CCSVI and CCVBP

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.
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uprightdoc
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Post by uprightdoc »

NZer1,
I have recently been in contact with another former Rugby player who was seriously injured in a scrum just like you and developed subsequent neurological problems. Like your's, his case perfectly illustrates the affect of hyperflexion injuries on the cervical spine, cord and nerve roots. Hopefully he will grant me permission to use the x-rays.
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neava
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Post by neava »

Hi Dr. Flanagan


This is very over whelming, please be patient with me, as a lot of this i don’t know,

Its hard to know weather any of my symptoms are caused by this cyst, or chiari or MS,
The surgeon’s words were “if it was a problem with chiari the cyst would be in the first layer, your cyst is in the middle layer so it isn’t a chiari issue”
I asked him if you should decompress, as he can’t keep ripping my spine apart to remove them,

Is the fluid stress, is that like a blister in the spinal cord? Lol

Does any of these spine problems show on MRIs or is there any other type testing, is there anyone particular specialist I should see to get that ruled out?

I’ve added my list of symptoms, this is why it makes it difficult for anyone to tell me what’s going on, one NL told me to go on antidepressants and that there is nothing wrong with me.
GOOD LUCK,,,,,,, and thank you for trying to help me
My symptoms are,
Painful spasms along face, and chest,
Aching arms and legs
headaches
dizzy spells
vertigo
numbness/tingling
itchiness
burning hands and feet
chest back pain/ burning back
elbow arm pain
hurts to swallow certain food/ feels like food gets stuck,
weakness in muscles, heavy, sometimes cant lift a piece of toast
eyes out of focus
lightening bolts/stars in vision
pressure in head and neck, feel like going to pop
burning/numbness in mouth lips and tongue
Nausea
Fatigue
out of body sensation
wobbly
shortness of breath
urination problem, unable to finish
high blood pressure
spiked heart rate/heart palpations
concentration
slur words
difficulty remembering words,
urgency B/M, IBS
gagging during sleep
chocking during drinking fluids
flu like symptoms
hot spells
forgetfulness
fog head
sexual dysfunction
electric shocks
muscle spasms
tingling
short temper/fuse
down moods, depression
lack of motivation
buzzing ears
irritation to breeze
lifting heavy objects
bending/exercise
heat,
singing causes pressure
eating chewy lollies hurt back of head
turning head to look at children, while driving
Popping / cracking sounds in neck
ticking in head like a clock
skin problems
itchy feet
loud noises
balance, keep causing minor sprains to ankle
throat issues
burnt sensation when touch head, like hair has been pulled very hard and cause bruising
tension behind eyes
TIA??
lifting anything (bottle of milk) causes headaches and stiffness in neck


i have no xray on spine,
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uprightdoc
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Post by uprightdoc »

Neava,
What he means is that the Chiari is compressing the outside of the brainstem and cerebellum like a ring that is too tight. The cysts aren't anywhere near the Chiari. They are much further down in the cord and in the subdural arachnoid layer, which is the middle coat of the meninges (the protective covering around the cord). The subarachnoid space of the middle layer contains cerebrospinal fluid (CSF). Structural problems like Chiari malformations and scoliosis cause turbulance in fluids in and around the brain and cord. Turbulance creates CSF jets. CSF jets are strong enough to scour out indentations in the roof of the skull and syrnixes (cavities) in the cord. They can create cysts as well.

All of your symptoms can be explained in light of the Chiari malformation. Chiari malformations compress the brainstem, the cerebellum and the upper cervical cord. The upper cervial cord contains the long nerve tracts that connect the brain and cord together. An orthopedic surgeon can take x-rays of your spine to check for scoliosis or other general structural problems. All you need is AP and lateral veiws of the cervical and lumbar spine and an AP of the thoracic. One long 14x36 AP view of the spine is ideal.
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NZer1
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Post by NZer1 »

uprightdoc wrote:NZer1,
I have recently been in contact with another former Rugby player who was seriously injured in a scrum just like you and developed subsequent neurological problems. Like your's, his case perfectly illustrates the affect of hyperflexion injuries on the cervical spine, cord and nerve roots. Hopefully he will grant me permission to use the x-rays.
Looking forward to that. :D
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NZer1
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Post by NZer1 »

http://uprightdoctor.wordpress.com/2011 ... -dementia/
The term 'mild' in medicine always challenges me. A friend often speaks about mild MS and mild pregnancy.
I have a little difficulty with mild dementia and cog fog.
The rest of the post is brilliant as always Dr.
I am hoping to be able to have some xrays done soon and the comment about thecal sac indentation has me thinking.
All my MRI's show indentation and if the slice segments were closer I think it would be more reason for a good neuro to be alerted to a possible cause of my problems, because of History!
After reading your book and the posts and blogs it is becoming obvious that the medical world has a lot of catching up to do.
The blood flows ^v and CSF flow is overlooked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How do we wake the medical world to this important knowledge?
Regards Nigel
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DrDiana
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Post by DrDiana »

Hi Neava and Dr. Flanagan,

Doc, do you think the doctor was meaning that Neava didn't have dural ectasias? That would make some sense to me as to why they were in the "wrong layer".

I don't want to butt in on this case, but I couldn't help but think of ectasias.

Neava, some of my spherules started as fluid filled cysts, and left untreated, they went on to change to fatty cysts. Pregnancy hormones made one of my sort of balloon out (the one on my thyroid - I looked like a guy with an Adam's apple). But if these have been there for a while and they are still fluid only, they likely aren't spherules, and I bow to the good Dr. Flanagan's expertise. (Unless you are pretty flexible, have soft skin that bruises easily, or have joint pain, in which case, I'll want to barge in again. ha).

:)
Dr. Diana

Special interest in "brain drains" and how they affect numerous conditions, including MS, Ehlers-Danlos, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, etc. I am a therapeutic optometrist on professional disability with EDS, POTS, CCSVI, mast cell disea
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DrDiana
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Post by DrDiana »

Hi DrKoontz,
Thank you for the warm welcome. I love how everyone is like family here...
I'm looking forward to getting to know you and your work.
:)
Dr. Diana

Special interest in "brain drains" and how they affect numerous conditions, including MS, Ehlers-Danlos, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, etc. I am a therapeutic optometrist on professional disability with EDS, POTS, CCSVI, mast cell disea
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DrDiana
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Post by DrDiana »

Whoa! Neava, I just saw your list of symptoms, and I AM going to barge in.

Some of your symptoms are slam dunk high fluid pressure (CSF -- cerebral spinal fluid) in your head. Boy, can I help you with that! Just a few symptoms that jump out at me are the feeling of pressure in your head (do your ear drums ever ache?), tension behind the eyes (sometimes I swear my eyes are going to pop out of my head), headaches (do you ever get migraines? How about the headaches that are at the back of your head, go down your neck to the top of your shoulders? This is an IMPORTANT question.) Nausea, tachycardia, fog head (if the CSF is not draining OUT, we can't get proper fresh CSF IN), loud noises (ever have motion sensitivity?).

If you can help me with these answers, I may have a relatively simple answer to get you started. Cool? This happens to be the subject of a couple of clinical trials I'm just getting together, but I tried it first on myself, my son, and a few special people in my life. I think we're onto something...

I look forward to your answers. Hang tight, OK? You've got some good people on this for you, and I know it feels like you are completely alone. You are not. There are a TON of us out there, going through the same thing. I promise.

Someday, docs won't look at us like we are nuts. We're just not quite there yet!

Big hug,
Dr. Diana

Special interest in "brain drains" and how they affect numerous conditions, including MS, Ehlers-Danlos, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, etc. I am a therapeutic optometrist on professional disability with EDS, POTS, CCSVI, mast cell disea
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NZer1
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Post by NZer1 »

Dr D is there any way of checking CSF pressure other than lumbar punch?
It seems that many of us could learn something from being able to check BP and CSF pressures.
In my case I have low BP and when I had a botched Lumbar punch they said CSF pressure was 'good'. Yet for about 6-8 weeks I had horrendous head aches and lying down was the only way to lessen them, no drugs worked? I understand it wasn't the pressure that was a problem it was the multiple holes that were made in the thecal sac through incompetence that drained the pressure after the 'test'.
After reading Dr F's book and watching comments here I am much more aware of the blood/CSF interplay and alignment/posture/degenerative issues. There seems to be challenges with supporting evidence that is understood by mainstream medical people, yet there are soo many diseases that are effected/caused by this area of dysfunction.
It's good to have you here.
Regards Nigel
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Post by jimmylegs »

FYI in my case when i have low BP it's d.t. dehydration.

also, i had the LP headache. was in line for the 'blood patch' treatment (ie more holes in spinal columnm) and put myself on horizontal bed rest for three days to fix. which worked (whew) - it seems i had not stayed prone long enough after the original procedure.

LP headache can definitely be aggravated by the pressure changes from prone to upright position. staying prone really helped at the time.

by the way all this was during dx, and my nutritional status was *horrible*.

hth :)
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blossom
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Post by blossom »

hi dr.flanagan, finally got the mri report and will be sending the cd and report your way tomorrow. anxious to start nucca treatments as soon as possible.

dr. diana would like to converse with you about my case if you agree. i know your common goals are to help us the best you can. and for this i am so gateful.
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neava
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Post by neava »

hi dr diana
im so excited by your reply,
it is a big list, i also hav high lymphocytes, this has been high and rising slowly over the last yr,
i do have headaches in the back of head.neck and sometimes shoulders,
i do get aching ears, they buzz and feel whoshing noises, i have also when i lay down, my heartbeat in my neck and head,
i do have motion problems (it then makes my eyes go out of focus and then have trouble keeping them open).
nuasea, yes alot, comes and goes so fast,
when i get pressure in my head my breathing feels hard at same time.
tension behind eyes it more a pain, the only way to get rid of it is to sleep it off,
ive been investigated for heart problems, my heart speeds up, it also skips abit then trys to catchup, ive had a bubble study, xray of heart(which showed a small heart), 48hr event recorder, treadmill stress test, and then i had a event moniter, for a week,
all these tests showed, premature atrial contractions, and supraventricular arrhythmias, i was put on betaloc 23.74mg, (this made no difference)
fog head i do get,

UPRIGHTDOC

it has shown by mri that there is no overcrowding, and fluid flow good,
but what gets me, is the focus of hypertense signal within the pulvinar of the right thalamus, pons, right basal ganglion, tectal plate,

thankyou so much for the advice on the orthopedic, if it shows any problems, what will be done to correct, also is there a chance that it could stop these cysts recurring?
neava
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NZer1
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Post by NZer1 »

Just found this on another FB site;
http://www.wichiaricenter.org/oth/Page. ... 6#symptoms
Chiari Malformation & Beyond
CHIARI MALFORMATION

Chiari malformation is a congenital (i.e. present at birth) structural problem at the base of the skull that affects the brain and spinal cord. In fact it is not a malformation of the brain at all. More accurately, the lower portion of the skull, the portion known as the posterior fossa, is too small to accomodate the lower portion of the brain. As a result, a portion of the cerebellum called the tonsils is forced to protrude into the spinal column. This results in compression of the brain stem and spinal cord and interferes with the flow of spinal fluid. It is the compression of the brain stem and spinal cord that is primarily responsible for the symptoms. We have learned that compression that is sufficient to cause symptoms can occur even when the cerebellar tonsils protrude by as little as 1 millimeter.

Symptoms
Types of Chiari Malformation
Testing and Diagnosis
Treatment
Incidence of Chiari Malformation
Symptoms
Despite the fact that Chiari malformation is usually present at birth, the symptoms of the malformation are usually not experienced until adulthood, usually when the patient is in their 20s or 30s. Symptoms can develop sooner or later than this. Chiari malformation is often difficult to diagnose because the symptoms can be vague and so numerous that many doctors just can’t make sense of them.

The symptoms of Chiari malformation include:

Headache – This is the most common symptom of Chiari malformation. The headache is often pressure like and usually begins in the back of the head often radiates behind the eyes. Coughing, laughing, bending forward, sneezing or looking up can worsen the headache. Headache may be confused with migraine.
Neck Pain – often pressure like and radiating down the spine and across the shoulders.
Dizziness/vertigo – often worsened by extension of the neck
Vague pains throughout the body
Impaired balance
Clumsiness
Chronic nausea
Foggy thinking, poor memory and concentration
Frequent or urgent urination
Irritable bowel syndrome
Auditory Symptoms – ringing in the ears, decrease in the ability to hear or sensitivity to sounds
Difficulty swallowing
Changes in the voice – This can include hoarseness or the inability to regulate the voice when shouting or singing.
Visual Symptoms – including double vision, sensitivity to light, blind spots.
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neava
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Post by neava »

NZer1
you have done your home work, lol

also you have left out muscle weakness,

now what gets me is that the MRIs always state accidental findings, but your symptoms have brought you to be investigated, to me this does not make sence,
there are 3 types of CM, most people have type 1, type 2 is more uncommon, this type is called arnold-chiari malformation, then the type 3, is very rare, and in some cases it can cause death,

its a very serious conditon but no taken seriously by the medical world, times are slowly changing,

neava
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uprightdoc
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Post by uprightdoc »

Hello everyone,
High intracranial pressure (ICP) can be determined by presense of a budging optic disc. Adults don't normally get high ICP instead they get normal pressure hydrocephalus (NPH). Nevertheless, the brain can be damaged by NPH.

High ICP in normal adults is caused by traumatic brain injuries and tumors and srokes. Idiopathic intracranial hypertension is an exception but it is usually seen in young obese females. It is an interesting separate topic that I won't go into here.

As far as Neava's cyst is concerned I will defer to the radiologist who said it was and arachnoid cyst. An arachnoid cyst makes the most sense due to its location in the thoracic spine. Dural ectasia tends to show up in the low back. It is caused by tissue weakness that causes the dura mater covering of the cord to enlarge due to increased CSF volume. I have a picture of one of the pathological specimens I studied at the museum with a very large menigiocele (dural ectasia) in the low back. It was almost as large as the head. They tend to form in the low back because CSF flows downhill into the spine during upright posture. They can cause headaches because they can siphon too much CSF out of the brain and decrease its volume.

The cause of Neava's problems is the Chiari malformation, which may or may not be raising ICP. The symptoms, however, are not due to high ICP. The symptoms are due to compression of the brainstem and cord.
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