chemo vs ccsvi procedure

vivavie · Post by **vivavie** » Tue May 03, 2011 7:34 am

Of all the people who did not have success with the CCSVI procedure, I wonder how many have had chemo (for ms or cancer)?

Chemo did not solve my existing symptoms but it did stop me from relapsing. It went from 4 to 6 times per year to zero since.

BUT putting poison in my body periodically during 2 1/2 years left my veins in my arm stiff and tight. When I extend my arms there is indents in my skin because the veins don't stretch anymore.

Is it possible the entire veinous system is not flexible anymore, it has lost its elasticity? Could it be part of the answer as why some people do not benefit from the procedure?

Maybe this has been discuss before, sorry if I missed it.

WeWillBeatMS · Post by **WeWillBeatMS** » Tue May 03, 2011 7:53 am

Good question vivavie. This makes me wonder if the restenosis rates might be affected by which MS drug someone has been on and for how long too. I've been on Tysabri on and off for going on two years now. I wonder if those who are/were on something much less toxic such as LDN or Copaxone are seeing better results at least from a restenosis point of view than those who took Tysabri or chemo?

WeWillBeatMS

vivavie · Post by **vivavie** » Tue May 03, 2011 8:19 am

I also did Rebiff, copaxone and tysabri, each for a few years but with chemo the damage to the veins is very obvious. I agree that all of those have very bad effects.

For some ccsvi the research they have the patients stay on their meds, I wonder if they do a category that never had immunosuppressants.

cheerleader · Post by **cheerleader** » Tue May 03, 2011 9:06 am

This is a very important discussion---and hasn't been mentioned yet.

Endothelial dysfunction, thrombosis and vascular disease are known complications of chemotherapy. Our dear friend who has been on chemo for stomach cancer is on blood thinners, to reduce risk of clotting. This is a common precaution for cancer patients.
link to clot information

This research suggests that platinum-based chemotherapy directly induces vascular endothelial dysfunction and may be a risk factor for the development of atherosclerosis.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21067421

In testicular cancer patients treated with cisplatin-based chemotherapy, we found an increase in plasma von Willebrand factor levels and in the intima-media thickness of the carotid artery. These changes may indicate chemotherapy-induced vascular damage and be of prognostic significance for the development of cardiovascular complications in the long term.

http://jco.ascopubs.org/content/23/36/9130.full

This needs to be discussed with IRs. I know of a woman who had radiation treatment to her neck, along with chemo, for thyroid cancer. Her veins were scarred, and she DID NOT disclose this to her IR before angioplasty. She now has three occluded veins. It is essential to divulge ALL medical history, including chemo, to treating IRs.
cheer

dania · Post by **dania** » Tue May 03, 2011 10:02 am

I had chemo and radiation for cancer in 1993. I believe both affect our veins.
By the way, I would gladly go through that treatment 10 tens than having to deal with MS. And, cannot say chemo and radiation was a walk in the park, but in comparison to having MS, YES it was.

vivavie · Post by **vivavie** » Tue May 03, 2011 10:02 am

Hum, very interesting Cheer, as usual!

I also had radiotherapy and curietherapy for my tongue cancer 15 y ago. This was always disclosed. What is surprising is that my "good" jugular is on the side of the previous tumor where a had most of the radiation and the neck dissection.

Chemo was 3y ago.

This is me, I wonder about the % of the others with bad outcome... or maybe some who had chemo AND good improvements can post?

blossom · Post by **blossom** » Tue May 03, 2011 10:47 am

they say i have ppms. i have never taken any so called mainstream med.'s for this. i did try ldn for 9 mo. and had no effect. collidial silver 9 mo. no effect. chelation interveinous 6 mo. no effect.

until i got high blood pressure a few yrs. ago. i have never in my life been on any other med.'s except an antibiotic for very rarely colds etc. and bladder infection lately now and again. i was on zoloft for about 8 yrs. which was wonderful for me while needed. but, weaned off of it when my mom passed away and i could not cry i needed to cry at that time. i did take an asparin "now replaced with nattokanise"and folic acid for the blood disorder "mthfr" that is said to make me more susceptible to blood clots and stroke or heart attack.

i take vit.'s i can afford and try to eat as healthy as possible and drink a good bit of water.

i was never diag.d with any vasc. issues. such as cholestrol or vasculitis etc. my vit.d level according to standards was ok. but i still take vit.d3.

i got ccsvi treatment aug.2, 2010. had stenosis which the treatment did nothing for the good and i actually am worsening faster. hopefully when i get my next doppler soon it will at least show flow.

so, in my case anyway, i can't say medications interferred with results.

BooBear · Post by **BooBear** » Wed May 04, 2011 9:42 am

I underwent chemo via oral cladribine for two years prior to treatment. I do not know if I have restenosed- we will find out on June 7.

I will say, though, that chemo changed my body forever. I am far worse for the chemo than I can ever say I benefitted from it.

bluesky63 · Post by **bluesky63** » Thu May 05, 2011 8:52 am

Excellent discussion point! So many of us have had infusions of some type, and who knows what vascular effects ANY of the DMDs have?

I think it could be useful to do a multifactorial spreadsheet and include past/current DMD use.

Personally, mine include Avonex and Rebif, then infusions of IVIg -- two days every three weeks for years. My veins were a mess for that period. But I have had enough time off the infusions that now people say my veins are beautiful.

Cece · Post by **Cece** » Wed Aug 10, 2011 8:32 am

cheerleader wrote:This is a very important discussion---and hasn't been mentioned yet.

Endothelial dysfunction, thrombosis and vascular disease are known complications of chemotherapy. Our dear friend who has been on chemo for stomach cancer is on blood thinners, to reduce risk of clotting. This is a common precaution for cancer patients.
link to clot information

This research suggests that platinum-based chemotherapy directly induces vascular endothelial dysfunction and may be a risk factor for the development of atherosclerosis.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21067421

In testicular cancer patients treated with cisplatin-based chemotherapy, we found an increase in plasma von Willebrand factor levels and in the intima-media thickness of the carotid artery. These changes may indicate chemotherapy-induced vascular damage and be of prognostic significance for the development of cardiovascular complications in the long term.
http://jco.ascopubs.org/content/23/36/9130.full

This needs to be discussed with IRs. I know of a woman who had radiation treatment to her neck, along with chemo, for thyroid cancer. Her veins were scarred, and she DID NOT disclose this to her IR before angioplasty. She now has three occluded veins. It is essential to divulge ALL medical history, including chemo, to treating IRs.
cheer

bumping this in light of the discussion in Dr. Sclafani's thread ...

AlmostClever · Post by **AlmostClever** » Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:18 am

V,

What kind of chemo did you have?

Thanks

jamit · Post by **jamit** » Wed Aug 10, 2011 10:49 am

No improvements, no chemo, no radition, but plenty of stenosis go figure.