc picolinate for roughly 2 years

no diet diary

[jimmylegs]

so. something must be going on there.

could be time to try a different form of zinc. here's one example
http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/solaray- ... tr3Bk0o7q4

you could also add your food/fluid diary to the ones currently in my inbox, if you wish

[THX1138]

could be time to try a different form of zinc. here's one example
http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/solaray- ... tr3Bk0o7q4

I just ordered the above it's suppose to arrive in about a week.

I'm getting real excited to clear up this zinc issue.
My zinc being at .66, which is the absolute bottom of my lab's normal range, and nobody at the clinic saying anything, is just another example of how mainstream medicine is totally clueless regarding nutrition. I guess they are too busy with the drugs.

THX1138

[jimmylegs]

let's hope we can get that number movin on up!!