Symptoms are pointing to a possible diagnosis

[clew85]

This is my first post and would love any feedback! I just had a baby 4 months ago and I have heard that MS symptoms can really get going postpartum. This could be the case with me.

I'll start with my first symptom. Eight years ago I got a tingling, numb sensation in the middle of my back, to the right of my spine. This spot comes and goes and can drive me crazy when it really gets going. I am 28 years old now and this feeling has gotten much worse in the past month and has spread. My right side of my body seems to have numb spots as well. Worse on some days than others. I feel it in my face, forehead, lips, check, and chin.

My second symptom was tightness in my chest. About 5 years ago I had the first tightening experience and felt like this was what it must be like to have a heart attack?! I had no clue until a week ago that there is something called the "MS Hug". The tightening is in my sternum and really gets bad when I am stressed. After years of dealing with this, I can now lean back and more or less "pop" my chest to relieve the pressure. Does this sound like the "MS Hug"?

My newest symptom that led me to go see a neurologist is an internal shaking feeling. I was lying in bed and thought either there was an earthquake or our house that we just moved in to was shaking due to the fact that it is 90 years old! I almost woke up my husband because that's how much I felt it. I put a glass of water on the edge of the bed and it wasn't shaking. I felt this shaking for about a week until I realized it wasn't the house, but it was me. I slept at my parent's house and felt the same sensation. It is now effecting me throughout the day too. Sometimes I still ask my husband if he is sure the house isn't shaking!? Even though I know it isn't. He thinks i'm going crazy!

I have had a few days where I feel incredibly light headed and just out of it. Eating or working out don't help it to go away. I am concerned about my memory, due to the fact that I taught kindergarten before I had my baby and can only remember 5 of my student's names. Could be baby brain, but I have tried drawing out the room and everything and still can't remember. It's very frustrating.

Also, are there kidney related problems with MS? My lower back, where my kidneys are located, hurts whenever I am dehydrated or drink any alcohol.

Am I going crazy or do these symptoms point to me possibly having MS? My have an MRI scheduled for next week of my spine and brain. I would honestly be shocked if nothing showed up, but who knows?


Thanks for taking the time to read this!

[want2bike]

Your symptoms indicate a neurological problem but hard to say which autoimmune disease you might have. It could take a long time for them to figure it out. Dr. Bergman gives a solution to all autoimmune disease. Might give his program a try. Will not cost that much and you may get better.

[lyndacarol]

This is my first post and would love any feedback! I just had a baby 4 months ago and I have heard that MS symptoms can really get going postpartum. This could be the case with me.

I'll start with my first symptom. Eight years ago I got a tingling, numb sensation in the middle of my back, to the right of my spine. This spot comes and goes and can drive me crazy when it really gets going. I am 28 years old now and this feeling has gotten much worse in the past month and has spread. My right side of my body seems to have numb spots as well. Worse on some days than others. I feel it in my face, forehead, lips, check, and chin.

My second symptom was tightness in my chest. About 5 years ago I had the first tightening experience and felt like this was what it must be like to have a heart attack?! I had no clue until a week ago that there is something called the "MS Hug". The tightening is in my sternum and really gets bad when I am stressed. After years of dealing with this, I can now lean back and more or less "pop" my chest to relieve the pressure. Does this sound like the "MS Hug"?

My newest symptom that led me to go see a neurologist is an internal shaking feeling. I was lying in bed and thought either there was an earthquake or our house that we just moved in to was shaking due to the fact that it is 90 years old! I almost woke up my husband because that's how much I felt it. I put a glass of water on the edge of the bed and it wasn't shaking. I felt this shaking for about a week until I realized it wasn't the house, but it was me. I slept at my parent's house and felt the same sensation. It is now effecting me throughout the day too. Sometimes I still ask my husband if he is sure the house isn't shaking!? Even though I know it isn't. He thinks i'm going crazy!

I have had a few days where I feel incredibly light headed and just out of it. Eating or working out don't help it to go away. I am concerned about my memory, due to the fact that I taught kindergarten before I had my baby and can only remember 5 of my student's names. Could be baby brain, but I have tried drawing out the room and everything and still can't remember. It's very frustrating.

Also, are there kidney related problems with MS? My lower back, where my kidneys are located, hurts whenever I am dehydrated or drink any alcohol.

Am I going crazy or do these symptoms point to me possibly having MS? My have an MRI scheduled for next week of my spine and brain. I would honestly be shocked if nothing showed up, but who knows?

Welcome to ThisIsMS, clew85.

Here is my feedback: Your symptoms are common to many conditions – MS is one, but there are many other more common conditions to rule out first.

If your GP or neurologist (or even your obstetrician) has not ordered testing to rule out a possible vitamin B12 deficiency, I suggest you discuss (with any of these doctors) getting a #1 serum B12 test, #2 serum folic acid test, #3 serum homocysteine test, and #4 a serum or urinary methylmalonic acid test (the urinary test is considered more accurate by some scientists). Do not take B12 supplements before testing as this will skew the test results. Ask for your own copy of the test results.

A B12 deficiency can develop at any time in a person's life, is linked to postpartum problems, tingling/numbness, chest pain, etc.

Signs and Symptoms of B12 Deficiency:

Tingling/Numbness
Sore Mouth or Tongue
Fatigue
Anxiety
Irritability
Depression
Weakness
Abnormal Gait
Mental Impairment
Visual Disturbances
Migraine
Orthostatic Intolerance
Chest Pain
Tachycardia
Difficulty Breathing
Edema
Elevated Homocysteine
Elevated MMA
Stomach and G.I. Problems
Blood Abnormalities
Neurological Lesions
Limb Movement Disorders
Psychosis

If you have a B12 deficiency that has progressed to actual anemia, any of the following symptoms (as well as a high MCV value on your CBC blood testing) may appear:

Cardinal Signs of Anemia Due to Vitamin B12 Deficiency:

Fatigue
Shortness of breath
Dizziness
Pale/yellowish skin
Swollen tongue that may appear dark red
Weight loss
Diarrhea
Numbness or tingling in your hands and legs
Muscle weakness
Irritability
Unsteady movements
Mental confusion or forgetfulness

By the way, alcoholic beverages deplete vitamin B12 - not good if you are even borderline B12 deficient. (The kidneys are actually located in the back above the waist, not in the lower back.)

If you are found to have a vitamin B 12 deficiency, it is easily and inexpensively treated with B12 supplementation.

You are not going crazy. A vitamin B12 deficiency has many neurological symptoms and can mimic MS. I encourage you to read the book, Could It Be B12? An Epidemic of Misdiagnoses by Sally Pacholok, RN, BSN, and Jeffrey Stuart, D.O. It is entirely possible that your MRI results will be perfectly normal; lesions in the brain and spinal cord often do not appear in the early stages of either MS or B12 deficiency.

All the best to you; please let us know how it goes.

[clew85]

Thanks for the responses. I do have blood tests that my Dr. ordered and one does test for B12 deficiency. I will be going on Monday and am interested to see how those come back. That would be great if it was just a B12 deficiency. I'll keep you updated. The symptom that really is driving me crazy is the inner shaking. It has spread to all over my body and keeps me from sleeping at night. One more strange symptom is that my right eye feels like it has something stuck in it. This is usually something tolerable, except it has felt that way for 3 months. I have only had one strange visual symptom in that eye, and that was everything appeared much more dim. This only lasted a few minutes. Eye drops don't help. I know now I am overthinking everything. Which in itself is not healthy! I'm just ready to feel like myself again.

[clew85]

I do have a b12 deficiency and my dr. Is starting me on weekly shots. I had an MRI of my brain and spine today, so I will update if there is anything there. I can't wait to start the B12 shots to see if they help!

[NHE]

I do have a b12 deficiency and my dr. Is starting me on weekly shots. I had an MRI of my brain and spine today, so I will update if there is anything there. I can't wait to start the B12 shots to see if they help!

The methylcobalamin form is the best, but may only be available as an injection from compounding pharmacies. The hydroxocobalamin form is next best followed by cyanocobalamin. Methylcobalamin, however, is readily available as a sublingual supplement which is readily absorbed.

[clew85]

The MRI results are in and I don't have any lesions in my spine, but I do have one in my brain, near my left ventricle. The nurse I spoke with said it could be the cause of some of my symptoms, but it doesn't look like MS. I feel like I'm left hanging. Are some lesions obviously MS and some not? What's the difference? I'm calling the doctor back for more details tomorrow.

[NHE]

The MRI results are in and I don't have any lesions in my spine, but I do have one in my brain, near my left ventricle. The nurse I spoke with said it could be the cause of some of my symptoms, but it doesn't look like MS. I feel like I'm left hanging. Are some lesions obviously MS and some not? What's the difference? I'm calling the doctor back for more details tomorrow.

Some lesions are more characteristic of MS than others.

Low B12 can be associated with periventricular lesions.
http://www.thisisms.com/forum/natural-a ... ml#p226718

Have you started the B12 shots yet? If so, what type are you using?

[clew85]

Here is an update on my newest symptoms. The right side of my face has had some tingling and numbness for a while, which my neuro said could be caused by the lesion they found. My right eye has felt like it has had something stuck in it for about 6 months now. The same eye has now been twitching for about 2 + weeks and my eyelid has started to droop. It seems to be getting a little bit worse each day. Along with the new eye symptoms, the numb spot on my back has been tingling like crazy and the internal shaky feeling comes and goes, but it is nothing compared to what it was in my first post. I have also been extremely tired and am napping any chance I get. Please let me know if you have any insight!

Thanks!

[clew85]

Here is an update on what is going on at the moment.
I have been seeing an optho neurologist for my eye issues and he ordered lumbar puncture. Yesterday, I was told there was a high number of white blood cells in my spinal fluid. I will be getting more results in the next few weeks. He said there is inflammation somewhere, but not to be concerned at this point. is this indicative of MS? What else can cause a high number of white blood cells in my csf?

[RuralLaundry]

Here is an update on what is going on at the moment.
I have been seeing an optho neurologist for my eye issues and he ordered lumbar puncture. Yesterday, I was told there was a high number of white blood cells in my spinal fluid. I will be getting more results in the next few weeks. He said there is inflammation somewhere, but not to be concerned at this point. is this indicative of MS? What else can cause a high number of white blood cells in my csf?

Hi Clew,

I'm hoping JimmyLegs will be along before long, he's pretty good at all the medical stuff. From a bit of googling high white blood cell count in CSF can be a sign of MS. I am a bit surprised by the lack of lesions on your MRI as with the amount of issues you are seeing it seems like there would be more. When I had Optic Neuritis and had my MRI done there were 6 lesions but I guess it all depends on where the lesions happen to be.

Has your doctor indicated he suspects MS at this point or given you any indication of a diagnosis possibility? It might be worth looking into an MS specialist in your area for a second opinion. They may be able to look at your records and say "This is a typical presentation of MS I have seen before" or they might come back with "This could be MS, but if so it's an unusual presentation" it might give you more information.

Also on the single lesion you did have in your MRI, from what the radiologist said on my MRI the lesions were "Consistent with MS or other auto-immune disorders" so I think lesions of certain sizes/locations might be more typical of MS than others but again some of the other experts around here would know better.

Best of luck!

[jimmylegs]

hey there just in from a couple of days away.

clew, do you have any recent bloodwork other than your low b12? wondering what the rest of the picture looks like.

if you have some mysterious inflammation as indicated by the WBC count in CSF going on there are probably a bunch of things you can work on. bloodwork should help clarify things a bit. many are likely to have been missed by the mainstream docs. but, the research is there to help you out if you have the interest in and motivation to do a bit of work on your status independently (with our support of course)

i disagree re not worrying about inflammation during the time that tests are not conclusive for ms. now is the PERFECT time to act, to do all that you can to prevent being pigeonholed in the ms round file (or any other round file!)

[clew85]

Thank you for your responses. I have been on bed rest for 5 days due to a horrible Spinal headache after my Lumbar puncture. I had NO IDEA that I would be down for the count for an entire week!!! With a one year old, this has been a challenge, but God provides!

I do not have any blood test reslults that have come out abnormal at this time. I know they took a lot of blood after my Lumbar Puncture, so I will update you on those results when I get them. One thing that did come to mind, is a while ago, a urine sample from a annual check-up came back with a high number of leukocytes and protein. There was no further investigation. This test was when the possibility of MS was not even on my radar. Any insight on this?

Also, i have been taking Prednisone for whatever is causing my inflammation, and have noticed a couple of effects:
The feeling of something stuck in my eye (which i have had consistently for 8 months) has greatly decreased. I also feel like my mental status has changed, in that I feel like I am thinking more clearly and rationally. I don't feel as "ADD" as I have in a long time. The rest of my symptoms are continuing as they have in the past.

I am in the process of getting an appointment with an excellent neurologist here in Dallas. I'm hopeful that I won't have to wait too long to see him.

Jimmylegs- Do you have MS? I think I understand what you mean when you say that I don't want to be pigeonholed in to the MS round file. As in, it seems people get told that's what they might have and no further investigation is done. Can you explain more what you mean by this?

I appreciate your support! This is a confusing time and I'm glad to know there's others out there who can relate!

[jimmylegs]

oh dear i had the post lp spinal monster headache :S narrowly avoided the dreaded blood patch with strict bed rest over a weekend. sorry to hear. don't know how you did five days of it with a little one!

blood tests will come out 'normal' more often than not. it's a big problem with many unfortunate and unnecessary consequences for patient care. patient levels are low 'normal', healthy levels are high 'normal', but everyone is 'normal' so why worry? when you consider that the normal range also applies to IQ, you can consider that having an IQ of 120 might be just as normal as an IQ of 80, but which 'normal' would *you* rather be?

applied to nutrition, it's essentially an issue of medical negligence that will be coming to the fore more and more going forward. the warning bells are already there in the published literature.

re the proteinuria, consider the following:
Proteinuria in Adults: A Diagnostic Approach http://www.aafp.org/afp/2000/0915/p1333.html

after reviewing that abstract, can you recall what else was going on in your life at the time, that might have caused them to consider your elevated urine protein relatively typical?

and re the high urine WBCs, did they specify type? was it eosinophils again? as a doc, when possible reasons are 'typical' they may discount, but if they result from things like childbirth, stress, physical exertion etc these things can all indicate a need for nutrient replenishment.

other than that i'll be interested to see your bloodwork results when they come back.

glad to hear that prednisone is having positive effects. i'd be paying attention to possible nutrient depletion side effects over the long term however. also, i'd be curious whether the prednisone was providing more of a band-aid solution to an underlying chronic nutrient depletion scenario. no matter what the illness, i always argue you can't do any harm by ensuring measurably *healthful* ie not just 'normal' and potentially suboptimal nutrient status.

i was diagnosed at the beginning of february in 2006, so i'm 9 years in now. you understood me perfectly - once you have a diagnosis and a prescription, there's little interest in looking further. this approach frustrates patients who want to dig deeper, for example patients interested in CCSVI, or ones like me. without my personal interest in the nutrition side of it and my access to academic resources, i would never have learned to understand the nutritional dimensions of my personal version of ms, would never have identified my various deficiencies and insufficiencies, and might not have done some of the damage i've done either - but that's only due to the lack of nutritional expertise available in standard health care practice, compared to the level of knowledge that exists in the scientific literature. one unfortunate fallout of this gap in preventative health care, is the volume of sometimes contradictory writing that has been done on the nutritional management of ms, which can overwhelm patients and potentially lead to the choice of a protocol that may suit personal preference, but fail to suitably address individual imbalances.

[jimmylegs]

one other thing - you might find this topic informative/interesting:
http://www.thisisms.com/forum/general-d ... 19575.html