Phlebotomy anyone?

A forum to discuss Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency and its relationship to Multiple Sclerosis.
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Bethr
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Post by Bethr »

I've purchased a book, "Alan Carr's Easy Way to Stop Smoking".
Eight years ago I did stop smoking after using a drug called "Zyban". It made me feel, well, psychotic!
I've never had any type of antidepressant or anything before, and if that's how you feel taking prescription drugs, OMG. It was horrible.
But I also had no desire to smoke at all. I took it up again about 6 months down the track. I have no idea why, a stressful day maybe.

I hate being chained to the smoking, always have.
Thanks for the heads up guys!
I have no choice but to do this. It's the last straw......I'm so nearly back to normal.
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Merlyn
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Post by Merlyn »

I had quit smoking for two years, then went to Portugal to a bar called "The Real American Bar". Someone offered me a Marlboro, and being half drunk, I accepted it. Well, I am not a "chipper" the term they use for people that can have an occasional cigarette. A single puff and I am hooked again. I finally quit for good in 1994. Good luck, stay strong!
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Merlyn
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Post by Merlyn »

Well, my amazing former physician in Seattle came to see me! An international housecall! I mean this woman drove 200 miles, took a ferry... and had to return the same day, so this little visit represented at least 12 hours of her time.

With her she brought the machinery to do a bio survey with ZYTO technology... at the bottom of the page here, there is a video kind of explaining it. It is basically a very updated EAV technology. It took 15 minutes and produced a six page report. Dr. Lyn says that is remarkably accurate, and literature is claiming it is 95.2% accurate.


http://www.gotogodo.com/index.php?p=119992

The report is very very detailed, and I find it very interesting. It said my main problem is still Mercury, that I have all three types of Mercury on board, also barium and lead. This does correlate to my recent EDTA heavy metal challenge test... these were the metals that were showing up, plus gallium...

The report has a lot of information about various imbalances throughout the body. It says I have no vitamin K, probably due to the fact that I have no bifidus bacteria. It states that I am low in two different neurotransmitters, serotonin and l-dopa.

It states that I am not digesting protein properly at all due to lack of pancreatic enzymes. It states that I am lactose intolerant which is inflaming my gut. Dr. Lyn said I could probably tolerate pancreatic enzymes (they make me feel like they are digesting my gut) once I stop putting dairy products into my body. It also showed that I do not tolerate wheat flour, but I do not have a gluten intolerance, I just do not process white flour, I can eat whole wheat but not refined flour. My intolerance of the enzymes is due to continued irritation/inflammation of the intestinal tract.

The other major thing that showed was a lack of parathyroid hormone, which is screwing up my calcium metabolism.

It listed all of the parasites I have onboard, and all of the fungi types that I have onboard, although curiously enough Candida does not seem to be much of an issue.

It recommended colostrum (which I cannot tolerate)... although Dr. Lyn said it was because it is the best form of oral glutathione, and it is probably releasing a bunch of toxins when I take it. Therefore, take zeolite with the colostrum and it should minimize or eradicate any reactions. And of course, Dr. Lyn recommends that I continue to nebulized the silver/zeolite/glutathione...

It was all very interesting... the bit about the pancreatic enzymes was really fascinating to me. Years ago Dr. Lyn ran an Organix acid test on me through meta-metrics and it showed a lack of pancreatic enzymes back then in the year 2000. But I have never been able to take digestive enzymes due to the fact that it seems to digest my gut lining. But I gather that is due to inflammation... so the combination of this information... the fact that I seem to be lactose intolerant (I confess I have just been ignoring the symptoms) and a lack of enzymes is critical. I will never be able to tolerate the enzymes until I can get rid of the inflammation, but I did not know how to do that. I was suspecting gluten more than dairy products. So there goes my yogurt... and cheese. I will definitely test this out, get rid of the dairy for a couple months and then see whether I can actually handle some pancreatic enzymes. As Dr. Lyn noted, if you are not digesting proteins, you cannot rebuild your system. She suspects that this is one of the major problems with my health. My mineral levels seems okay, just a little bit short on manganese.
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jimmylegs
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Post by jimmylegs »

WOW merlyn, that is fascinating.

all of this stuff screams zinc to me, and did you note that earlier post about recalcitrant zinc deficiency linked to protein deficiency?

i'm amazed that you did not get a red flag on your zinc status when all the GI inflammation, low lactase, low pancreatic enzymes, low PTH, all have straight lines to low zinc, AND, you have recalcitrant zinc deficiency in your background.

i didn't read about the technology but can it estimate your serum levels? did you get a serum zinc result from this test?

it looks like a crazy catch 22 that i have not figured out as yet... you need protein to absorb zinc, and you need zinc for pancreatic enzymes to digest protein!
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Merlyn
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Post by Merlyn »

All of the minerals, including zinc are at healthy levels (manganese just a little bit low) according to this diagnostic tool... I was surprised by this, but on the other hand it has been years since any blood tests showed deficiency in minerals... however, many years ago I had two different amino acid profiles done, one urine, one blood... and I was major low in glutamic acid, glycine, leucine, valine, glutamine, proline and a couple others I believe, I would have to dig out the tests... then I did another test called an Organix acid test through Meta- Metrics laboratories and one of the things that it showed was a lack of pancreatic enzymes... however, through the years I have tried to take many forms of digestive enzymes and they all do the same thing... they make my guts hurt so bad I fear hospitalization... so of course I stop.

I believe that a few hospitals have started to use this technology (I had never heard of it and did some research). They are using it to do preliminary diagnostics and then follow-up with laboratory tests to validate/verify. So my feeling is I will follow Dr. Lyn's recommendations, continue to nebulize the silver/zeolite/glutathione and hope that it will reduce the heavy metal load. I am going to heavy metals test again after nebulizing this stew to verify that it is indeed removing mercury and barium etc. I will stop eating my dairy products, see if the inflammation of my guts reduces, and slowly try to introduce digestive enzymes. I started to take glutamine and that is going well. Glutamine is absolutely vital for the intestinal tract, and P5P is essential for proper utilization of glutamine.

Mercury is a zinc antagonist. I could not get my levels of zinc up until I got all my amalgams, 16 of them, removed. Heavy metals displace nutrient elements, and until you get rid of the heavy metals, good luck with raising nutrient level elements like zinc. Heavy metals are called heavy metals because they displace the lighter elements. That is why people who are mercury toxic generally have no lithium...

The Vitamin K is also necessary for liver health, bone replacement etc. For all of the different supplements I've taken over the years, I do not believe vitamin K has ever been one of them... I still have not finished going over this report, it also stated that I was deficient in thiamine. It is fascinating, Dr. Lyn has offered to get me/sell me a hand cradle so I could do some more of this testing at-home... I'm going to think about it.
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shye
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Post by shye »

Interesting stuff Merlyn.
The technician in my dr's office also works in several other practices. At one, they have a similar device, and he was trying to get me interested in it. I will now at least get more info, and check into it.

This might interest you http://www.realrawfood.com/article/iodine-and-chelation

A good Vit K supplement is Life Extension Super K has the K1, and K2 in hefty doses--Vit K needed for bones--don't you also have osteoporosis?
K also needed to keep arteries free of plaque.

From my experience, I'd highly recommend a serum zinc test, despite what you are told from this current test--a different method for sure of testing minerals.

Also, check Dr Kenner's protocol--he bases it on vitamin B1, which is needed for nerve health and repair.

Keep us posted...
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jimmylegs
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Post by jimmylegs »

hi m, what result did you have for zinc, if i may ask? (noting that normal is not optimal)
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Merlyn
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Post by Merlyn »

I believe that the last time I tested it, my zinc was 10.9... reference range 9-15 or something... it was low normal, but that's okay with me, zinc can suppress the immune system in higher amounts.

10 years ago I tested low in thiamine... it is one of the thiol vitamins, meaning sulfur vitamins... thus the "THI" in thiamine... Mercury oxidizes vitamin B1/thiamine, I believe the other sulfur vitamin is biotin, which also get screwed up when you are Mercury poisoned and that allows Candida to go nuts/proliferate... my bio feedback test recommended that I take even more B. vitamins, and I already take a whack of them.

I loved this ZYTO biofeedback test, and my Dr. has offered that if I buy a hand cradle for $150, we could do further testing at home. Any biofeedback test should be run every 4 to 6 weeks she says, because of the changes when you follow the recommended solutions.
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jimmylegs
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Post by jimmylegs »

heya!

oooh.. 10 that is quite low. my worst was 8.6 and i was a mess.

FYI 18.2 - 18.4 umol/L is the average zinc level for healthy controls.

here's an interesting snippet regarding the highest you would want to go in order to avoid immune suppression:

Zinc-Altered Immune Function
http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/content/full/133/5/1452S
"...zinc dose should be adapted to the actual requirements to avoid negative side effects on immune functions. Therefore, zinc plasma levels should not exceed 30 µmol/L ..."

so i guess for my 2 cents i guess i would suggest that the range for zinc ought to be from 18 - 30 (or possibly 25 or something, depending on what other high zinc effects might be out there besides immune suppression).

also with zinc, there is that tie-in to low ms uric acid levels... in my case when i got my zinc level up in the upper teens, it pushed my low 'ms average' uric acid level up into the healthy controls range too. awesome!

have you ever had your uric acid done to see if you're in the ms part of the normal range? i was bang on the ms uric acid average (194) while my zinc was low. now i'm up in the high 200s like the healthies :)

there's some interesting reading out there on the urea cycle and ammonia that you might like to check out - if you have not already done so.
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shye
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Post by shye »

my recent low test for Zinc was 4.8!! I am so used to feeling a mess, but I certainly noticed this! just couldn't figure out what the prob was til got the zinc tested (I was taking zinc supplements--actually got the test more to see if taking too much zinc 8O )--definitely a benefit to getting blood tested fairly frequently...
Since I am clearly zinc dependent (need much more than the RDA), I was getting a bit worried about what level to stop the supplementing at--was researching--so thanks JL for the link and quotes--having the 30 umol/L figure is important--(don't always trust the labs reference figures)...
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jimmylegs
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Post by jimmylegs »

yikes shye!!!

what is your protein intake like? could protein deficiency be causing your refractory zinc deficiency?

klenner protocol recommends high protein diet with 2-3 eggs for breakfast. i would not suggest that the klenner protocol is a long term treatment, but ensuring healthy protein sources is key.

klenner also specifies hemoglobin AT LEAST 13 (sorry cannot remember the units for that off the top of my head).

there is a lot of research out there linking protein and hemoglobin but they are all backwards compared to what i have been looking for - all of the easy to find studies seem to be about using low protein diets to reduce hemoglobin! not testing protein intakes needed for a minimum hemoglobin level.
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shye
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Post by shye »

Jimmylegs-
Part of the severe zinc problem I'm sure was the EDTA chelation i was getting--BUT I was taking 100 mg Zn per day, whihc would normally more than compensate for any removed in the chelation! yet ended with a very low zinc anyway--my zinc prior to the chelation treatments was just at the lowest end of the reference range, again despite 100 mg daily supplementation. I did the pyrolle test a number of years ago-- if your pyrolle count is above a certain level, need extra zinc and B6--my results indicated needed the extra. I have clearly not been taking enough Zinc!
(it is a problem of the zinc being taken out of the body by the pyrolles).
So, am increasing the zinc, and will get it tested (along with copper) more frequently in order to moderate how much to take.
As I said elsewhere, I also recently "failed" the Zinc taste test (Thorne's test)--no taste at all. Am doing that test every week--keep failing it, so keep increasing the zinc.
So I think the Zinc problem I have has nothing to do with protein--
and I do get enough by normal standards.

I'll have to go back re the Klenner advice re Hemoglobin--don't recall that part of the protocol. Since I donated blood a few months ago, mine is now (8/26) at 12.6. Had been 13 something prior to donation. Am sure it will go back to about that.
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Post by jimmylegs »

ahh yes i had forgotten the chelation work you have been doing. that would certainly help to keep your zinc levels well below optimal!

without an abstract immediately to hand, i can contribute this tidbit:

http://www.sram.org/0601/chelation.html
"Complications of EDTA Chelation
Early use produced complications because of high EDTA concentration-larger than 3 gm/L-and too-rapid infusion. Early deaths occurred from renal tubular necrosis, cardiac arrhythmias,and acute hypocalcemia. ... The trace metal most dramatically lost as a result of EDTA chelation is zinc."
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shye
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Post by shye »

The trace metal most dramatically lost as a result of EDTA chelation is zinc
well, we now know that is certainly correct 8O
Last edited by shye on Tue Sep 28, 2010 5:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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shye
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Post by shye »

Merlyn,
was reading this
http://www.enviroblog.org/2009/07/recip ... tants.html
and wondering if you use municipal water, and if it uses flouride--
might help explain your high lead....
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