1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

If it's on your mind and it has to do with multiple sclerosis in any way, post it here.
Post Reply
THX1138
Family Elder
Posts: 714
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by THX1138 » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:11 am

I'm wondering if taking standard coenzyme Q10, such as this one: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0019 ... X0DER&th=1, but taking more of it, would be at least as effective and at least as economical as taking one of the higher-end types of coenzyme Q10. :?:

User avatar
Scott1
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 1476
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by Scott1 » Wed Sep 27, 2017 1:05 pm

Hi,

When I read the back label, it looks they like are relying on a black pepper extract to improve the absorption of CoQ10. My guess is , if it works, this product is supposed to act like an antioxidant. The bottom of the bottle points out this has not been subjected to any FDA testing. This is not what I am trying to do.
The antioxidant idea is fine but I doubt this CoQ10 is going to play any part in building up the electron transport chain. It may, if it is an antioxidant, improve fatigue.
Anything that limits inflammation, whilst not antioxidant, will work synergistically to control the damage.
Another example of an antioxidant CoQ10 product is MitoQ. https://www.mitoq.com/au/mitoq-5mg-caps ... __store=au I think their product is good for what it is but the price reflects that.
The CoQ10 I use will act as antioxidant primarily by "cleaning' the Vitamin E which mops up free radicals. It is still then able to enter the electron transport chain.
The problem is all these products are difficult to proves efficacy because it isn't possible observe every living example at work in the human body.
I'm comfortable that using a good product with CoQ10 and vitamin E works because I have seen my uric acid level come up from ridiculously low to back inside the reference range. Uric acid is the final stage in the metabolism of purines. If it is low then you probably don't have a great deal of ATP to call on. If its high you have gout which is not what you want either. (taking these products wont give you gout . Something else is going wrong)

You can try and see but as CoQ10 is a big molecule then absorption is low so you may need to experiment with different brands. Remember, I take a very large dose anyway.

Regards,

THX1138
Family Elder
Posts: 714
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by THX1138 » Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:42 pm

Scott1, are there any coenzyme Q10 products on the internet that you would recommend :?:
Last edited by THX1138 on Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

THX1138
Family Elder
Posts: 714
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by THX1138 » Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:11 pm

Scott1 wrote:Hi,

Did you go back to your doctor to see if can either come off Mesalamine or try another strategy?

Constipation is listed as a complication. Dehydration and constipation often occur together. The drug may not be the right one for you.

https://www.druginformer.com/search/sid ... ation.html

I'd be uneasy about following that link you posted suggestions on salt until I had checked whether Mesalamine is involved in this problem with dehydration

Regards,
I called the gastroenterology clinic today and spoke with a nurse regarding dehydration being caused by mesalamine. I told her about the info on druginformer.com that said there were 381 reports to the FDA of dehydration while taking mesalamine. She did some looking for dehydration having to do with mesalamine and also spoke with the doctor who did the colonoscopy. The nurse said neither she nor the doctor thought that mesalamine caused dehydration.
I still plan to withdraw from the mesalamine, but i've got to be careful about it and do it very right.

User avatar
Scott1
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 1476
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by Scott1 » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:25 pm

Hi,

I know it's how people shop these days but I don't buy supplements on the internet. If I did, I'd probably buy the MitoQ product but I would be using it as an antioxidant. If you can buy a practitioner brand on the internet then that's fine. It will also depend on where you are in the world. I don't want to know my product sat cooking in a box on a waterfront for ages either. Stephen Sinatra's books led me to apply a variation to myself. His website might be a good place to start. His message is similar to mine- you can't always trust the label. https://www.drsinatra.com/to-get-the-ri ... the-label/

Interesting but not surprising about Mesalamine. You showed them 381 examples and the two of them decided not to review their own advice. Their advice is based on one person asking the person who made the initial recommendation if the patient may have picked a fault. Not a great outcome for you. What did they say your dehydration was caused by?

Regards

User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 11998
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by jimmylegs » Thu Sep 28, 2017 8:29 am

the main side effects don't list dehydration. in context the reports i saw re mesalamine x dehydration were barely in the hundreds, out of thousands using it - less than two percent so definitely less common. correlation clearly is present in your case, but the available stats argue against the drug on its own being causative. don't have a counterproposal sadly.
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!

THX1138
Family Elder
Posts: 714
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by THX1138 » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:25 am

I called the pharmacist today and he said he wasn't seeing anything about mesalamine and dehydration except for in the case of liver damage where there would be yellow eyes, etc.

User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 11998
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by jimmylegs » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:54 am

get that liver of yours some zinc, man! here's hoping your levels improve soon.
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!

THX1138
Family Elder
Posts: 714
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by THX1138 » Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:26 pm

Tomorrow, I will start taking the Albion chelated zinc (60) mg per day and 2 mg of Albion chelated copper. Additionally, the Albion multi-mineral has 15 milligram mg of zinc glycinate chelate per serving. So that will be a zinc to copper ratio of 37.5 to 1, with two servings of the multi-mineral, 45 to 1.

The Solaray zinc with copper that I used to take is 50mg of zinc to 2 milligrams copper. As you will recall, when I took (two) of these capsules per day for a month, my zinc level went up very nicely and copper went up some too.

So:
Albion zinc --- 60mg
Albion copper 2mg
Albion multi mineral (zinc 15mg)
_____________________________________
75 mg zinc / 2 mg copper

User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 11998
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by jimmylegs » Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:42 pm

sounds good; hopefully you can get some tests near the end of october to see how well this regimen might work for you over the short term. i feel like i posted something similar a week or two ago though. don't let daily zinc intakes above 40mg drag on for too long!
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!

THX1138
Family Elder
Posts: 714
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by THX1138 » Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:18 pm

don't let daily zinc intakes above 40mg drag on for too long!
Starting maybe a month or so from now, what do you think of possibly taking 30 mg of zinc per day and 2 mg of copper every other day :?:

Also, should zinc be taken separately from copper :?:

User avatar
Scott1
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 1476
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by Scott1 » Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:52 pm

Hi,

Do you take aspirin?

Regards

User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 11998
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by jimmylegs » Thu Sep 28, 2017 3:15 pm

30mg zn per day with 2mg cu every other day sounds fine. i think you're fine taking zinc and copper together. i always want to see cu built into any zinc supplement. the one i am using now is 30mg zn and .3mg cu per pill. i'd rather see that, than have to buy a whole second container of a copper product just to get this relatively tiny amount desired.
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!

THX1138
Family Elder
Posts: 714
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by THX1138 » Thu Sep 28, 2017 3:22 pm

what is the product :?:

User avatar
jimmylegs
Volunteer Moderator
Posts: 11998
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:00 pm

Re: 1st movement after waking triggers violent muscle spasms

Post by jimmylegs » Thu Sep 28, 2017 5:20 pm

right now slowly working through a container of this: https://www.nowfoods.com/supplements/l- ... g-capsules

i don't know much about zinc monomethionine yet. the literature i've seen so far suggests it's great for farm animals. apparently we can expect longer, thicker wool among other things (in comparison to what we'd achieve using zinc oxide anyway).
take control of your own health
pursue optimal self care at least as actively as a diagnosis
ask for referrals to preventive health care specialists eg dietitians
don't let suboptimal self care muddy any underlying diagnostic picture!

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post