Having a tough time.

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Marian99
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Having a tough time.

Post by Marian99 » Sat Aug 09, 2014 12:06 pm

Hello. So good to find some people that I can relate to. I am 62. When I was 21, I came down with rheumatoid arthritis. Later, I developed fibromyalgia. I never took a single medication for either illness preferring to go the natural route. The hard part was dealing with chronic insomnia; however I was able to keep my head above water through the years and trudge on. I took on a stressful job at age 60 which was a big mistake because it was during that job when I started experiencing strange symptoms. I am now dealing with burning pain going up the left part of my spine. I get strange nervous feelings with this. I also thought I had inner ear imbalance but now I am wondering if the imbalance is due to MS. My eyesight only worsened slightly.
I do not want an MRI or spinal tap. No one knows the long term results with such drastic tests. I eat very healthy and I have noticed that anything sweet including fruit worsens the symptoms so I only eat meat, eggs, nuts, veggies, and a little grain such as rice and corn. As long as I stay on this strict diet my symptoms are mild but, people, I want a cure!
Any suggestions???
Also, I have Dr. Terry Wahl's book on order. She had MS and is in complete remission.
I welcome any comments. Thank you!

ElliotB
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by ElliotB » Sat Aug 09, 2014 12:30 pm

"I eat very healthy"

It seems everyone's definition of eating healthy is different. One person will say one type of food is healthy and another will claim it is not. It seems few are in agreement when it comes to exactly what is healthy. While most MS diets promote that low fat foods, especially low saturated fat foods is the way to go, her diet consists of a high fat diet along with a lot of greens (veggies). She suggests consuming grass fed meats which tend to be high in Omega 3 (good) fat and low in Omega 6 (saturated fat) although to my surprise doesn't insist on this key aspect (I consider it a key aspect). BUT, the high fat approach seems to be working for many.


FWIW, I am currently reading The Wahls Protocol and you will probably find that following her program will be beneficial to you. You will find she suggests giving up some of the foods that you consider 'healthy' and she explains why. It is certainly to your advantage to follow her program at this point since you don't know what you have. But her program is good for anyone.


I have unknowingly been following the majority of her protocol for over a year and am feeling great.

Marian99
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by Marian99 » Sat Aug 09, 2014 6:13 pm

Thanks for your reply Eliot. I actually received her book in the mail today. Hopefully, relief is in store for me. I am glad you are getting good results.

ElliotB
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by ElliotB » Sat Aug 09, 2014 11:20 pm

Excellent timing! She has numerous testimonials throughout here book from people having great successes following her protocol. Hope it helps you as well!

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HarryZ
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by HarryZ » Sun Aug 10, 2014 5:11 am

Whatever is ailing you obviously isn't being "cured" by your diet. And from what you describe it's likely going to get worse.

The problem with neurological symptoms is that the cause can widely vary. There are several conditions that cause similar symptoms and unless you are willing to have tests done to rule out certain diseases you will never know what the problem actually is. So how do you expect to treat the problem if you don't know what it is?

An MRI is a painless test (albeit very noisy) and is one that can see what is going on in your brain. Although I wouldn't want to have dozens and dozens of them done on a continually basis, I think it is one that you really need at this point in your life. A spinal tap is not very pleasant but again it can tell a lot of what is going on with you.

Diagnosing MS isn't an easy task either. Usually several different tests and a detailed physical is required and even then it doesn't guarantee a diagnosis.

So you kind of have a choice to make here....get the proper tests and find out the problem or try several different diets and suggestions found on the internet and watch your condition likely become worse. You have a choice but I hope you make the right one.

ElliotB
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by ElliotB » Sun Aug 10, 2014 6:07 am

"...try several different diets and suggestions found on the internet and watch your condition likely become worse"


Actually, at least some of the MS diets have been proven over time to help (not cure). Dr. Swank, for example, had documented extremely favorable results from those with MS following his diet and even today, despite of its age, it is still popular and many report doing well with it. I don't believe that too many are claiming that diets cure, just for the most part that they can help. This is proven. The Wahls Protocol is much more than just diet, which is perhaps why so many people with varying illnesses are doing well with it. Ultimately, her program would be good for anyone!

Hippocrates, the father of Western Medicine, 460-377BC, perhaps stated it best:

“Let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food.”

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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by Kronk » Sun Aug 10, 2014 6:56 am

I would agree that a good diet could potentially help relieve symptoms however I would suggest that find out what the underlying problem is. The recent studies on diets have very poor results... Dr. Wahls, and Dr. McDougall both had extensive double blind tests done for over a year and the only benefits found were a reduction in fatigue. The only diet that has shown clinical results (albeit disputed results) was Dr. Swanks diet. I actually follow most of the recommendations of his diet now (no red meat, low fat dairy, 15g sat. fat limit and limited inflammatory foods) but even he stated that it is not a cure and that positive effects were not demonstrated until the diet was adhered to for several years.

A lot of people put faith in Dr. Wahls but you should know the whole story, she did chemo, electronic muscle stimulation, and took a cocktail of drugs every day. Her recovery was miraculous, but to state it was JUST food that brought it on isn't entirely true. MS is an awful and individual illness which I hope you do not have. What works for one may not work for another, so why not throw everything you have at it including diet, exercise, supplements and medication?

Best of luck to you, sounds like you have been battling a rough life situation for several years.

ElliotB
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by ElliotB » Sun Aug 10, 2014 8:42 am

Kronk, can you please provide link to the results of the Dr. Wahls, and Dr. McDougall double blind studies. I did not know they were out yet and would love to read them.

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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by Kronk » Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:13 am

Wahls was actually an uncontrolled study. So the researchers knew who was on the diet and who was not.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24476345

McDougall's
http://www.ohsu.edu/xd/about/news_event ... -fatig.cfm

Being that I have been following swanks diet for about 18months I am a supporter. However people like John McDougall, who is a very charismatic presenter, doesn't do the diet angle any justice. He does talk a lot of complete garbage. Much of the Studies he quotes are now 13 years old and many of them have been disproven or at least challenged. Many of his other idea's border on insanity....Heart surgery does not save lives?!?! Angioplasty "CCSVI" does not work either. He is a very slick promoter of his books, diet, clinic, etc.

Apparently Wahl's charges a fortune for her speaking engagements. I signed up for her newsletter a long time ago and i receive a non-stop stream of emails asking for donations and giving me prices to listen to recorded audio. While there may be validity to there ideas I am put off by the constant snake oil salesmen tactics... Swank's diet has research behind it, even though it wasn't a blind study the results would be hard to forge...

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HarryZ
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by HarryZ » Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:29 am

Actually, at least some of the MS diets have been proven over time to help (not cure).
Marian has a burning pain going up the right side of her spine, nervous feelings and inner ear imbalance. She really needs to know what is causing this so it can get treated in the best possible manner. Discussing diets and which one may be best for her really isn't a viable option at this point. Yes, in the long term good diet helps one's overall health but Marian needs a lot more than that at this point. Kronk has already pointed out the issues relating to MS recommended diets but Marian doesn't even know what's causing her problems so I would strongly suggest she put the diet aspect on the shelf for at least the time being.

want2bike
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by want2bike » Sun Aug 10, 2014 4:10 pm

Your perspective of diet seems to be appropriate. Your body will tell you what food work. If you are under a lot of stress that could be a problem. The only reason to do an MRI or spinal tap is if you want to take the drugs they will prescribe. If you want a doctor find someone who will look for the problem and not just cover up the symptoms with drugs. Dr. Bergman does a good job of explaining autoimmune disease. He tells us the path to good health is nutrition, exercise, sleep, and prayer and meditation. The one thing he doesn't talk much about is the many toxins we are exposed to which cause disease. He talks about the vaccines but doesn't say anything about the mercury which most people have in their mouth. In my case it was my teeth making me sick. Not sure about your dental health but that could be a problem if you have too much mercury in your mouth. If you can find a holistic doctor you would have a better chance of finding the problem.



http://www.flcv.com/periodon.html

Marian99
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by Marian99 » Sun Aug 10, 2014 4:32 pm

want2bike wrote:Your perspective of diet seems to be appropriate. Your body will tell you what food work. If you are under a lot of stress that could be a problem. The only reason to do an MRI or spinal tap is if you want to take the drugs they will prescribe. If you want a doctor find someone who will look for the problem and not just cover up the symptoms with drugs. Dr. Bergman does a good job of explaining autoimmune disease. He tells us the path to good health is nutrition, exercise, sleep, and prayer and meditation. The one thing he doesn't talk much about is the many toxins we are exposed to which cause disease. He talks about the vaccines but doesn't say anything about the mercury which most people have in their mouth. In my case it was my teeth making me sick. Not sure about your dental health but that could be a problem if you have too much mercury in your mouth. If you can find a holistic doctor you would have a better chance of finding the problem.



http://www.flcv.com/periodon.html
Bingo, want2bike! You hit the nail on the head when you said the only reason for the MRI and spinal tap is if I want to take drugs. I never took a single drug for the RA or for the fibro and I won't if I have MS or any other autoimmune disorder. I am a universal reactor and I react to all chemicals. Every drug I have ever taken contraindicated after 3 days even over the counter meds.

Thank you for the links and your information! After re-reading my original post, I realize I sounded helpless but actually I am unrelenting when it comes to finding solutions for my health. In 41 years of dealing with autoimmune disorders, I am not crippled in any way. I walk and do yoga for exercise and I constantly research diet and supplementation for better health.

Again, thank you for your post.

ElliotB
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by ElliotB » Sun Aug 10, 2014 4:42 pm

Kronk, it is important to understand the objective of the study, which was:

"The feasibility of a multimodal intervention and its effect on perceived fatigue in patients with secondary progressive multiple sclerosis were assessed."

And their conclusion addresses that objective, and favorably. The study was not analyzing anything else so no other results were reported.

The OP has stated her desire about not having a MRI/Spinal Tap. This should be respected IMHO.

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HarryZ
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by HarryZ » Sun Aug 10, 2014 5:30 pm

Bingo, want2bike! You hit the nail on the head when you said the only reason for the MRI and spinal tap is if I want to take drugs. I never took a single drug for the RA or for the fibro and I won't if I have MS or any other autoimmune disorder.
So how are you going to find out what is really causing your pain and symptoms? And where is it written that if you have an MRI or spinal tap and get diagnosed with MS that you have to take drugs? My wife had MS, had an MRI and spinal tap and never took any drugs ( did take an alternative therapy Prokarin for a few years)for the 36 years she had the disease. Nobody pressured here to take any of the MS drugs and her neurologist actually told her the MS drugs at the time (CRABs) wouldn't help and not to take them.

Think you've been listening too much to the fear monger here who gives a lot of false and incorrect information. Whenever you make a decision about what to do with your health it should be an informed decision and that won't be possible if you don't even know what the problem is.

ribeye
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Re: Having a tough time.

Post by ribeye » Sun Aug 10, 2014 6:23 pm

I was never pushed or forced into taking any drug for ms. Ever. I wanted an MRI to prove I was not crazy with my symptoms. The ms meds I have taken were by choice. If someone says a neurologist will force you to take a drug is full of it. You may be told the med will help and feel pressured to take it, but you cannot be forced to take it.

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